You know, the thing is that these are the kind of parents that, even if Terri were to gain consciousness tomorrow and tell them off for ignoring her wishes, they’d basically lay a guilt trip on HER! “We worked so hard to keep him from killing you! The least you can do is appreciate our efforts instead of undermining us.”
You don’t think they’re suffering now? Which would be worse for them - a trip through the stages of mourning, followed by eventual acceptance, or to spend the rest of their lives having their hopes raised, then dashed, raised, then dashed, at the whim of every quack with something to sell? Like it or not, death and mourning are part of the human condition, and to allow them to delay the process forever will not help them. In my opinion, it’s only making their lives that much worse.
Suppose Terri Schiavo had disappeared fifteen years ago. One moment she’s there, the next she’s gone. Eight years after her disappearance, Michael Schiavo decides to declare her legally dead, and her parents protest. They refuse to believe that their daughter is gone. For the next seven years, they consult private eyes and psychics, anyone who will give them the slightest shred of hope. They appear on tv, pleading for their daughter to return to them. Then there’s a break in the case. A body has been discovered. The police think it could be Terri, and want to do DNA testing to make sure, but the parents fight against it. They don’t want to know that their daughter is dead. They would rather spend the rest of their lives searching for her.
Which do you think is better for them? To spend their lives waiting for a miracle that will never come, to spend all of their money and all of their time searching for a daughter who will never come home? Or to confront the truth, deal with the pain of her death, and learn to go on with their lives? What about Michael? He’s gone through the motions of moving on, but yet he’s left with the mystery and the doubt. How can he heal if he never knows the truth?
Mourning is not the end of the world. It is not the ultimate suffering. It is a necessary step on the road to healing. Sooner or later, we all lose someone. We all grieve. But we nearly always recover. Grief is part of life. The more we try to avoid it, the more we hurt ourselves. It’s time for the Schindlers to return to their daughter, be by her side as she passes, and learn to live without her.
Yeah, it was harsh. I regret calling him a “dick”. He loved her and is honoring her wishes. I guess I should have just said that if I were in his position I’d do something different, I think. The whole affair is just sad. Hopefully this will work out for the best for everyone involved.
Of course, in the real world no one with a shred of credibility would use a psychic in the Schiavo case.
Yep, FOX news has no shred of credibility. 
And of course, as others have mentioned, it’s not just the parents who are delusional. I’ve seen her brother and at least one sister (are there two sisters?), and an aunt and uncle all on TV, just like the parents, certain that Terri is suffering and that she’ll recover somehow if Bush would just step in.
What about the Schindler’s other relatives and friends? Neighbors? Acquanitances? Doctors? Is there no one on their “side,” so to speak, who, in the last 15 years, hasn’t pulled them aside and said, “Look, this is it. She’s in a PVS and just isn’t going to get any better.” Have they cut those people out of their life?
As if this case isn’t fucked up enough, the Miami Herald is reporting that the state police and the local cops were nearly in a showdown when “someone” in the state government ordered a rescue mission to seize Terri and put her in custody of the DCF. Fortunately the local cops told state to fuck off, they were gonna uphold the judge’s order. Here’s a link to the Detroit Free Press’s article:
Apparently they were gonna use a loophole in Florida law that would’ve let public agencies freeze a judge’s order when it’s appealed by said agency. Which to me sounds ridiculous, but what do I know about Florida law?
Of course Gov. Jeb’s office claims there was no showdown, they’re all about the law, blah di blah. The Herald has three different sources who spoke on condition of anonymity.
Perhaps surprising no one, this doesn’t appear to have been picked up by CNN, FOX et al. :rolleyes:
Thank you Siege for answering this question. Operations Rescue, one of the most activist anti-abortion issue, is trying to expand it’s targets. I don’t know if it’s just a fund-raising, limelight stunt, but they are true believers so they probably believe in it completely.
