I’m still bugged by the fact that we’re “not allowed” to use the word “actress” any longer. I don’t mind if that was a result of attitudes gradually shifting and the language changing, but it seemed to be imposed on us overnight sometime in the mid 80s, and thenceforth if you forgot and the word “actress” slipped out, you were automatically a sexist pig.
I think that if, for the same two syllables, you get extra information, then why not? Around here - partly maybe because I live in a Muslim area - you will see signs saying LADY DOCTOR. I can’t help thinking “doctress” would be a good word…
[QUOTE=Millit the Frail]
Speaking as a person who just got in to nursing school TODAY (GO ME!!! I GET TO BE A NURSE!!), I think “male nurse” is dumb. So I pledge to never use it.
(Yeah, I only posted to brag, but at least I didn’t start a whole thread over it. It’s been a difficult few months, and this is the best news I’ve had all year. And I’m at home alone and have no one else to share it with. So…yeah.)
[/QUOTE]
No, dear, you get to be an RN
Lately, it seems that anyone that comes in contact with patients, from nursing assistants to the kitchen staff, call themselves nurses.
As far as the masculine redundancy, hate it, hate it, hate it.
Aside: My husband is a firefighter/EMT a patient gave him a new title, that he rather likes. He’s now a Fire Doctor.
[QUOTE=Spectre of Pithecanthropus]
I agree on “male nurse”, but then maybe the profession needs to be retitled, since the word “nurse” in some other contexts is extremely female. In many languages the very word for nurse is blatantly female, like Krankenschwester in Germany. I think they also address nurses as “Sister” in England. I would be interested to know what they do in those places for male practitioners.
[/QUOTE]
Hence Krankenbruder, you know.
And in Spanish, enfermera and enfermero. The signs on nurse’s offices in many Spanish hospitals and clinics say “enfermera,” which always leads to some giggles when a bearded dude in a nurse’s uniform comes out; they’re being slowly changed to “enfermería” (nursing).
Once I was doing some workstudy in a hospital (summer of 1989). In the lift, a woman about 70 adressed me “excuse me, nurse” and another one about the same age interrupted with “woah, hey there! Why do you assume she’s a nurse? She could be a doctor, you know! The doctor I’m coming to see is a she-doctor!” “Neither, actually, I work in the lab, but how may I help you?” They were quite intrigued by the notion of people “other than doctors and nurses” working there even though the people in, for example, the admissions office are neither.
[QUOTE=Baker]
Ask their wives(also RN’s) about the assumption some have that male nurses are all gay.
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The local newspaper has a weekly feature on different professions. Once it was about nursing; one of the three nursing students they interviewed was male. When asked about that, he said "are you kidding? (my school is the) Best place to pick chicks EVER! "
I think that if, for the same two syllables, you get extra information, then why not? Around here - partly maybe because I live in a Muslim area - you will see signs saying LADY DOCTOR. I can’t help thinking “doctress” would be a good word…
[/QUOTE]
In Quebec, we have the title docteure: my mom is Dre. mom_mcl. (That’s only a title, though - the word for a doctor is un médecin if male, une médecin if female.)
In French the approach to non-sexist language is a little different. In English we prefer gender-neutral terms, because someone’s gender is irrelevant to the discussion of their professional life. In French, of course, gender-neutral terms are impossible, because everything must be either masculine or feminine. Therefore, the approach is to have a masculine and feminine version of everything, so that you’re not stuck referring to a woman with a masculine noun and implying that they’re in a man’s job or that they become more mannish by going to work. This is probably most advanced here in Quebec: l’avocate, la professeure, l’ingénieure, la première ministre, etc.
One that we use that some people think is funny is “la mairesse” (the mayor). “Mairesse” used to mean “mayor’s wife,” so some people have told me you should say “madame le maire” instead. I say, would that mean that the husband of madame le maire is monsieur la mairesse?
[QUOTE=matt_mcl]
Yeah, my mom tells me she’s been called “a lady doctor” once or twice.
[/QUOTE]
I may have told this story before . . .
I used to work with a very nice woman who had a rather sweet, childlike personality. One day she mentioned Dr. W, “the lady doctor.” Knowing my friend, I asked her to clarify: Is Dr. W a female physician or a (probably male) gynecologist?
Yup, that second one. (She was pregnant at the time.)
[QUOTE=matt_mcl]
Yeah, my mom tells me she’s been called “a lady doctor” once or twice.
