Mafia: Simpletown

The Game Room
1021

[QUOTE=RoOsh]
*And Blam. Fine. You played an asshole Townie card though. I’m not Storyteller though, so I won’t yell at you further about how Risky and ANTI-Town that play was… But if Ryjae’s not scum, I’m coming after you… after NaF that is. :dubious: (Man, I still love that face)
[/QUOTE]

Yes, yes, I did. But the whole point was that I was fairly certain that scum wouldn’t target me AND that I’d probably be investigated. This, of course, gets me confirmed and hopefully we can use some of my logic to catch another scum. And, in the interest of full disclosure, I had another plan initially, but certain circumstances stomped that one pretty quickly, so I had to change my approach.

That all said, and with some agreement we should look at the other four, I’ve already made a case against Nanook, and I think NAF (maybe someone else) has a gut feeling against Bufftabby. I have the same feeling, particularly with all the snuggling she’s been doing. Any thoughts?

1022

NETA: RoOsh, my disagreement is with the characterization of that situation as a “mini-train”. In my mind, a train is constituted by votes.

[Quote=RoOsh]
. That and the fact that he and Buffy are just seemingly going in tandem here makes me quite suspicious.
[/quote]

We’re certainly not, but how could it be scummy on me to follow a similar path of a confirmed townie? I’m not looking to him in any way for guidance; he and I have vastly different playing strategies. Not to mention that he finds me fairly scummy! So I just don’t see what you mean here.

1023

Okay. In light of reading everything.

I want to trust the detective claim. As I believe there SHOULD be a detective out there, and I don’t mind trusting you until you are counterclaimed.
-But by extension then I have to trust BlaM. Which is iffier for me because I REALLY am not buying the whole Nanook thing. Especially since I felt like this is a total 180 from what the Town was doing a few Days ago (what happened to all the Nanook love and admiration for him posting more just because of a Mafia game?). But I’m willing to take the stretch to trust our Blasterbuddy.
-However, then you want me to buy the Miller role. Right now we’ve had people claim in on what a Miller is. How about we hear this from the Horse’s mouth?

-Ryjae: Our good Mod (Sach i think?) I believe said quoting the PM is quite kosher, right? So why don’t you show us your PM and 'splain what kinda Miller you may be, and what sort of Milling about do?

-Because I’m perfectly content to play bastard Townie (which is something I expect from me, but not from a player like BlaM- and actually I’d distrust anyone else who did it too who wasn’t Me, as Bastard Townies ARE bastards…)
I’m perfectly happy to let you die. And if you show up as a Miller- then we know Blam is confirmed, and I can rest easy on that (I assume only one scum faction in this game right?). If you turn out scum- well a bird in the hand is ALWAYS better than one in the Bush in my opinion. Right now we’re at 2 Mislynches away as Blam pointed out. But right now we’ve got a chance to see if we’re up against 3 or 4 scum, and possibly end up with 5 confirmed townies. I like those odds.

[QUOTE=Blaster Master]
That all said, and with some agreement we should look at the other four, I’ve already made a case against Nanook, and I think NAF (maybe someone else) has a gut feeling against Bufftabby. I have the same feeling, particularly with all the snuggling she’s been doing. Any thoughts?
[/QUOTE]

Well my thoughts on the other 3 are pretty clear. I know what I am. Heh. But i wouldn’t buy anyone who just out and out just says that either. But i’ll let you know:
I’ve not been getting anything from Mindwanders, as he’s been pretty quiet, and i’ve not really seen him standing out really. Speak up more! So you go in the middle of my list.
I’ve been getting a townier vibe against Nanook from reading up, and then you BlaM doing the BastardTownie move and just trying to force him out really irked me… So I put him at the bottom.

However, this is very interesting. As I’ve been saying: Bufftabby has been SNUGGLING like a mofo when it comes to you BlaM. She’s basically been agreeing with you the WHOLE time. And so I was of the mindset that You and Her were basically playing the ExperienceScum/NoobScum relationship- with her just basically following you around and doing everything you were doing. Like she’s always staying on your good side. You find Nanook suspicious, and vote him. Suddenly she’s out there voting for Nanook and building a case against him.

