Legalize Marijuana

The BBQ Pit
41

[QUOTE=Larry Borgia]
On re-reading I note that the OP says he is a junior in high school. This makes my dormant responsible adult gene kick in. Despite my argument for legalization I should point out that pot isn’t very good for you.

Although it may be less carcinogenic than tobacco, I have a hard time believing inhaling a lot of smoke is good for the lungs.
[/QUOTE]

There are other options besides smoking to take it in, such as consuming it orally (brownies) or vaporization (which is supposed to just give you the THC vapor sans all the nasty stuff in smoke). Legalization would make those options more readily available.

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If pot was legal, I’d smoke it. My husband would not.

A long time ago in a land far away (the 1980s) I was in a romantic relationship with a social smoker and his social smokin’ friends (OK, they were REALLY social). None of us…um, I mean, them smoked before or during work. If we were smoking, we were staying. We didn’t drive stoned, because we looked out for each other. I was the least likely to smoke, so I was often given the keys to the cars and asked to hide them or take them home myself if I stayed clear. It was a true social activity. The worst thing that ever happened in those days was that we’d talk about God and eat Doritos. The boys would get their guitars out, and we’d act like the hippies we wished we’d been (if only we had been born at the right time). Only none of it was an act. We were truly happy to listen to music, sing together, and take down the walls of conversation. I remember many of those conversations very clearly, though they occured nearly 2 decades ago. And I will remember forever that I never once felt unsafe with stoners. I’ve never seen anyone smoke clean pot and get “ugly”. But I’ve felt very unsafe around people who’ve had too much to drink, and I’ve seen the “instant asshole” when alcohol has been added. These episodes have all too often included members of my family. Though my stoner brother was always fun to be around.

43

Borgia, let me follow up with another arguement.

Allow me to begin this arguement by stating that I do not drink even a little bit of alchohol even though i smoke every once in a while. My knowledge comes from first hand experience in this arguement.

It is in my opinion that Alchohol is abused here because of the 21 year old drinking age. I am a hispanic (obviouslly - LaFuriaRoja) and I live in an upper middle class household with just my mother, so dont paint a mental picture of me being a poor hispanic… lol

By the time that I was 10 years old, alchohol was given to me as no big deal. As a result if i decided to drink, I was able to do it calmly and within reason. I have been to the Dominican Republic, where the drinking age is virtually non existent. And you know what I found… Even though many live in poverty… alcholics run in very small numbers… this is the same, i hear, for most countries besides the US. Virtually everyone in Europe drinks responsibly. (aside from the English and Irish ;)LOL) Yes, i do understand that there are many cases where alchohol is hereditary, I am excluding those cases, assuming that 95% of the time if they start to drink, addiction is imminent.

I bring up this point because I believe that in order to stop addiction, parents shouldnt imply to their kids that alchohol is an Evil, but teach them how to do it responsibly. You see, we are the victims of our own laws. It is in our nature as humans to want to do what we cant or are not allowed to do. (drink, smoke, etc…) If parents would wake up and understand that kids are kids and will most likely drink anyways then can help set boundaries. MY mother told me to never drink and drive or drive with somebody who drank… and I have stuck to that.

I brought up this point/story because if alchohol were legalized then people could be tought how to do it resposibly. The point of the matter is, life is short and we should live it to our hearts content as long as we do not do harm onto another.

The other point is an unavoidable one. Alchohol impairs more than marijuana, Tobacco harms more than marijuana and the nicotine found in cigarettes is 10 times more addicting than the THC found in marijuana. I will post links to studies such as the one commisoned and repealed by Nixon himself in the morning.

Enjoy,
LaFuriaRoja

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PS… i know that was a lazy, horribly organized post but im exhausted… too much BBALL practice… but you get the point

45

Yeah, I’m not trying to pass judgement or anything. I’m just saying be aware of yourself, that’s all.

46

There is a book I love called “Botany of Desire” that has a chapter on marijuana, which is probably why it is as well known as it is. Michael Pollan decided to take plants from several categories to see how our desires have modified the plants over time. If memory serves, he chose apples, marijuana, tulips and one other. Now understand, pretty much every culture has something that alters their perceptions, be it grapes (wine), poppies (opium), grain (alcohol), peyote (hallucinogen). This indicates that we like altering ourselves temporarily. We have always done so however the method we use at any given time/place varies. He chose marijuana specifically because no other plant in that category has been changed by its relationship with humans more. It went from basically being “a weed that grew on the side of every road” according to my grandmother, to hydroponically, genetically altered, pedigreed powerhouses.

