You hang out with some wusses, then. I didn’t want to quit, but I did.
You do realize that marijuana is not chemically addictive, right?
Please, go on, and do link us to the scientific journals.
“Dude, got an eighth? I’m out”
I know quite a few people who smoke and don’t want to quit. Yeah, they know the risks, but they enjoy it. To each his own.
Sure, everything you do affects your life. What I was talking about was deleterious effects-- negative consequences.
Uh, no . . . what you’re talking about is tolerance. Addiction is when a person feels a physical craving for a substance and/or has unpleasant symptoms if he does not have it. Addiction is when a person feels they HAVE to have the substance-- also known as dependance.
If a person is a chronic heavy user, or long-term regular user, yes, their tolerance may increase, but for the person who imbibes only on weekends or only occasionally, it’s unlikely his tolerance will change drastically. Nor is it a given that he will become dependant.
Me? Who said this was about me?
I do know several drug users. All of them are decent, hardworking people. If you ran into them on the street, the last thing you’d imagine is that they indulge. One fellow I know has used marijuana for almost a quarter of a century now. He certainly has no interest in quitting.
In fact, none of the marijuana smokers I know have ever expressed a desire to quit. (One fellow I did know had to quit because of a new job which required urine testing, which he did with absolutley no trouble–besides nostalgia-- after having smoked marijuana for a decade.) They don’t want to quit because there are no negative consequences in their lives for smoking it. So, they say, why not enjoy?
If I used drugs, I’d have no problem telling my children about it. I’d rather have a frank, honest discussion about the realities of drug use than the scare-mongering crap that D.A.R.E and their ilk try to instill in our children, only to lead them to be dissillusioned and cynical when they find out differently. I’d rather be open with my children than have them find out I’m a liar later in life.
I’d tell them that for kids, drugs and alcohol are dangerous. They’re simply not prepared for intoxication at their age, and are not responsible enough to handle it, nor can it be good for their growing bodies. For adults, however, I strongly believe in personal choice.
I think for a lot of people, the knee-jerk reaction to drug use is because of a miguided Puritan ethic that if something is done sheerly for pleasure’s sake, it’s bad. Some people view anything with hedonistic tinges with suspicion and disapproval just on general principles. They’re the people that when you ask why it’s bad, they can only stammer, "Because it just IS!"
For others, it’s just fear and ignorance. Stereotypes, urban legends, and fear-mongering media stories have programmed people to make black-and-white judgements about something they understand very poorly.
Lissa, that was a great post.
Of course, I probably think so because I was composing one that hit all your points:D, with the exception that I do occaisionally indulge. (Disclaimer–It’s illegal in the US and other countries.)
Wonderful post Lissa, I couldn’t agree more.
I’m curious lekatt, do you feel such a strong resistance towards those who partake in a glass or two of wine with dinner?
For many people who spoke a bowl on the weekends, it’s basically the same thing. It has the same effect and the same negative consequences (namely, none).
Personally, I lead a really stressful life. I work 40+ hours a week at a fast paced, high stress job and attend law school in the evenings. I get about 5 hours a week of chill time, when I’m not working, in class, studying or sleeping. And that includes weekends. So during those few hours I’ve got to chill out, I often enjoy a bowl. To me, it’s not only not detrimental, it’s beneficial. It allows me to relax when I otherwise wouldn’t really be able to.
Do I need it? Of course not. If my stash is tapped out, I don’t go robbing the nearest 7-11 to get enough dough for my next fix. I don’t start twitching or exhibiting any sort of withdrawl symptoms. I’m cool. No biggie. I’ll wait until I get a chance to get some more.
And you know what else? Saturday morning after smoking Friday night, I’m back in the library, studying away. Same for Sunday morning. And Monday morning I’m back at work, being a productive member of society.
