I have to say I’ve never met so many men who were utterly terrified of being falsely accused of rape.
Where does all this paranoia come from.
I find it especially ironic since, as far as I can tell, most of the men terrified of false accusations are white. At least black men can point to false accusations of rape being used to justify their murder.
You assume that it’s possible to tell, and that it requires craziness to make a false accusation. People are unpredictable, and under our system there are many circumstances where such an accusation is perfectly rational, if not unethical.
Again; the problem is the system, not women. I wouldn’t trust men either with a license to make false accusations with no repercussions.
No, I’m pointing out that the vast majority of women find it offensive when a man doesn’t grant them absolute trust regardless of whether or not they intend anything.
What; two, three guys? Quite the horde.
In actuality the problem is that most men are quite foolhardy when it comes to women, oblivious to risk. Which is why the situation is allowed to continue; most men refuse to admit there’s a problem in the first place, and women have little reason to care.
Me either. I find it really weird.
Don’t paint all us white dudes with that brush (I know you’re not, but wanna forestall any such): some of us white dudes think this is as ridiculous as the recent survey showing how many white people think that white people are discriminated against more than black people. I like how Louis CK said it: “If you’re white and you don’t admit that it’s great, you’re an asshole.” Same thing with being a man.
A silly and bigoted statement. The fact that Group X is mistreated doesn’t make the mistreatment of Group Y nonexistent. This is the same sort of reasoning that leads to people arguing over whether blacks/women/Jews/gays have it worst, because as far as they are concerned only the mistreatment of the very worst counts and the rest should shut up.
This position that civil rights only matter if you belong to the appropriately designated victim group is unethical and pretty classic divide and conquer tactics.
I don’t see this as saying “you aren’t a real man.”. I see it as saying “you don’t get laid.”. Now maybe you define a man as one who has sex regularly, but that’s more your issue than anyone else’s.
And just to let you know, secretly taping a woman having sex with you would in the minds of many be pretty good evidence of abysmal character on your part, increasing the credibility of her accusations in many situations.
Anyone who thinks that taping themselves having sex with a woman without her knowing about it is anything but disgusting and the sign of a very disturbed mind has serious issues they need to deal with.
Depends on one’s profession, more than on one’s race.
I know a lot of teachers, physicians, social workers and family lawyers (I’m a lawyer myself, though not in family law). Such people are quite vulnerable to spurious accusations of sexual assault from people they come in contact with in their jobs, which can have very bad effects on their lives - true or false. For one, in some cases the usual administrative process is to strip one of one’s licence to practice pending a hearing of the accusation - which could take some time, and if the accusation is administrative, it is not subject to the full process of the criminal law.
The situation is getting such that, for some professions, it’s a serious inconvenience.
Heh true.
I’m a male teacher, and yeah, the fear of this has definitely crossed my mind. However, I can’t let myself live in fear of it. I take appropriate precautions (example: never being alone in a room with a closed door and a student) to minimize my risk, and then I acknowledge that I can’t control every risk in my life completely, and I get on with my job. Of all the things that could happen to me, the chances of this one seem pretty small. I’m a lot likelier to be killed on my commute by some mofo in a blue minivan who decides at the last minute to swerve into my lane nearly sideswiping me and making me slam on the breaks in the middle of a rainstorm (sorry, close encounter this morning) than I am to face a false accusation of misconduct.
I wouldn’t suggest living in fear of it. I’m merely pointing out that the fear of it isn’t an absurd thing to be concerned about.
It’s perhaps an expected swing of the social pendulum: in the past, accusations against authority figures such as teachers, doctors, lawyers etc. were routinely ignored, and of course there were predators who took advantage of that to prey on the vulnerable. In reaction, we have swung the other way, and have in some cases enacted “zero tolerance” type strategies that remove the ability of professional administrators to filter out obviously absurd accusations - I recall a recent column in my city complaining about the number of teachers forced onto administrative leave, because all accusations of physical or sexual abuse, however minor or absurd, made by a student are referred automatically to the Children’s Aid Society for investigation - and they, being overworked and under-staffed, take a long time to investigate (in the past, the Principal of the school would have “filtered” these).