Waaay to over eager to please you, dude. And that to me made me feel like I had 2 in the hand. But Naf’s revelation now makes me wonder if perhaps our Dear Buffy has been acting on her own more insidiously?
So since she was my #2 suspect besides you BlaM, I’ll now keep her at #2, with **Ryjae **fully up top as my #1 suspect.
In Summation: I favor a Ryjae lynch #1, to see what you’re up to BlaM as bastard is as bastard does. But then I am most suspicious of Buffytabby. Those are my thoughts. My vote stays where it is though.

1024

[QUOTE=bufftabby]
NETA: RoOsh, my disagreement is with the characterization of that situation as a “mini-train”. In my mind, a train is constituted by votes.

[/QUOTE]

So what’s a mini-train?

And aren’t you really just arguing semantics here?
What I’m saying is the ACTIONS of trains/mini-trains is what’s problematic, not what you CALL the Train/mini-trains.

[QUOTE=bufftabby]

We’re certainly not, but how could it be scummy on me to follow a similar path of a confirmed townie? I’m not looking to him in any way for guidance; he and I have vastly different playing strategies. Not to mention that he finds me fairly scummy! So I just don’t see what you mean here.

[/QUOTE]

Ooh okay. Well. That totally clears it up.
Good points. You followed a townie, and then he finds you suspicious too! WHY YOU CAN’T POSSIBLY BE SCUM! Because Scum like to stand out and post giant signs saying “I’m Totally a rebel! LOOK AT ME!” Silly me! :smack:

The fact that you’re trying to use other people to verify your towniness rather than your actions is quite telling though. FoS Bufftabby stands.

1025

[QUOTE=Blaster Master]
To the Masons and NAF, here’s an alternate idea to lynching Ryjae, as there is no way to be 100% sure at this point. If we lynch Ryjae, we’re doing the testing of NAF’s roleclaim. Why don’t we force the scum to do it for us?

Here’s what I propose, we look at the four unconfirmed and try to find scum in there. Tonight, the scum are faced with a dilemma, but one which has a predictable outcome. They can either kill NAF and confirm everything he’s said, or try to leave him alive and let him continue to investigate. This also means that if NAF is lying, then Ryjae must be as well (as, without a counter-claim Today, it’s probably safe to assume there is no Detective, at which point a Miller wouldn’t make sense).
[/QUOTE]

This is an interesting plan, and one which deserves very careful consideration. I’m going to try to lay out the possibilities:

If we don’t lynch RyJae:
[ul]
[li]Assuming he is telling the truth, scum would probably kill NAF, confirming his reads on **BM **and pede, as well as his own Detectivity (I just made that word up); RyJae’s role would still be up in the air. Information result: 4 confirmed roles (lynchee, NAF, BM, pede) [/li][li]Alternately, scum could decide to kill someone else to keep us guessing, probably myself or **peeker **since we are confirmed, and leave **NAF **alive. Information result: 1 confirmed role (lynchee) and lots of questions about **NAF’s ** Detectivity. [/li][/ul]

If we do lynch RyJae and he comes up scum:
[ul]
[li]Scum would probably kill NAF to prevent further reads, confirming his reads on **BM **and pede, as well as his own Detectivity; RyJae’s role would be known. Information result: 4 confirmed roles (RyJae, NAF, BM, pede)[/li][li]Alternately, scum could decide to kill someone else, probably myself or **peeker **since we are confirmed, and leave **NAF **alive. Information result: 1 confirmed role (RyJae), but **NAF ** and his other reads would be 99% confirmed (99% - NAF, BM, pede), plus the 99% Detective would still be alive.[/li][/ul]

If we do lynch RyJae and he comes up Miller:
[ul]
[li]Scum would probably kill NAF to prevent further reads, confirming his reads on **BM **and pede, as well as his own Detectivity; RyJae’s role would be known. Information result: 4 confirmed roles (RyJae, NAF, BM, pede)[/li][li]Alternately, scum could decide to kill someone else, probably myself or **peeker **since we are confirmed, and leave **NAF **alive. Information result: 1 confirmed role (RyJae), and to be honest I’m not sure how exactly **NAF ** and his other reads would be taken at this point. My gut says he would be mostly confirmed, although it’s murkier in my mind than if **RyJae **turned up scum. (The Miller role is confusing me a little).[/ul][/li]
So, to me, with all that said, I’m leaning toward lynching RyJae, as the risk of getting little to no information in my second bullet point is very troubling to me, and the rewards not so great. Does anyone see any flaws in my information results?