He makes a damn fine argument on how the war on drugs has actually made marijuana more potent and really hasn’t done much to make it go away, it just went underground. Now, I don’t know about most of you, but that is not a world I live in, but I severely doubt that anyone doesn’t know a soul that smokes, whether you know it or not.

I don’t think the war on drugs has been any more successful than prohibition, except for the fact that marijuana wasn’t legal when it started.

Many people choose not to drink, many people would choose not to smoke pot. However, if marijuana was legalized personal choices people make about their usage would far more reflect the reality of that choice than it currently does.

I’m sorry for being so verbose, but my job is made more difficult DAILY because of alcohol. I can’t honestly say that I’ve ever had anyone who I thought might be stoned have to be thrown out, thrown to the floor, handcuffed or trespassed for life. I’ve also never been physically threatened, called a stinkin’ bitch, been told to fuck off and various and sundry other terms by someone stoned. All of that and much more has happened by folks who consume “liquid asshole.”

And I really, really hate migraines.

47

What kind of job do you do, Auntbeast?

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I believe she is a dealer at a casino.

As far as the legalization of marijuana goes, all I can say is that I’ll never smoke it. (I have strong beliefs about when body orifices should exude smoke, i.e. never.) My only concern is that of endangerment. You know, the old your right to make a fist ends where my nose begins.

But hey, it’s your body. You can do whatever you want to it.

49

My own opinion is that pot is illegal precisely because anyone can grow it just about anywhere and the government finds it far more profitable to keep it illegal since they have no real way to tax it if it’s legal.

I believe it’s all about the Benjamins.

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[QUOTE=catsix]
My own opinion is that pot is illegal precisely because anyone can grow it just about anywhere and the government finds it far more profitable to keep it illegal since they have no real way to tax it if it’s legal.

I believe it’s all about the Benjamins.
[/QUOTE]

Well, the same can be said for alcohol (i.e., homemade wine and beer, and bathtub gin from prohibition days, and general bootlegger stuff). They wouldn’t be able to stop all illegal growth, but it’s infinitely easier to spot than a home still. They’d definitely make money taxing the major growers.

51

[QUOTE=catsix]
My own opinion is that pot is illegal precisely because anyone can grow it just about anywhere and the government finds it far more profitable to keep it illegal since they have no real way to tax it if it’s legal.
[/QUOTE]

Yes, just like they have outlawed waitressing tips, coin-operated retail, and other cash-driven businesses because the IRS has no way of effectively detecting the income. :dubious:

52

I personally don’t partake (the few times I tried the only notable effect was paranoia), but I’m completely for legalization of marijuana. Mostly because it’s a waste of time and money for the police, the court system, and the prison system. Having grown up very near two extremely violence-ridden cities (Philadelphia and Camden), I can’t help but wonder how much lower the crime rates would be if cops stopped wasting their time hassling college students for getting stoned and started actually protecting the people and preserving the peace.

Also, I knew a guy in high school who got busted when he was searched at a bogus traffic stop. He was fined over $2,000 bucks, sentenced to hundreds of hours of community service, and since he was 18 at the time, now has three criminal convictions permanently smearing his name (Possession, possession of paraphernalia, possession near a school).

Current pot laws are just stupid and I’m convinced the laws are far more harmful to society than the “demon weed” is.

53

Despite my dislike for pot and my dislike for my loved ones smoking it (most people my age I know do), I think pot should be legalized for two reasons. First, I think the amount of money being paid for pot which goes to support organized crime is terrible. I’d much prefer that money support social programs. Second, if it’s legal, it’s regulated and safer. Some of my friends have smoked stuff that we suspect was not just pot - this is really dangerous. When the only option is to get it from untrustworthy people, you get potentially dangerous substances.

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[QUOTE=catsix]
My own opinion is that pot is illegal precisely because anyone can grow it just about anywhere and the government finds it far more profitable to keep it illegal since they have no real way to tax it if it’s legal.

I believe it’s all about the Benjamins.
[/QUOTE]

Factor in the money spent to investigate, arrest, try, incarcerate, and supervise casual users and the government is losing money.

How is it profitable to keep it illegal?

55

[QUOTE=Auntbeast]
I have chronic migraines and am not persistent or whiny enough to do what it takes for a doctor to prescribe me anything other than imitrex which makes me vomit and hurt worse…

…Guess what? I did my own little informal study years ago after reading about it on the internet. I took one hit of pot a night and ended up not having a migraine for over 3 months…
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I did the same study myself after tons of research on the subject of migraines. Imitrex (injection) does the same to me as you. The treatment is worse than the headache (which is saying quite a bit for migraine sufferers). Pot doesn’t do this at all.