Actually the Fundamentalist Right seems to be trying to create a movement they call “The Culture of Life”, tying in abortion (the murder of innocent babies :rolleyes: ) with the Schiavo case (the state-sanctioned murder of a healthy young woman :rolleyes: )
You are right. I should never have ventured into the pit. I am not the smartest person around. I went way in over my head here. I regret ever posting here in the pit as I had a very cursory knowledge of the case. I cede the argument to those here who have more knowledge of this case.
zuma, don’t be afraid to express your opinion. I said something similar a couple of pages back. It didn’t go over well, but I ended up with a better understanding of Michael’s motives.
Dopers need to feel they can raise a dissenting opinion, even in the Pit.
You’re okay, and plenty smart enough.
While we’re on the subject of disregarding wishes to make others happy, why not rent out her body as a sex object, like in Kill Bill? She doesn’t know the difference, what does it matter what her wishes were? She’d be “cherished” by many people that way too. :rolleyes:
As was pointed out earlier, it’s ultimately best for the Schindlers that they get to mourn her death and move on, instead of spending the next 15 or 20 years being suckered in by quack doctors and false hopes.
I am pretty solidly agnostic. I have no idea what will happen when I die. It sure seems to me that one of the purposes of having a faith is to provide comunity and comfort at times of loss.
It sort of astounds me a bit that a group of those who profess to believe that there is somewhere we go when we are done, and it is a much better place are fighting so hard to keep Terry out of heaven. I do know that this strange idea is not universal among Christians though. In this article, Charles Henderson, a Presbyterian minister and Christianity Guide for About.com says this,
I sometimes wish I believed in prayer, but i will just have to settle for my good wishes. I completely disagree with, and disaprove of everything the Schindlers have been doing for the last several years, but I hope their faith is strong enough to start providing the comfort and healing over the next few weeks and months.
On an unrelated note, did anyone else happen upon this?
- bolding mine
Jesus, i’ve heard some fucking stupid arguments in the Schiavo case, but this one just about takes the cake.
This whole issue isn’t being decided for the benefit of the parents. Hell, even they themselves aren’t deluded enough to make that argument. The case is being debated based on what’s best for the woman at the center of the issue—Terri Schiavo herself. Her parents have continually made clear that they claim to be looking out for Terri’s welfare and interests in this case; the courts have decided, on multiple occasions, that her welfare and interests are served by following her own wishes, which were not to be kept alive under such circumstances.
And, in case it’s slipped by your notice, she is not, in fact, “a loving house plant.” She is a person who will never be in anything but a vegetative state, and who, the courts have determined, made quite clear her wish not to be in such a state. You said it yourself in your first paragraph: Terri’s wishes come first, then her husband’s and, only after that, do her parents’ wishes become relevant. Since the courts can determine (and have determined) what Terri’s wishes were, and what her husband’s wishes are, that should be all that is required, especially when those two sets of wishes are apparently the same.
Do you truly believe that having Terri as a “loving house plant” to feed and water would really be in the best interests of her mother’s long-term mental health? I’m no psychologist or psychiatrist, and i’d welcome some professional input on this, but i really find it hard to imagine that you’re correct about this.
Well, given your arguments in this case, it seems like you’ve already got your wish.
Ooh, BURN!
You got something against people who aren’t as mentally adept as yourself ?
Right now, she is bleeding from her tongue and eyes, and her skin is falling off. Doesn’t sound very peaceful, to me.
Not at all. Anyway, i’m not the standard by which mental adeptness need be judged. Also, that remark was more a matter of opportunity than anything else; it looked like a chance to make a sarcastic remark, and i took it. A nice thing to do? Probably not; but i’ve never claimed to be perfect.
Actually, i get frustrated not by people who are less mentally adept, but by people who have shown that they are (or can be) mentally adept, and yet who make completely ridiculous arguments. Which is exactly what i thought of your idea of keeping a woman as a house plant just to keep the parents happy. YMMV.
Who told you this? Bob Schindler?
What is inherently not peaceful about bleeding? She is going to die of something, and even with the bleeding mucosa, withholding nutrition is much more peaceful than pneumonia.
And you think it’d have been brought up in the appeals instead of the absurd claim that she spoke.
“Doctors have said the 41-year-old woman would probably die within a week or two of the tube being removed. By Friday, dehydration was taking its toll. Terri Schiavo’s tongue and eyes were bleeding and her skin was flaking off, Weller said.”