Levitation in magic

Factual Questions
1

Forget David Blaine and his Balducci levitation. And forget levitation using an S-bar (so you can pass the hoop around the person and back again).

How do magicians like David Copperfield pass the hoop around the body in one pass? I’m thinking there might be something fishy about the hoop.

When the levitated person moves over the audience, I’m assuming wires are involved.

I’ve heard crap like it’s all done underwater in some giant tank (wtf?) and Copperfield can hold his breath the whole time. That’s definitely not the way it’s done.

Any help? Or are all in the know bound by the magician’s code? Someone must know and not care about revealing the secret(s).

  • s.e.
2

Hi scott evil. I’ll just point out the same thing I point out every time someone asks about how magic stuff is done. The people who know won’t tell (and certainly not on a public forum like this). The people who will volunteer an answer don’t really know, and so their answers will be guesses and speculation. This especially applies to people who have seen so-called ‘exposure’ shows on TV and therefore think they know how such-and-such is done. Trust me, not so. The ‘exposure’ shows are very misleading!

All of which just goes to show that asking about how magic tricks are done here on the SDMB is a bit of a waste of time.

3

Hey, ianzin, add “killjoy” to your sig line. :smiley:

4

We have a number of illusionists here, one or more of whom will be by to tell you how any given trick could have been done. This is not to say that a given magician actually used that specific technique to create that illusion.

Gaps in hoops are common, as are angled wires or lines of sight which make it appear that the hoop passed completely around the levitatee. Also, it is not unheard of for the hoop to be on the flight wire before the hoop is brought in form offstage.

5

I hope you’re not talking about when David Copperfield ‘flies’, and two hoops come in and do a kind of rolling crossover effect. Because that particular illusion is pretty easy to figure out.

6

Ouch! Gee, sorry Gatopescado if you think I’m spoiling anyone’s ‘joy’ or fun! I was really just trying to paint it the way it is, so’s good SDMB folk don’t either waste their time or believe stuff that ain’t true! Besides, we magicians provide joy, we don’t kill it!

Okay, the truth about the floating girl is, just before the curtain goes up and they start the trick… she swallows an awful lot of helium.

(And that’s as accurate as anything you’ve ever seen on the ‘Masked Magician’ shows.)

7

To be quite honest, I think all of David Copperfield’s tricks are pretty easy to dope out. The only reason I even watch his specials is to mentally dissect 'em – I don’t find him the least bit entertaining.

Penn & Teller, on the other hand, never fail to leave me scratching my head.

8

::Gasp!:: You don’t mean the masked magician wasn’t telling the truth do you? And here I thought the only reason we didn’t see him again was that he was in the witness protection program. Mwahahahahahahaha!!! :wink:

9

Many of the devices used are patented. If you’re willing to search the patent files for a bit, you’ll find what you’re looking for.

The device Mr. Copperfield uses is in there.

10

Um, that should be “The device Mr. Copperfield uses to fly is in there.”

11

Wah, wah. Cecil has already revealed the secret of Copperfield Statue of Libety “diappearance” here. I’m pretty confident he could get to the bottom of this levitation crap. Besides, the Statue of Liberty secret was leaked long before I even knew of the SD.

Anyway, from my research, I’ve seen several weird theories. One is that he drinks some kind of toxic magnetic milkshake (offset by a gallon of Pepto-Bismol and a lot of Zantac or whatever), then dons some chain-mail thing under his shirt, and an electromagnet lets him levitate.

I’ve also heard he’s replaced by a helium baloon in his likeness. That is crap.

The most plausible explanation I’ve found is that he’s attached by several wires to his waist, which allow him to “levitate,” and that the top of the plexiglass box he goes into has reasonable gaps to permit the wires to enter. The hoops, I’ve read, are produced around him using an optical illusion using rotation (which I still have to figure out).

Anyway, for all anyone says about “magic” being “magic,” I have more admiration for illusionists when I actually find out how they did it. I don’t care about some Magician’s Code. I just want to know.