I don’t care if it’s illegal or not. After 20 years of chronic migraines and all the treatments given to me by “professionals”, weed is the only thing that helps.

56

You’re talking about a huge industry that employs a lot of people. Pot is a pretty common drug, and the constant arrests and incarcerations allow these government bureaucracies from the local level on up to continue to justify their tax-driven budgets and they keep people employed.

I don’t think they’re willing to give that up for something that will grow in a closet with a lamp you can purchase at any home improvement store and a little water and thus be hard to tax.

57

[QUOTE=catsix]
You’re talking about a huge industry that employs a lot of people. Pot is a pretty common drug, and the constant arrests and incarcerations allow these government bureaucracies from the local level on up to continue to justify their tax-driven budgets and they keep people employed.

I don’t think they’re willing to give that up for something that will grow in a closet with a lamp you can purchase at any home improvement store and a little water and thus be hard to tax.
[/QUOTE]
You can grow tomatoes this way also but for some reason most people still buy them at the super market. Pot is grown at home by people mostly to get around having deal with shady characters and pay big bucks. If pot were legal and taxed about like cigarettes I don’t believe that home grown pot would be a big dent in the revenue to the government.

58

Quick post as I’m anxiously waiting to hear The Decider’s magnificent plan for Iraq.

First off, full disclosure: La Furia Roja is my son and I am damn proud of him. See, I’m RedFury and…well you do the the math. Or is that translation? Go figure. Anyway, just got back from Fla., saw him a couple of days ago and love him and miss him to death. With that out of the way…

If at all possible be gentle with the young man for I’d both told him I’d subscribe him if his interest held and, secondly, I really think that it would do him a ton of good to stick around in terms of learning proper debate form as well as – hopefully, unlike his old man most of the time – becoming flexible enough to recognize when and how his arguments run out of steam. No doubt this post will cast a bit of embarrassment to RedJr. because, believe it or not, I still remember that at about his age, my own Dad was no longer the idol I held to be. Then again, only in one’s mind can someone be that perfect – life has a habit of intruding with perfection.

Afraid that;s all I have time have for for the moment. Like I said, The Decider’s up.

As for my son’s OP, I’ll opine in depth at a later time. For now let’s just say that 1-I decided a long time ago to be as honest as I could with him no matter the topic. Obviously, pot was one of said topics, and 2-While not in total agreement and and more than a bit worried about the illegal aspect of the substance in discussion, I “just” happen to agree with most of what he’s written. Especially if he maintains that 3.6 GPA at the gifted school he’s currently attending.

MIT is just around the corner. Literally. They are after him.

Gosttta go. Ya know, The Decider etc.

Pardon the bragging but he’s worth it. To me anyway.

Cheers.

59

[QUOTE=RedFury]
First off, full disclosure: La Furia Roja is my son and I am damn proud of him. See, I’m RedFury and…well you do the the math. Or is that translation? Go figure. Anyway, just got back from Fla., saw him a couple of days ago and love him and miss him to death. With that out of the way…
[/QUOTE]

Cool post Red Sr..

I’m still firmly in the “Legalize them all and tax the shite out of them” camp. A long time ago I read a book called The Emperor Wears No Clothes by Jack Herer which showed that in areas that had decriminalized marijuana possession there was a short term spike in use, but that after the initial rush overall use actually lowered since it took away part of the thrill of smoking something illegal and “underground”. Then again, Jack Herer isn’t exactly an unbiased source on legalizing the ol’ MJ.

I do think that it’s just a matter of time before it does happen on some scale and that those will be some fun times when it does, and that it could cause a decrease in hard drug useage. It’s my personal belief that MJ is only a gateway drug insofar that once someone decides that they like altered states on a regular basis they’ll start to go for something more discreet (not in terms of behavior, but in terms of obviousness of consumption). Weed is a bust. It’s smoky, distinct in odor, and bulky to carry. Something like powder form coke OTOH has no descernable odor, can be done in a bathroom stall without setting off fire alarms, and you can carry a party sized amount in a small glass vial. Take away the stigma and perhaps more people will just stick with a J or two.

60

[QUOTE=dmatsch]

I don’t care if it’s illegal or not. After 20 years of chronic migraines and all the treatments given to me by “professionals”, weed is the only thing that helps.

[/QUOTE]

Have you tried LSD?
http://www.maps.org/research/cluster/psilo-lsd/

No foolin’. Go MAPS!!