The result is that many (mostly male) teachers are administratively suspended, for accusations that turn out, after some months of investigation, to be unfounded - particularly those teachers working with children who are disturbed.
Though this is of course worlds away from surreptitiously videotaping one’s dates. 
“Rare” can mean different things to different people. It’s rare to get struck by lightning, but we still advise people to avoid standing under trees during a thunderstorm, because the consequences of being the victim of the rare event are substantial.
Here are a list of falsely accused and convicted men, where the charge included rape or sexual assault. Note the times between the year of conviction and the year of exoneration.
Last First State Conviction Year Exoneration Year
Abbitt Joseph NC 1995 2009
Abdal Habib Wahir NY 1983 1999
Adams Kenneth IL 1979 1996
Alejandro Gilbert TX 1990 1994
Alexander Richard IN 1998 2001
Anderson Marvin VA 1982 2002
Atkins Herman CA 1988 2000
Avery Steven WI 1985 2003
Avery William D. 2004 2010
Bain James FL 1974 2009
Barnes Steven NY 1989 2009
Bauer Chester MT 1983 1997
Beaver Antonio MO 1997 2007
Bibbins Gene LA 1987 2003
Bivens Phillip MS 1980 2010
Blair Michael TX 1994 2008
Bloodsworth Kirk MD 1985 1993
Booker Donte OH 1987 2005
Boquete Orlando FL 1983 2006
Bostic Larry FL 1989 2007
Bradford Marcellius IL 1988 2001
Bradford Ted WA 1996 2010
Bravo Mark Diaz CA 1990 1994
Brewer Kennedy MS 1995 2008
Briscoe Johnny MO 1983 2006
Brison Dale PA 1990 1994
Bromgard Jimmy Ray MT 1987 2002
Brown Dennis LA 1985 2005
Brown Danny OH 1982 2001
Brown Roy NY 1992 2007
Brown Keith NC 1993 1997
Brown Patrick PA 2002 2010
Bryson David Johns OK 1983 2003
Bullock Ronnie IL 1984 1994
Buntin Harold IN 1986 2005
Burnette Victor VA 1979 2009
Butler A.B. TX 1983 2000
Byrd Kevin TX 1985 1997
Cage Dean IL 1996 2008
Callace Leonard NY 1987 1992
Capozzi Anthony NY 1987 2007
Caravella Anthony FL 1986 2010
Chalmers Terry NY 1987 1995
Charles Clyde LA 1982 1999
Charles Ulysses Rodriguez MA 1984 2001
Chatman Charles TX 1981 2008
Clark Robert GA 1982 2005
Coco Allen LA 1997 2006
Cole Timothy TX 1986 2009
Cotton Ronald NC 1985, 1987 1995
Cowans Stephan MA 1998 2004
Criner Roy TX 1990 2000
Cromedy McKinley NJ 1994 1999
Crotzer Alan FL 1981 2006
Cruz Rolando IL 1985 1995
Cunningham Calvin Wayne VA 1981 2011
Dabbs Charles NY 1984 1991
Dail Dwayne Allen NC 1989 2007
Danziger Richard TX 1990 2002
Davidson Willie VA 1981 2005
Davis Gerald WV 1987 1995
Davis Dewey WV 1987 1995
Davis Cody FL 2006 2007
Davis Larry W. WA 1993 2010
Daye Frederick CA 1984 1994
Dean James NE 1990 2009
Dedge Wilton FL 1982 2004
Deskovic Jeff NY 1990 2006
Diaz Luis FL 1980 2005
Dillon William FL 1981 2008
Dixon John NJ 1991 2001
Dixon Bobby Ray MS 1980 2010
Dominguez Alejandro IL 1990 2002
Doswell Thomas PA 1986 2005
Dotson Gary IL 1979 1989
Dupree Cornelius TX 1980 2011
Durham Timothy OK 1993 1997
Echols Douglas GA 1987 2002
Elkins Clarence OH 1999 2005
Erby Lonnie MO 1986 2003
Evans Michael IL 1977 2003
Evans Jerry Lee TX 1987 2009