I always wondered about the “Zig-Zag Lady” when I was young, and when the secret was revealed on one of those “Masked Magician” shows, I knew I had been right all along.

Sorry, but it’s not “magic.” It’s illusion. Idiots can sit there thinking, “Wow, he really did fly,” but I’m not that stupid, thank-you-very-much. Give me the Straight Dope and I’ll admire you more for it. IMO, knowing the secret doesn’t affect the effect on spectators. It’s all still pretty spectacular, and as I said, I admire the ingenuity behind these kinds of illusions - but only once I know how they’re done. I know how the Great Wall of China thing was done, as well, along with everything that f-up David Blaine has done.

  • s.e.
12

Did he really spend 35 hours up on the pillar?

(check one)

–Yes.
–No.
–Maybe.

13

*I don’t know, can you repeat the question?

YOU’RE NOT THE BOSS OF ME NOW
YOU’RE NOT THE BOSS OF ME NOW
YOU’RE NOT THE BOSS OF ME NOW
and you’re not so big

YOU’RE NOT THE BOSS OF ME NOW
YOU’RE NOT THE BOSS OF ME NOW
YOU’RE NOT THE BOSS OF ME NOW
and you’re not so big

Life is unfair…[i/]

Screw all this “if we were to reveal our secrets, the audience would no londer believe in magic” crap. The average audience to magic shows is probably too stupid to know how illusions are done. So they oooh and aaah. You get your desired reponse, and your money, but be aware that a lot of us know that those people “you’ve never met” in the audience are plants. Idem for identical twins you use onstage. In fact, those assistants are more than just eye candy, but help conceal a lot of your apparati - your mirrors (that’s such an old one - let it go), the fake black background to hide whatever (let it go), slowly moving an audience on a platform to make something disappear (let it go), moving through apparently inpenetrable walls (what a load of crap - I know how it was done).

You cannot levitate, dude. You’re attached to wires. Maybe four, maybe 17, based on my research. You’ll have more respect from me when I find out the truth. I’ve always had more respect from illusionists (or whatever you what to call yourselves) when I’ve figure out how the illusions are done. Only then can I admire the ingenuity and creativity behind that stuff we see on TV, or live.

  • s.e.
14

It’s not all inaccurate. On the most recent episode, they revealed a method for passing a buzzsaw through the middle of a person who lays flat on a table. (I won’t say how they did it, but it’s not hard to guess.)

A few days later I saw an old episode of I’ve Got a Secret from the 60s on Game Show Network. They performed the same trick with the assistance of The Amazing Randi, and a change of camera angles revealed (inadvertantly) that they used the same method.

15

Yeah, I think it’s interesting to see how a trick is done sometimes. I remember a couple years ago, I saw Penn and Teller on some late-night talk show and they were doing a trick where they had thtower of blocks sitting atop a long base and Teller would step in side so his face could be seen in one block, his hand in another, his foot in one down below–you get the idea. Then Penn would close the windows and reaggange the blocks along this base so it looked like Teller was getting all jumbled up. Look, his fot is over here, and his hand is right below it! How did his head get over there?

Immediately following that, they did the same trick again. But this time the blocks and base were made of clear plastic. And as you watch, you see exactly how it was done: you see Teller scampreing around like mad shooting back and forth through this base to get himself in some weird position so that when Penn opens the door, it looks lik he’s all mixed up.

The first time through, I appreciated it because it was a cool magic trick. The second time when the secret was revealed, I appreciated it even more because it was quite a little athletic feat for Teller to slither through this tunnel nd then twist himself into position just in time for Penn to open the doors.

That all said, I also sometimes just enjoy not knowing exactly how things are done. There’s a certain nice feeling in not knowing how David Copperfield is “flying” or how David Blaine finds the right card and then sticks it to the inside of a window. It’s nice to suspend disbelief every once in a while.

16

scott evil magicians do not prefer to keep methods dark because we hope people will thereby ‘believe in magic’. Intelligent audiences know they are seeing tricks, and we know they know. That is not the point, and rarely ever has been. The point is that we are trying to create entertainment, part of which derives from witnessing something which seems impossible, and which (hopefully) can provoke feelings of wonder, intrigue, amazement, astonishment, surprise and fun… or all of these!

If the audience know from the outset ‘how it’s done’, then these aspects of the entertainment are diluted or removed altogether. You cannot experience an ‘ooh!’ moment of astonishment if you know the method. There may still be plenty left to admire and enjoy - the skill of the performer (which you seem to like above all else), or his sense of humour, or his presentation. But we magicians want the moment of astonishment as well.

Tradnor the example you cite is part of what I’m talking about. The MM is caught in a time warp and only ‘exposes’ methods which were getting a bit stale 40 or 50 years ago, and have nothing whatsoever to do with what’s going on in magic and illusion today. Yet they are billed as exposing contemporary magic methods. You don’t hear the voice-over saying “And now, from Fox, a show exposing how magic tricks were done 50 years ago”.

It’s kind of like his ‘exposure’ of the Zig Zag girl illusion, which scott evil enjoyed so much. Sorry, scott, but you haven’t been given as much info as you think you have. Two bits of news for you. The version the MM demonstrated was invented in the 1960s. Not exactly a ‘hot’ illusion. And these days, the illusionist can slide the middle section all the way out to the side and even carry it across the other side of the stage. If he wants to. Still satisfied with the explanation, scott?

I’m not saying I would prefer it if the MM were more up to date in his exposures. I’m just saying the shows don’t do what they say they do. But hey, it’s a free country, so believe what you want.

17

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by ianzin *
And these days, the illusionist can slide the middle section all the way out to the side and even carry it across the other side of the stage. If he wants to. Still satisfied with the explanation, scott?
[/quote[

I know how that’s done. I’m not stupid. I also know how the re-arranging of body parts in four boxes is done.

He can’t be as up to date because prominent magicians hold patents on their illusions. To duplicate - and expose - them would then be against the law.

Anyway, I know now how Kotnick does his levitation, and how the hoops appear to pass through him, even though he’s suspended by either two, four, or 17 wires.

– s.e.

18

magic secrets are disccussed in the newsgroup ‘alt.magic.secrets’ You can ask about any of
them in that one.

19

Some minor corrections for anyone interested in facts, as opposed to scott’s generous offerings of speculation, guesswork and error.

Some magicians and creators of illusions patent, or try to patent, their illusions, but most do not. There are three reasons. (1) Taking out a patent is a lengthy and expensive procedure. (2) It is by no means always the case that an idea for a new illusion can be patented. If the patent office is not satisfied that there is sufficient ‘new’ invention, a patent will not be granted. (3) Even if a patent were granted, this would mean anyone could view the plans for a small fee. This is not something magicians are keen on!

The plans for the system by which Copperfield “flies” were patented a long time before DC ever turned those plans into a flying illusion.

Generally, a magician who wants to protect a given illusion takes the alternative step of arranging theatrical copyright over the routine and how it is performed. Teller (of Penn &) took out such a copyright on one of the tricks in P&T’s repertoire.

There are several reasons why the Masked Magician exposures are out of date and rather poor, and patent/copyright issues are not among them. They were explained in detail over the course of a lengthy interview conducted by ‘Magic’ magazine with Valentino (the real stage name of the MM). Incidentally, Valentino himself owns the copyright on the ‘Masked Magician’ name, likeness and character.

I believe David Copperfield’s real surname is Kotkin, not Kotnick.

20

I think Ianzin is trying to tell you something, which someone else said this way.

For months, I fooled my young nephew with a basic trick He loved it, and the trick was a source of great wonder for him. One day, after days of pleading, I explained the way it worked.

Suddenly, the magic faded, and the excitement was gone. We both lost something, because I broke the basic rule - never explain the trick.

Accept that a magician has performed a great trick. Don’t be so stupid as to think it is real, like people do with Uri Geller. Accept that the magician has performed a great act, and applaud him for it. If you work out how it’s done, don’t tell anyone else.

Don’t kill the magic for yourself or for anyone else.