Love my fiancé, Wedding Planning can Suck Pit

The BBQ Pit
21

I can see your perspective here, but I’m not sure how much I am willing to let anyone else fight my battles for me. I know my husband backs me up 100% regardless of who or what is involved in the situation, but he doesn’t fight my battles for me and I don’t expect him to. If Flea doesn’t (politely and firmly) tell her FMIL to back off herself, won’t FMIL just get under Flea’s skin when her fiancé isn’t around?

I do agree that the place to start is with her fiance; he needs to know what is going on with Flea, what his mother is doing to her and get on board with stopping it RFN.

22

Wow. I wish I could respond to all one-by-one, and thank you. Some of you have made me laugh, most of you have given me the good shake I needed, and all of you have avoided me going to my mother with this and risking resentment from my side of the family.

I spent all of yesterday pretty much sick to my stomach over this. First, some background, because I want it very clear that I get along with my FMIL. She’s a strong, admirable lady and she’s been good to me in the past, she and I just differ in terms of what we feel is necessary and appropriate when it comes to behavior, and it’s becoming very obvious that my taste and sense of “okay, that’s good enough” is not on a par with hers.

I moved out here to be with my fiancé, and my family is all back on the East coast, so my FMIL is the one who took me out shopping and hugged me when I missed my mother. Her boyfriend had just moved out-of-state at the time, and she empathized with me. She babysits for us, brings food over, and is, for the most part, an amazing source of support and reliability. However, she won’t hesitate to remind us of this, should she not feel like she’s getting her due. I understand and feel for her, because she had an active social life before this, and now is mostly back-and-forth from work to her kids’ house, watching the grandkids.

My fiancé is amazing, caring and smart, but not the most eager to enter into an emotional discussion. When he tells his mother “no”, it’s usually in an elevated tone, with no little exasperation, and I can tell it affects him afterwards greatly if she is angry with him. My mother drilled it into me that I am always to be respectful of my elders and hold my tongue when I know I’m making a situation worse. It’s my mother’s voice I hear telling me to be gracious.

I suppose I thought that talking to him would bring on a wealth of sympathy and the promise to sort it out with her and save me the grief, but it’s true what y’all said: you gotta stand up for yourself. I figure I can still do this graciously and not be a doormat because of it. I went through her list of invitees last night and sorted it, and came up with how many I can invite that her present contribution will cover. As those who are invited overall decline, I will invite the ones left on the list. If this makes her angry with me, I’ll let her know that I have done all I could to accomodate her tastes, but that my primary concern is not the fanfare of the actual day, but the economic solvency of my newly minted marriage and family. If she can’t get behind that (emotionally or financially), I’ll sleep with a clear conscience, knowing I kept my manners and ultimately did what was best for me and my family.

23

Word of warning: This went on with my closest friend during her wedding planning and made her mental, and now she is going through it with her newborn son. She’s pregnant again and is STILL having to field calls from her meddling, annoying, second guessing, “I only mean to help!” MIL. Her husband refuses to stand up to her, her own fighting back is seen as hostile and “makes her cry”, and it’s terrible all around. I predict a divorce, quite frankly. It’s amazing to me that even in the face of THAT her husband won’t just tell his mother to mind her own fucking business and stay out of their lives. He won’t, though- he just placates them both and hopes for the best. Amazing.

24

Haha, Bettie, thanks. I want to get pregnant fairly soon, but I might hold off for a bit after this. I want to be further from her than this, lest she do something that really pushes a button and I lose it. More than anything, this makes me miss my mother terribly, and hope I can get back close to her soon.
Oh, and as a side note, my FMIL isn’t paying for the bulk of anything, wedding-wise. That dubious honour goes equally to my out-of-state father and myself.

25

You mention many times that you don’t want to offend. There should be nothing offensive about a very polite “no, thank you.” Anyone offended by a polite decline is being oversensitive, and anyone who persists after the first “no, thank you” is being rude. You are allowed to decline her generous offers - there is no rule that says you have to accept things or be forever branded inconsiderate.
It sounds like you are trying to work with her where you can. Is it possible to accomodate her in some small things as a gesture of goodwill?
I have a clear memory of decorating the reception hall the day before the wedding when my MIL got it into her head that a swath of tulle would be lovely over the fireplace mantle. I really did not give a rat’s posterior about the tulle. She was so hung up on it, however, that I found myself at the fabric store forking out a whole $5 for the beautious swath of tulle. It was easier than declining. Stupid tulle.

26

Works in theory. Usually, a “No, I don’t think so” leads to a more detailed explanation of why I’m wrong, or in the worst case, to a mumbled curses and silence.

:stuck_out_tongue: Totally. I am registering for gifts I don’t want, having a shower I don’t want, inviting people I don’t want, having it at a venue I knew from the outset I couldn’t afford b/c she assured me she’d cover the financial hole, hiring a limousine (which thankfully, my sister is paying for)… :smiley:

Whenever I hold fast to a refusal of something, it’s always this difficult thing, but I’ve decided not to care anymore. I’ve spent enough time worrying about other people’s feeling and not enough worrying about making this the kind of day I’ll love.