Fain Charles Irvin ID 1983 2001
Fappiano Scott NY 1985 2006
Fears Jr. Joseph OH 1984 2009
Fountain Wiley TX 1986 2003
Fritz Dennis OK 1988 1999
Fuller Larry TX 1981 2007
Gates Donald Eugene DC 1982 2009
Giles James Curtis TX 1983 2007
Gillard Larry IL 1982 2009
Godschalk Bruce PA 1987 2002
Gonzalez Hector NY 1996 2002
Gonzalez Kathy NE 1990 2009
Good Donald Wayne TX 1984 2004
Goodman Bruce Dallas UT 1986 2004
Gossett Andrew TX 2000 2007
Gray David A. IL 1978 1999
Gray Anthony MD 1991 1999
Gray Paula IL 1978 2002
Green Edward DC 1990 1990
Green Kevin CA 1980 1996
Green Michael OH 1988 2001
Green Michael Anthony TX 1983 2010
Gregory William KY 1993 2000
Halsey Byron NJ 1988 2007
Halstead Dennis NY 1987 2005
Harris William O’Dell WV 1987 1995
Harrison Clarence GA 1987 2004
Hatchett Nathaniel MI 1998 2008
Hayes Travis LA 1998 2007
Heins Chad FL 1996 2007
Henton Eugene TX 1984 2006
Hernandez Alejandro IL 1985 1995
Hicks Anthony WI 1991 1997
Holdren Larry WV 1985 2000
Holland Dana IL 1993 2003
Honaker Edward VA 1985 1994
Hunt Darryl NC 1985 2004
Ireland Kenneth CT 1989 2009
Jackson Willie LA 1989 2006
Jean Lesly NC 1982 2001
Jimerson Verneal IL 1985 1996
Johnson Albert CA 1992 2002
Johnson Calvin GA 1983 1999
Johnson Larry MO 1984 2002
Johnson Richard IL 1992 1996
Johnson Rickie LA 1983 2008
Johnson Arthur MS 1993 2008
Johnson Anthony LA 1986 2010
Jones Joe KS 1986 1992
Jones Ronald IL 1989 1999
Jones David Allen CA 1995 2004
Karage Entre Nax TX 1997 2005
Kelly William PA 1990 1993
Kogut John NY 1986 2005
Kordonowy Paul D. MT 1990 2003
Kotler Kerry NY 1982 1992
Krone Ray AZ 1992 2002
Laughman Barry PA 1988 2004
Lavernia Carlos TX 1985 2000
Lindsey Johnnie TX 1981, 1985 2009
Linscott Steven IL 1982 1992
Lloyd Eddie Joe MI 1985 2002
Lowery Eddie James KS 1982 2003
Lyons Marcus IL 1988 2007
Mahan Ronnie AL 1986 1998
Mahan Dale AL 1986 1998
Maher Dennis MA 1984 2003
Marshall Michael GA 2008 2009
Matthews Ryan LA 1999 2004
Mayes Larry IN 1982 2001
McCarty Curtis OK 1986, 1989 2007
McClendon Robert OH 1991 2008
McCray Antron NY 1990 2002
McGee Arvin OK 1989 2002
McGowan Thomas TX 1985/1986 2008
McKinney Lawrence TN 2009
McMillan Clark TN 1980 2002
McSherry Leonard CA 1988 2001
Mercer Michael NY 1992 2003
Miller Billy Wayne TX 1984 2006
Miller Neil MA 1990 2000
Miller Robert OK 1988 1998
Miller Jerry IL 1982 2007
Mitchell Perry SC 1984 1998
Mitchell Marvin MA 1990 1997
Moon Brandon TX 1988 2005
Moore Curtis Jasper VA 1978 2010
Moto Vincent PA 1987 1996
Mumphrey Arthur TX 1986 2006
Nelson Bruce PA 1982 1991
Nesmith Willie PA 1982
Newton Alan NY 1985 2006
Northrop Alan G. WA 1993 2010
O’Donnell James NY 1998 2000
Ochoa James CA 2005 2006
Ochoa Christopher TX 1989 2002
Ollins Larry IL 1988 2001
Ollins Calvin IL 1988 2001
Ortiz Victor NY 1984 1996
Ott Chaunte WI 1996 2009
Pacyon Douglas NY 1985 2010
Patterson Maurice IL 2003 2010
Peacock Freddie NY 1976 2010
Pendleton Marlon IL 1996 2006
Peterson Larry NJ 1989 2006
Phillips Steven TX 1982, 1983 2008
Pierce Jeffrey OK 1986 2001
Piszczek Brian OH 1991 1994
Pope David Shawn TX 1986 2001
Powell Anthony MA 1992 2004