[/QUOTE]
Wordsmith William Safire once wrote a column where he told of a photographer getting annoyed because he called her a “girl photographer.”
A reader responded that the correct form is “female photographer.” A “girl photographer” would be someone who photographs girls. A “lady doctor” would be someone who doctors ladies. Safire concluded that the correct forms to use are “male” and “female” and they should only be used when they are relevant to the conversation, which is almost never.
Much later he referred to someone as a “woman executive,” and got hell for it. “Is that like the old term career girl?” He admitted that the correct term would have been “female executive” and he should have gone with “executive.”
[QUOTE=TheLoadedDog]
I’m still bugged by the fact that we’re “not allowed” to use the word “actress” any longer. I don’t mind if that was a result of attitudes gradually shifting and the language changing, but it seemed to be imposed on us overnight sometime in the mid 80s, and thenceforth if you forgot and the word “actress” slipped out, you were automatically a sexist pig.
I think that if, for the same two syllables, you get extra information, then why not? Around here - partly maybe because I live in a Muslim area - you will see signs saying LADY DOCTOR. I can’t help thinking “doctress” would be a good word…
Prepares to be shot down
[/QUOTE]
No one ever stops me saying “actress.” I am thinking that I might be getting away with it because I am a woman. That’s pretty silly, but there you go.
Doctress…hmm. Or “doctrix”! (I love those “-trix” words, like editrix and aviatrix) I keep saying when I take over the world, I am going to be called the Dictatrix, but I also keep forgetting to check whether it’s grammatically correct.
[QUOTE=picunurse]
No, dear, you get to be an RN
Lately, it seems that anyone that comes in contact with patients, from nursing assistants to the kitchen staff, call themselves nurses.
As far as the masculine redundancy, hate it, hate it, hate it.
[/QUOTE]
I hate the “male nurse” thing too. Don’t even get me started with all the twits out there who call themselves nurses when they’re not. :rolleyes:
I love to call them on it too. When someone hears that I am an RN and they lie and tell me they’re a “nurse”, I ask “Oh where did you go to school?” or “What area of nursing do you work in?” Then they usually come clean.
[QUOTE=Baffle]
It is kind of hard for a male to be a nurse in the traditional sense: a woman hired to breastfeed a noblewoman’s baby, now usually referred to as a wet nurse. Unfortuantely there’s no good word in English to refer to male caregivers of the sick so we do our best with what we have.
[/QUOTE]
I don’t disagree, though I wonder why husbanding a patient wouldn’t work.
I agree, “male nurse” is every bit as insulting as “girl doctor” would be. Ugh.
I will refer to female thespians (don’t even think about it, you punners) as actors or actresses, depending on the situation.
Speaking of such things, the preschool visited the fire station today, and I think I’ve decided not to bother with the politically correct “fire fighter.” Fuck it, they’re firemen, and I will teach my daughter that if she wants to and has the requisite skills, she can be a fireman too when she grows up.
[QUOTE=Unauthorized Cinnamon]
I agree, “male nurse” is every bit as insulting as “girl doctor” would be. Ugh.
I will refer to female thespians (don’t even think about it, you punners) as actors or actresses, depending on the situation.
Speaking of such things, the preschool visited the fire station today, and I think I’ve decided not to bother with the politically correct “fire fighter.” Fuck it, they’re firemen, and I will teach my daughter that if she wants to and has the requisite skills, she can be a fireman too when she grows up.
[/QUOTE]
I was with you till the last paragraph. Being “men” has nothing to do with their line of work. They are people who fight fires–fire fighters.
[QUOTE=whiterabbit]
I didn’t know people were still using the term. It seems hideously old fashioned. It’s true that a lot nurses are women, but I don’t see what’s so remarkable about a man being a nurse that implies the need for the term. If I need a nurse, I don’t care if you’re from Mars as long as you are an actual nurse.
I’m 31 and female and American, for the record.
[/QUOTE]
I’m 36, and also American, and I recall having a textbook in second grade with a question that went something like this: “A doctor and a boy are walking down the street. The boy is the doctor’s son, but the doctor is not the boy’s father. How can this be?”
That this question is even asked banks on the fact that, at the time, doctors were expected to be men.
It’s been a difficult few months, and this is the best news I’ve had all year. And I’m at home alone and have no one else to share it with. So…yeah.)
(former Animal Husbandry major, here)