Yes, I controlled myself, but partially that was due to my own fear of consequences. If there had been no consequences I might not have been so circumspect (which doesn’t mean I would have done anything coercive, I just might have been more vigorous in pursuing willing partners). Sure, most guys control themselves to a point, but that doesn’t mean we should remove all legal protections for underage girls and just tell these guys to have at it. Since it’s not possible to legislate in a way that would distinguish between predators and idiots and who’s just a really mature 13 year old we need to err on the side of the vulnerable.
What consequences? Just legal consequences? Did you care if the girl herself was willing?
15, and IMHO paying anyone for sex is skeevy. Age has nothing to do with it.
If the girl was underage, then I didn’t care if she was willing, I wasn’t going to go there.
It wasn’t just legal consequences that worried me but social ones as well…and family.
Then, speak for yourself!
I take offense with your statement. It’s not rethorics. I seriously do. I don’t think I ever deserved to be called so, at any age. And I certainly am not the only one.
You should consider that maybe, not everybody is like you, think like you, act like you. Especially if you think you are or were a pig.
Besides, it’s similar to stating : “all young girls are sluts”.
Apparently, you’re going to teach a healthy view of the world, and in particular of men, to your daughter…
Can’t make up your mind?
No, I made up my mind. I already said that sex with a person under 18 should be a felony if the age difference is more than three years and that it should be a misdemeanor if the age gap is within three years BUT that I would have an abslote cutoff at 14 regardless of the age difference.
Bolding mine.
Are you fucking kidding me?
Well, I can tell you he’s a damn sight better parent than my own were, at least when it came to sex. He didn’t deny that people get horny at the sight of another human being, he didn’t poison either of his kids about people of the opposite sex, or humiliate them in front of their SO’s for the sport of it, and he didn’t ever demand of his kids why the hell they didn’t get a date like mine did.
Oh yes, because laws work so well at preventing things from happening. I mean, since they passed the laws against drugs, there’s been no problems with illegal drugs whatsoever. :rolleyes:
Oh yeah, and how are you going to evaluate someone to see if they’d make a good parent? What criteria are you going to use? Political affiliation? Economic status? Ethnic background? What about the parent’s right to raise the child in the manner they see fit? You going to tell the Amish that they can’t allow their children to get married at 16 or 17? And why should you stop at the age of majority? After all, most children are born to people who are over the age of 18, so if you’re going to be evaluating someone for their “fitness” to be a parent, shouldn’t you go after those most likely to become parents?
I just realized something.
Diogenes is not a liberal, in the traditional meaning of the word in the US, i.e. Democrat, maybe leaning to the left. On the political scale in most European countries, a Democrat would be slightly right of center.
Diogenes is a traditional Socialdemocrat. That means that one of his goals is to protect the public from itself. A strong welfare state is not the only sollution and it can be summed up as such: “What isn’t mandatory is forbidden.”
Other signs from the SD is seing the public as a collective, not as individuals. And of course themselves as cognoscenti, the ones who protect the herd.
This explains his stance on this issue.
:dubious:
I believe that you are misquoting Dio here. Search the earlier posts for context.
Let’s keep this debate above the bar and not pull shit out of our asses please.
Ok. Then they’re responsible for their decisions? I believed they were unable to make decisions about their sex life. Which way is it? Are they responsible for their decisions or not?
Ah, gotcha. Thanks.
Are you serious? A willing girl doesn’t exist. A girl might think she is or was willing, but the truth is that she has been abused when she was small hence is completely fucked up. And generally, she won’t realize she was a victim until Diogenes tells her so.
Also, all boys are pigs. They might think they aren’t or weren’t so, but the truth is that they’re are in denial or liars. They might not act on their piggish impulses, but only because they’re affraid of the dire legal consequences, or else they would all be predators fucking 13 y.o… They sometimes won’t understand their true nature until Diogenes tell them so, though.
Nope.
Dead serious.
Casual sex is fine as long as the partners are emotionally safe and practice safe sex.
Okay, so you had a conscience. Good for you. But so might your daughter’s potential dates.
And when you say “if the girl was underage”, did this always apply, or just when you came of age? Did you date underage girls after you turned 18? Did you date teenage girls when you were a teenager, but refrain from “going there” simply because they were underage?
Not sure what you mean by “social and family”. And I repeat: did it matter to you or not how the girl felt, and what the consequences would be for her?
By that logic we shouldn’t have laws against murder because people still commit murder.
The same criteria that are used by CPS and other social service agencies all over the country. It’s not like the governmemnt never has to evaluate parental fitness.
Horseshit. I’m a social libertarian. My position on this has nothing to do with imposing morality but with protecting minors from sexual exploitation.
When did I say they weren’t responsible for their decisions? I certainly think that adults who bone children are responsible for their decisions.
I’m not willing to count on that without any legal recourse. I’m not sure I get this anyway. A guy who doesn’t exploit my daughter is a guy I have no problem with.
When I was a teenager I didn’t have that much success with girls anyway. I managed to lose my virginity at 17 but the girl was older than me.
All throughout my 20’s I played in a lot of rock bands and rock bands attract underage girls. I never dated girls under 18 but there were a couple of close calls at parties where girls who were coming on strong turned out to be underage. Whenever I had even a little doubt I would literally ask to see ID. I would also go around asking others at the party how old she was. If I couldn’t confirm that she was 18, I just wouldn’t go there, no matter how willing she was. Some of my bandmates were not so scrupulous and it bugged me a lot.
Of course. But you have to understand these were just hook ups at band parties. It’s not like they were in love with me.
I was kind of a cornball romantic anyway. I always just wanted to find a lifemate and settle down. I was never comfortable with the casual hook ups with girls I didn’t care about. I met my wife when I was 23 and that was that.
Out of curiousity, how do you define “emotionally safe”?
You poor man, taken advantage of like that by that cruel woman. I hope she rots in jail. 
I know, but I thought I’d beat the rush.
Why would he be kidding? Have you ever had casual sex? Have you ever had meaningless sex?
Yes, these things happen. Often. All the time. To attempt to legislate it away, or hide it away is to ask for more of the same kinds of trouble we have already. Hidden pregnancies, sexual ignorance, predation.
Sam