1026

I should suit the action to the word:

Vote RyJae

1027

[QUOTE=RoOsh]
So what’s a mini-train?

And aren’t you really just arguing semantics here?
What I’m saying is the ACTIONS of trains/mini-trains is what’s problematic, not what you CALL the Train/mini-trains.

[/quote]

Well, yeah. You asked what I disagreed with, I answered. Why don’t you enlighten me on the problematic aspect of these mini-trains?

[Quote=RoOsh]

Ooh okay. Well. That totally clears it up.
Good points. You followed a townie, and then he finds you suspicious too! WHY YOU CAN’T POSSIBLY BE SCUM! Because Scum like to stand out and post giant signs saying “I’m Totally a rebel! LOOK AT ME!” Silly me! :smack:

The fact that you’re trying to use other people to verify your towniness rather than your actions is quite telling though. FoS Bufftabby stands.
[/QUOTE]

Way to distort what I said into meaning something completely different. I was refuting your claim that we were acting in tandem, not trying to prove my townieness through anyone else. Nice try, though. Next, please. Go :smack: yourself.

1028

NAF is the detective of that there is no doubt as only he could have seen me as “scum” so a lot of your basis on verifying his information is just muddying the waters.

It is one of two things as it stands now, I am town or I am scum. Being me makes it easier to know I am town but proof will be had on my death or our win. But on that same token I am a known item we have 4 in the unknown.
We eliminate the scum out of that starting now by looking at those four and that leaves us up one town, down one scum.
How you are proposing we do it is eliminate one “known” item (me whether scum or town for your purposes) and tonight the scum will eliminate a known town. So we would be at best even if I where to be scum. When I turn up as town you are basically going to be down 2 town for no scum.

I think NAF and BlaM have the best plan, and this is coming from a town who knows he will die if we do not hit scum every lynch until we win.

1029

Interesting points there Shadow, and I understand your reservations, but that’s precisely the point of leaving it up to the scum. They know whether or not he’s lying, so they know how much of a risk it is to leave him alive. So the question is, if NAF is telling the truth, they MAY be able to delay us knowing he’s confirmed until he’s dead… hell, they could leave him alive the rest of the game, theoretically; but they also know that his reads are accurate, and thus they’re only delaying the information we have now while ultimately piling up a lot more negative information.

IOW, it’s our chance to put pressure on the scum. If they don’t kill him, we get another reading from NAF, possibly another scum reading that makes it REALLY easy to test him or we can just lynch Ryjae tomorrow, and we’ll still net at least the same amount of information.

So, sure, if we can’t come to a reasonable conclusion amongst the other four, I’ll go for Ryjae, but I’d rather look there first.

1030

[QUOTE=RyJae]
NAF is the detective of that there is no doubt as only he could have seen me as “scum” so a lot of your basis on verifying his information is just muddying the waters.
[/QUOTE]

I am going to assume this post is in response to me. You may have no doubt that **NAF **is the Detective, but IMO it’s better to play with doubts than to make assumptions. I *think ***NAF **is the Detective, but I am not sure.

[QUOTE=RyJae]
It is one of two things as it stands now, I am town or I am scum. Being me makes it easier to know I am town but proof will be had on my death or our win. But on that same token I am a known item we have 4 in the unknown.
We eliminate the scum out of that starting now by looking at those four and that leaves us up one town, down one scum.
How you are proposing we do it is eliminate one “known” item (me whether scum or town for your purposes) and tonight the scum will eliminate a known town. So we would be at best even if I where to be scum. When I turn up as town you are basically going to be down 2 town for no scum.
[/QUOTE]

I believe you are looking at it too much from your own point of view. My analysis comes from a place of not knowing whether you or **NAF **is telling the truth, and at information gained - confirmed, not assumed - by the whole town in various scenarios. It’s not just a matter of counting bodies, it’s a matter of confirming information.

1031

I’m having trouble deciding what course of action to take. I’m really tempted to just keep my vote where it is, but I also like the idea of stoning this bird we have in our hands. I think I’m gonna go for trying to lynch an unknown, because it seems like that would provide more information. I realize that I’m on that list, but I think that even my death would yield more information than ryjae’s at this point, so my death could at least point my remaining townie brethren in the right direction.