27

If you aren’t willing to step up and be firm, then you should never expect anything to change. There isn’t going to be a painless way to tell the in-laws to step off. You’re going to have to decide whether you want to have a come-to-Jesus meeting with FMIL or prepare to continue being steamrolled after you’re married (it isn’t going to stop after the wedding).

It really isn’t even your responsibility, it’s your fiance’s. You need to tell HIM to tell FMIL to step off, in no uncertain terms. If you’re not willing to tell him that, then resign yourself to being a doormat to his mother after your marriage. If HE’S not willing to stand up for you (and not just over the occasional minor skirmish but the whole war), then you need to reconsider getting married.

28

This is something you’ll need to learn as an adult anyway. I was terrible at this, am getting better slowly. You need to learn to say “No, I don’t think so”, and then shut up. Don’t let yourself be drawn into discussions. No further conversation is required. If necessary have on hand a ready stock of conversation changers such as,

FMIL: “I think we should do this.”
You: “No, I don’t think so. While we’re on the topic, what do you think about ________?”
And use it constantly.
You will also have to learn to say “Really, I don’t want to incorporate that. I don’t want to discuss it any further, either.”

I haven’t learned 100% how to do this either. But as I grow older I am slowly learning how to say No with confidence. It’s harder when it’s family, but you need to draw the boundaries now, or she will be in your face about every child-decision there is.

But honestly, count me in with the people who say it’s your fiancee’s job. And he needs to be on board with this. And needs to back you to the hilt. The wedding is usually one of the first tests of this, and this isn’t a good harbinger.

29

I’ll say I have not ever planned my own wedding. However, I have on occasion dealt with similar SO family situations and also seem to have the same social kindness concerns that you do. I ALWAYS let me repeat ALWAYS catch myself/get called out on trying to make people happy in ways that I think should be simple. Its not that I let people walk on me (trust me, I don’t, boyfriend would laugh at the suggestion). However, when I am offered ‘dont you think x would be nice let me give you $ to help’ I get all flustered trying to be nice and say no.

I’m not there yet but I’m working on saying the words ‘no, thank you’ and STOPPING RIGHT THERE. I have a habit of saying ‘no, thank you because blah blah blah blah’. And then they can refute it. When offered an ugly dress purchase by own grandmother I made the mistake of saying ‘I don’t like the way I look in x color’ apparently this is worlds different than ‘I don’t like to wear x color’. Even with the appropriate thank you, the giver thinks the first is self depricating. And then you end up offending them when you try to back track.

Oy. So the point of my rambling is the way I’m working on this habit is to take a deep breath, slow my brain down, chose a short and direct way to say no thank you and then shut the fuck up.

I guess that makes sense now that I see it in writing. My other problem in life that I’ve been working on is shutting the fuck up. And now I’ve proven my own point and shown that I’m still working on it.

Are you all thinking would she shut the fuck up already?

30

A noble goal, and one I fear I need to work on, too, I suppose. :smack: Thanks.
As for the fiancé, he is on board with helping me when he sees the need. He has, in the past, handled her quite nicely when I needed her to. The issue at hand, is, he’s a thinker, and now that he’s ‘seen her side’ as well as mine (his words), it’s going to be harder for him to draw a hard and fast line. I think being direct is best, and I do expect his support on this. If he didn’t give it, I would be surprised and it would, I agree, be a harbinger of Bad Things.

I don’t expect he’ll let me down, though.

31

Wow, what a self-centered, manipulative, passive-aggressive woman. You are in for one rough ride, dear.

But he doesn’t seem to care how greatly it affects you when she’s angry with you, and that is a Very Bad Sign as to your future with this man. Tell me why such an amazing and caring man would allow his mother to treat his future wife with such utter disrespect, intimidating her and being angry and cold, as well as speaking to her in mumbled curses followed by the silent treatment? That’s absurd! Absolutely, positively outrageous!

My husband wouldn’t allow anyone to speak to me that way, including his own mother (who, for the record, also wouldn’t dream of speaking to me (or anyone!) that way). I’m sorry, but if he allows this to continue, you’re not marrying a Prince Charming, you’re marrying an apple who doesn’t seem to have fallen too far from its tree.

ETA: On preview, I see you’ve added this. . .

Which seems like a good sign. I just hope he fulfills your expectations, but at least you aren’t wearing blinders as to what to expect from your future if he doesn’t.

Mazel Tov on your marriage – I do hope you have a grand and wonderful day!

32

Let’s see, parties, guests, gifts, and locale, all not to your liking or taste.

What does that leave you? Food, dress, and groom?

I don’t know how much of this you can unravel, but you do not need to get into a discussion of why you’re wrong. A simple, “Thanks for your opinion” or “Sorry you feel that way” should suffice.

33

Bingo.

You: “Thank you, but no.”
Her: “But blah blah blah blah blah!”
You: “That’s very interesting, but the answer is still no.”
Her: “But blah blah blah blah blah!”
You: “Maybe, maybe not. The answer is still no.”