Rachell Ricardo TX 2003 2009
Rainge Willie IL 1979 1996
Restivo John NY 1987 2005
Reynolds Donald IL 1988 1997
Richardson Kevin NY 1990 2002
Richardson James WV 1989 1999
Robinson Anthony TX 1987 2000
Rodriguez George TX 1987 2005
Rollins Lafonso IL 1994 2004
Roman Miguel CT 1990 2009
Rose Peter CA 1996 2005
Ruffin Julius VA 1982 2003
Ruffin Larry MS 1980 2010
Saecker Fredric WI 1990 1996
Salaam Yusef NY 1990 2002
Salazar Ben TX 1992 1997
Santana Raymond NY 1990 2002
Sarsfield Eric MA 1987 2000
Saunders Omar IL 1988 2001
Scott Calvin Lee OK 1983 2003
Scott Samuel GA 1987 2002
Scruggs Dwayne IN 1986 1993
Shelden Debra NE 1989 2009
Shephard David NJ 1984 1995
Smith Walter D. OH 1986 1996
Smith Billy James TX 1987 2006
Smith Frank Lee FL 1986 2000
Snyder Walter VA 1986 1993
Sterling Frank NY 1992 2010
Stinson Robert Lee WI 1985 2009
Sutherlin David Brian MN 1985 2002
Sutton Josiah TX 1999 2004
Taylor Ronald Gene TX 1995 2008
Taylor Ada JoAnn NE 1990 2009
Terry Paul IL 1977 2003
Thomas Victor Larue TX 1986 2002
Thurman Phillip Leon VA 1985 2005
Tillman James CT 1989 2006
Toney Steven MO 1983 1996
Towler Raymond OH 1981 2010
Townsend Jerry Frank FL Various 2001
Turner Keith E. TX 1983 2005
Vasquez David VA 1985 1989
Velasquez Eduardo MA 1988 2001
Villasana Armand MO 1999 2000
Waller James TX 1983 2007
Waller Patrick TX 1992 2008
Wallis Gregory TX 1989 2007
Wardell Billy IL 1988 1997
Warney Douglas NY 1997 2006
Washington Earl VA 1984 2000
Washington Calvin TX 1987 2001
Waters Leo NC 1982 2003
Waters Kenny MA 1983 2001
Watkins Jerry IN 1986 2000
Watkins John Kenneth AZ 2004 2010
Webb Mark TX 1987 2002
Webb Troy VA 1989 1996
Webb Thomas OK 1983 1996
Webster Bernard MD 1983 2002
White John Jerome GA 1980 2007
White Joseph NE 1989 2008
Whitfield Arthur Lee VA 1982 2004
Whitley Drew PA 1989 2006
Williams Michael Anthony LA 1981 2005
Williams Dennis IL 1978 1996
Williams Willie GA 1985 2007
Williams Derrick FL 1993 2011
Williamson Ron OK 1988 1999
Willis John IL 1992, 1993 1999
Willis Calvin LA 1982 2003
Winslow Thomas NE 1990 2009
Wise Korey NY 1990 2002
Woodall Glen WV 1987 1992
Woodard James Lee TX 1981 2009
Woods Anthony D. MO 1984 2005
Wyniemko Kenneth MI 1994 2003
Yarris Nicholas PA 1982 2003
Youngblood Larry AZ 1985 2000
What, are you comparing women to lightning now, that they have no control over their actions but they’re merely a force of nature? How low your opinion of women must be.
(Sorry, got margined away for a minute there).
Interesting list. What are its parameters? It’d be interesting to filter it and compare it a few different ways:
If you can actually perform these analyses, awesome, but if not, they may serve as questions: as awful as a false accusation is for an individual victim of it, victims overall may be vanishingly small, and be more along the lines of being a victim of a terrorist incident: sucks to be you, but also really unlikely to be you, and not really worth worrying about in advance. (Especially if you’re a white middle-class male, if I’m correct about who the victims of false accusations tend to be.)