1032

[QUOTE=Blaster Master]
Interesting points there Shadow, and I understand your reservations, but that’s precisely the point of leaving it up to the scum. They know whether or not he’s lying, so they know how much of a risk it is to leave him alive. So the question is, if NAF is telling the truth, they MAY be able to delay us knowing he’s confirmed until he’s dead… hell, they could leave him alive the rest of the game, theoretically; but they also know that his reads are accurate, and thus they’re only delaying the information we have now while ultimately piling up a lot more negative information.

IOW, it’s our chance to put pressure on the scum. If they don’t kill him, we get another reading from NAF, possibly another scum reading that makes it REALLY easy to test him or we can just lynch Ryjae tomorrow, and we’ll still net at least the same amount of information.

So, sure, if we can’t come to a reasonable conclusion amongst the other four, I’ll go for Ryjae, but I’d rather look there first.
[/QUOTE]

I have to run out now, but I will be back to consider and respond to this post in a little while. One quick note before I leave: I definitely agree it makes sense to look closely at the other 4 with the time we have remaining toDay, and my **RyJae **vote is certainly not set in stone.

1033

Fixed.

Okay, seriously, people, would you please stop doint this? I know that you know that you’re town. I know I’m town. But if you’re going to make a list of confirmed/unconfirmed, and present it as fact as opposed to your own opinion, PLEASE don’t include yourself in the confirmed list. I hate this practice because it’s sloppy and confusing and it makes it twice as difficult to analyze current situations. Remember that Pleonast used this tactic to win the game for the scum in YSI–he admitted as such after the game ended. Since I haven’t found any evidence for Bufftabby (again. I really need to stop worrying about people I’ve already eliminated after investagation) and this strikes me as really scummy, so

Vote Blaster Master

1034

[QUOTE=pedescribe]
Fixed.

Okay, seriously, people, would you please stop doint this? I know that you know that you’re town. I know I’m town. But if you’re going to make a list of confirmed/unconfirmed, and present it as fact as opposed to your own opinion, PLEASE don’t include yourself in the confirmed list. I hate this practice because it’s sloppy and confusing and it makes it twice as difficult to analyze current situations. Remember that Pleonast used this tactic to win the game for the scum in YSI–he admitted as such after the game ended. Since I haven’t found any evidence for Bufftabby (again. I really need to stop worrying about people I’ve already eliminated after investagation) and this strikes me as really scummy, so

Vote Blaster Master

But you’re missing where NAF confirmed him so unless you’re saying NAF is lying. Which at this point no one else has stood up as the detective. Plus him getting damn lucky on a guess with me he is as good as confirmed.

So you’re saying this is a NAF/BlaM conspiracy, I’m not taking the good stuff you are then because I’m not seeing it.

1035

:o :eek: :smack:
Wow i feel stupid.
Okay, disregard that last post.
I thought that NAF said W F Tomba, not Blaster Master.
Also, so we keep all bases covered–should we trust the claimed detective?
I am.
Vote RyJae

P.S. It would be good to know that there are millers too.

1036

What I meant to say was
Unvote bufftabby
Unvote Blaster Master
Vote RyJae

Also, RyJae, would it kill you to fix your tags? It’s really confusing the way you post now.

1037

Damn I need to stop removing the end quote after removing the color. Sorry about that. But while I’m here I’d like to add I don’t find anything particularly scummy with bufftabby either. That’s actually the last person on the unconfirmed list I’m looking toward. First is Nanook, due to some of his earlier play. But that will be later after I review all the posts (which is hard as hell in this forum :frowning: )

1038

Alright. RyJae, if you are the miller, who did you block? Why?

Sach, if you were to mod an open game, say Mafia: EasyTown, would you give your millers extra powers? Or would they just be a PITN for town?

1039

[QUOTE=pedescribe]

Also, RyJae, would it kill you to fix your tags? It’s really confusing the way you post now.
[/QUOTE]

Yeah it would kill me, well modkill me to “fix” my tags. I made a mistake same as you did with your vote. To look at the better side, at least I skim my own posts half assed and miss some tag things, good to see you skim important posts half assed and miss some game critical things. You know, stones and glass houses and all that.

1040

[QUOTE=pedescribe]
Alright. RyJae, if you are the miller, who did you block? Why?

[/QUOTE]

I am but a vanilla townie, no power nothing special other than I am a miller. (Which sadly I had to ask google what the hell that was once I got the information) No blocking ability, no nothing ability. Just a townie with the mean power of being lynched by fellow townies thrown in for fun.