The trick is not to engage. Don’t get sucked into the argument. Present the decision as over with, and stick to it. Don’t respond to any specific debate points. Figure out twenty different ways to say “you may be right but my mind is made up” and don’t waver. You’ll find it very freeing.

And if she still wants to argue with you, then stick a weasel in her bra.

34

And this is where your obligation to be the peace bringer ends. She can mumble and curse all she wants. If nothing ever comes of it, in the best case scenario she will cut it the hell out. In the worst case scenario she will continue to mumble. Either way it’s not your problem - it’s hers. As far as the more detailed explanation of why you’re wrong, I read a great saying on a church billboard once, “You don’t have to attend every argument you’re invited to.” I try to remember that when my own mother pushes my buttons. Arguments, or even further disucssion, require two participats. If you refuse to participate, she’s ranting to the wall.

Ooof! I said small things! This is a hint of the slippery marriage long slope people have been talking about. The whole give 'em an inch theory.
Please give yourself permission to put the breaks on now. You’ll thank yourself later when it’s “Why don’t you put another blanket/socks/a hat/more sunscreen on the baby when did you last feed him do you think he’s hungry what do you mean you’re feeding him again already I don’t think he’s napping long enough and I also think you’re letting him sleep too long anyway when are you going to have another one he needs a sibling why are you having another child so soon they’ll be too close in age.”

I am fortunate that my MIL is mostly convinced that we are insane and nothing she can say to us is going to change anything. Also she’s much too polite to be direct (although the gently implied “hints” get a little old sometimes and I wish she’d come out and say something so it could just be addressed already).

Weddings are one of the most stressful good things I can think of, and I’m glad mine is over seven years behind me. It was like having another part time job for a while, and I find diplomacy tiring. I feel your pain.

35

snort!
In event of argument, open weasel!

36

Well, I think it’s a bit different when you’re talking about his family, and even more different when you’re talking about his mother, and still more different when you talking pre-wedding and wedding planning. I don’t know about Flea of course, but many women don’t really know their FMILs all that well at that stage, and right before the wedding seems like a particularly bad time to be laying the groundwork for a bad relationship. So I’m not advocating daily and/or forever “you fight my battles for me, dear,” but I do think it’s a bit of a unique situation, and one where it is entirely appropriate to be able to say, “Your mother is riding my back like I’m Man O’War and you need to get her to climb down off of me before I completely wig out.”

This is the groom’s wedding too, so it’s not like it’s really just her problem anyway.

37

That’s what he thinks. :wink:

38

This (bolding mine):

Concerns me - there really should be no he’s “seen her side” in this situation. You had plans and a budget for your wedding. She’s steamrolling those plans, and trying to guilt you into doing things her way by throwing money at you, and grumbling and acting like a child when you try to graciously decline.

If your FMIL had have offered the money, you declined and she took it gracefully that would be one thing. But she’s not. You mentioned she mumbles and cusses - she wants this to be her wedding, and your fiancé needs to shut this shit down now. You’re still saying that the venue is a place you can’t afford, you’re only inviting however many of her friends you can afford, but if others drop out well what’s the harm in inviting a few more of her friends?

By saying that your fiancé has got your back when he sees the need and that he “sees her side” you’re giving the impression that your fiancé is only stepping in when you’re on the ledge with scissors in your hand threatening to shred your wedding dress then jump. And that’s much too late. He should be there at the start - if you say “No, thank you” then if she continues with the passive-aggressive bullshit then he needs to step up as well with “Thanks mom, but we’ve got it sorted”.

39

I agree with most of the above opinions.

a) Your fiance needs to realize that you two are a united front, and step up to deal with his mother. These things aren’t pro-and-con debates with two even sides and a moderator and valid points on each side; they are family issues, and as of now, his primary family loyalty is to you, and yours is to him. The Bible is spot on with this one: you’re supposed to cleave unto your spouse and none other. Nobody gets in the way.

b) As above, learn the disengaged non-argument. This is good for business and kids too; it’s a lifetime skill!

No, thank you.
Be that as it may, we are doing it this way.
Nevertheless…
Regardless…
Could be, but…
Maybe so, but…
I’ll give your words some thought. Meanwhile…
Thank you for your ideas.
No, thank you.
Thank you, but no.

If she gets hostile, that’s her problem, not yours. You are not responsible for her happiness. She is.

You know, my in-laws just lost their house after a few years of terrible financial decisions. We’re going to help them move this weekend. But as angry as I am over that, my in-laws have never tried to control our lives one bit, and I love them for it. Yay, my (crazy and annoying) in-laws!

40

Fair enough. I think that’s exactly what Flea should say to her fiancé. :smiley:

I agree with dangermom on the “sides” thing - assuming you are a reasonable person who tries to get along, your fiancé needs to only know one side - YOUR side. After you have said, “Your mom is stressing me and she needs to back off,” there is no more discussion that is required. And you can tell him we said that, too. :slight_smile: