From Wiki:
Mad intertube skills, me.
These are times when I wish we had the services of a Marxist MBA, the only business *mavens *we’ve got are aligned with the Forces of Darkness.
Did the big insurance companies lose money in the recent unpleasantness? Everybody else did, seems likely they did as well. And people who sell insurance, as compared with exotic credit swaps, have to maintain reserves. How are those reserves looking, right about now?
I would not be surprised to hear that their plan for a return to robust fiscal health would be seriously hindered by any of the plans under consideration. Even the most minimal regulation on their nasty habit of rescinding unprofitable plans would cost them money. And seems to me I was hearing something about a lot of rate hikes? Lately?
Perhaps they recognize the inevitability of some public health plan, but are hoping to recover before the cheese gets too binding. So they instruct their congress minions to obstruct, delay, stall. The goal is not any compromise, not even a favorable compromise, because there is no such.
The plan is to so thoroughly fuck things up so that the whole process gets postponed. That is why Obama cannot find any common ground, they cannot *admit *common ground.
Now, assuming Obama is at least as smart as I am (and I’m sure he’s smarter, but I’ve managed to forgive him for that…), he might see a “rope a dope” strategy here: all along, he’s the reasonable, responsible one. Always ready to talk, always ready to negotiate, always the adult while the other guy sets the furniture on fire.
Hey, Barry! Get your staff out there to find some choice victims of the evil insurance companies, there’s a shitload, you won’t have any trouble. Just be sure they’re squeeky clean, all American goody-two shoes. Mid-American, hard-working, law-abiding, boned up the ass by their insurer. Let them do the talking, just stand there and listen sombrely. Promise them that their fellow Americans…not the government!, their fellow Americans!..will come to their aid.
And watch the bad guys bleed. Its kinda dirty, not real proud of it. Do it anyway.
The single payer option is not dead. If Obama pushes it Wednesday ,then we will have big fun. The repubs and people who think they have some assurance that their present health care will be there ,just the way they like it, for as long as they want it. So he will be in political war with the people who make money off the present system and the delusional.
This will be interesting. If Obama stands his ground , the Dems could prosper, but if they cave they could do real damage to the party. We do not need the party of money against the party of money-Lite. Someone has to fight for the people sometime.
Optimist.
Well, somebody’s got to!
How can he not stand his ground, he got elected on change and everyone knows this is what he meant - he has a democratic mandate from the people.
This is what he got elected to do, if he doesn’t do it what the hell is the point of democracy.
Adding my two cents. The public option is non-negotiable, and I will consider health care reform a complete failure (and reconsider my admiration for Obama) without it.
If you truly believe either of these parties are fighting for anything other than the politician’s benefit, I have a nice deal on a bridge for you.
Then there’s no point, and we might as well skip all political threads in the future.
Will you be skipping them?
-Joe
Agreed. My company is willing to pay for insurance, but because I am the only US employee, I cannot get coverage due to existing conditions. (I am covered by individual insurance, not group coverage. If we added an employee, we could then get group.) We aren’t asking for social medicine, we are asking that we be *able *to cover me.
I must say that I’m confused. I thought that the public option was the central, key point of Obama’s plan. If you abandon that, then what is left? Just mandating coverage under the current system?
This is similar to my question above.
I think that what is left is new regulations and mandated coverage.
People are also talking about “co-ops” as an alternative to a public option, but it’s not clear to me what calling this an “alternative to a public option” is supposed to amount to. We already have co-ops, don’t we?
I have some sympathy for people like you who don’t really know what’s going on with health reform, because the public education campaign has not been well done. But then if you don’t know what it does, it seems the rational thing is to hold your tongue until you become better informed. Isn’t it?
This is a very short summary - only a page or two - of one of the main bills. It is almost so condensed as to be worthless, but if you’re still at “what does this bill do other than make a public option?” then it should be of some value to you.
“Hold your tongue”?? :mad:
What the fuck?
JTGain asks a question in order to become better informed, and you snidely explain to him he should “hold his tongue” until he becomes better informed?
Ridiculously poor form, Richard.
I believe he has made many posts denigrating health care reform. If I’ve confused his moniker with that of another, then I apologize for the mistake.
Doesn’t really seem relevant. You only harm yourself and others’ image of you when you jump the gun like this.
Just provide the info, and if your interlocutor is indeed an opponent, then wait for him to make the first slip. Let him look foolish, so you don’t have to.
It is my opinion that if you don’t know that much about health care reform, you ought not post in the manner jtgain has here, here, here and in other threads. You don’t get to refer to Obama death panels and then later confess you actually have no idea what’s going on with health reform without receiving a mild rebuke. That’s all. I didn’t intend the hijack the thread over it.
The background info brings it all together. [/hijack]
Talking (again) of “death panels”, Reuters takes another view:
California’s Real Death Panels: Insurers Deny 21% of Claims
On the other hand, you appear to be taking a rhetorical device in a ridiculously literal manner in order to shut down discussion. jtgain has, indeed, made a number of objections to his perception of the various health care reform proposals, often, though not always, in a snide manner. His post that started your current exchange was pretty clearly a facetious effort to claim that some of the proposals are in conflict with each other or contradict themselves.
Stick to addressing his questions and leave out your opinion of what you think he ought to post.
Frylock, you might consider that your effort at intervention, however, well-intentioned, (or not), was rather more likely to bring on an off-topic feud than actually resolving the issue.
Everyone stick to the discussion without the personal remarks.
[ /Moderating ]