I suspect those falsely convicted are more likely to be poor, thus (in the US) more likely to be non-white.
However, for the reasons I suggest, those in certain specific professions - thus more likely (in the US) to be white, and by definition middle-class - are more likely to have their lives disrupted by false accusations, though they are highly unlikely to be convicted of such.
Here’s that article, complaining about teachers:
Obviously, most of these cases never get to see a criminal court, much less a conviction. Point here is that an accusation can do you a lot of damage without a false conviction (which are I would think as rare as hen’s teeth, statistically speaking).
I can’t do those queries (at least not at present; I’ll ask someone and get back to you).
And of course I personally am not a white middle-class male, so the safety of that class (to the extent it exists) is of no comfort to me.
But the list was presented primarily to counter this statement:
Overall, we can return to previous studies about the incidence of false rape accusation, such as the 1994 Kanin study of over a hundred rape cases in one midwestern city, described thusly:
The result? 41% of reported forcible rape cases were found to be false.
And:
A forty percent rate does not, to my mind, suggest the word “rare.”
I’d be interested to see how many of those were the situation being discussed in the thread - where a woman directly accuses an individual of rape, and that person is then arrested and convicted. As opposed to a situation where the wrong person is convicted of rape or sexual assault.
Don’t know how we’d find those numbers though.
Without DNA, it’s difficult to imagine a situation in which a conviction for rape or sexual assault is obtained without the testimony of the victim.
Note his order, though. Plenty of situations might go like this:
Woman: I was raped by a 6’ tall man with purple hair!
Police: [arresting 6’ tall purple hair] Is this the guy?
Woman: I think so–no, wait, I’m sure it is!
He was asking how many aren’t like that, but are rather like this:
Woman: Joe raped me! He lives at 62 Edgewood Court!
Police: [arresting Joe at 62 Edgewood Court] Is this the guy?
Woman: Yeah, that’s Joe!
The question is whether the former situation is the one that results in most of the false convictions. Those are much more attributable to honest error than the latter situation.
Well I was thinking many of those may be DNA situations - the ones I have heard about in the press tend to be. Man is convicted of rape, later when the semen/other DNA evidence is tested it couldn’t be his. And even if the victim’s testimony is there, that doesn’t put it into the category of this thread per se. Victim can testify she was assaulted by a tall, white, bearded man in a park on Thursday night. She testifies truthfully in court that the defendant appears to be her assailant. He was in the park that night, is tall, white and bearded. She testifies she scratched her attacker’s face and the defendant has scratches on his face. Defendant is actually innocent, but is convicted. Later an alibi witness comes to light (known to the police but not disclosed to the defense because of a misguided belief by the police that the witness was lying/mistaken). Convicted man now exonerated.
A false allegation of rape is a hideous thing - and I’d like to see people prosecuted in some situations for it. Not least because it makes actual rapists harder to convict. I just haven’t seen anything compelling to suggest that false allegations of rape are any more prevalent than false allegations of other serious offenses, especially once the initial stage is past and charges are filed. Linda Farstein, a Manhatten DA, wrote a great book on this which I can dig out after I help my buddy move his car.
ETA - what LHOD said.
My sense is that many rapists go unconvicted and that it’s often hard to prove rape. It’s possible to frame people for almost any crime, of course, but I suspect there are many rapes that really happened but could not be proved compared to those the didn’t happen and were “proved” anyway.
While working at a brig in Norfolk, VA, I knew a kid from the midwest, maybe 19 or so, and he looked meek as a lamb. He was there for attempted murder. I had to take him to and from his court-martial (lasted almost 2 weeks if I remember right). He was all in love with some girl on his ship, but was “friend-zoned” by her. One day, she came to him sobbing, saying this other guy on the ship - a big hispanic guy who he didn’t know much - raped her. Long story short, our star slit the big guy’s throat (he survived).
Upon hearing about this, the girl admitted she was never raped.
Mr. Midwest is back in the midwest, chillin’ in Fort Leavenworth for a couple decades.
The moral of the story? I haven’t the damnedest clue. Maybe you can try slitting the accused rapists’ throat, and see if she confesses. If that happens to be yourself, I’d advise doing it near a hostpital.
Disclaimer: My advice may be bad.