The truly shocking thing is that 95% of the pot smokers I know treat it just the same as I do. I was personally shocked to find out how many there were out there, who were professional, hardworking people such as myself, who work harder and have got more ambition and drive than most straight-arrow, sober people. I’m willing to bet you’d be very suprised at how many pot smokers you know. They’re most likely just afraid to admit it to you for fear of your good intentioned, though terribly mislead attempts at an “intervention” that you’ve displayed in this thread.
It doesn’t matter how many people do it, it’s still wrong.
It’s against Federal law, it harms your body and brain.
It’s use is not necessary.
There will be future consequences if you continue, jail, lost jobs, family problems, the same stuff as with alcohol, I am asking you to stop, consider your future.
Love
Why is it wrong?
“Marijuana - Legalize It?”
It already is. (where I’m at, heh heh). At least I think it is, have been some times since I did any myself.
It ain’t nobody’s business but their own (and the dope dealers) what adult people choose to smoke or not smoke. The state should keep its grubby little fingers out of our lives and stop acting like a nanny.
Much as I am wary of joining a debate with somebody who believes that dreams are real, I must ask:
Do you advocate the legal Prohibition of alcohol?
Are you a prophet? I have heard this crap from others, and it has not happened to me or to others I know.
In other words: Cite?
I’d ask respectfully that you open your mind a bit to experiences and opinions that differ from yours.
I’d also remind you respectfully that we’re in Great Debates, where making blanket statements without providing sources to back them up is considered bad form.
Also, why would I stop doing something that’s beneficial to me, that results in no negative side effects or consequences, because some stranger on a public message board claims it’s going to destroy my life despite no hard evidence or sources to back up the claim?
We’re not talking about heroin or meth. We’re talking about weed. It’s safer than alcohol, which is legal. (By the way, don’t think no one has noticed that you’ve refused to answer multiple queries re: whether you would like to see alcohol banned).
The world, nor anything in it, is not black and white. There are multiple shades of grey and absolute failure or refusal to see those shades of grey is a sign of a weak, simplistic mind.
[QUOTE=lekatt]
It doesn’t matter how many people do it, it’s still wrong.
[/quote)
You’d need to elaborate a little more. Why is it wrong, exactly? Is it more or less wrong than drinking alcohol (which has vastly more harmful effects and is addictive), or even coffee, since you mentionned that cafeine too was a drug?
That’s precisely why people are discussing about this issue. Should it stay forbidden. It’s not like all laws are absolutely perfect and never need to change.
You don’t know anything about marijuana, do you? How does it harm your body, exactly?
And concerning your brain, to my knowledge, marijuana has two negative side effect. For certain people, it can cause panick attacks. I should know better, since it’s precisely the reason why I haven’t been smoking it for a long time. But there are very few people who are so affected, though I’ve known a couple others. It can also have an adverse effect on schizophrenic people, aggravating their symptoms. It has already be mentionned in this thread, and a friend of mine (and former marijuana smoker) has this condition too.
But these are only a concern for an extremely limited sample of the population, and it certainly not a reason to ban it. Peanuts have an adverse effect on allergic people too, but we’re not going to forbid peanuts consumption for everybody for this reason.
Watching TV, having sex or posting on a message board isn’t necessary, either…
You’re totally mistaken. Alcohol is a way more dangerous drug than marijuana. It causes many major health issues, even resulting in death. There’s no such consequences with marijuana. More importantly, contrarily to what you seem to think, marijuana isn’t addictive. You don’t need it, even if you smoke it regularily, contrarily once again to alcohol. You don’t become dependant of marijuana. You can’t quit smoking this stuff whenever you want and you won’t feel any craving, contrarily to cigarettes, for instance (I should know better since as I already mentionned, I quitted smoking marijuana with absolutely no problems, but failed several times to quit smoking cigarettes). Alcohol is addictive.
Jail might be a real risk, but that’s because the stuff is forbidden. If the laws were changed, and it’s precisely what we’re talking about, you wouldn’t risk any more to end up in jail. So, it’s irrelevant to the discussion. People wouldn’t be jailed if it was legalized, hence it can’t be an argument against legalizing it. Same things for losing your job.
And what kind of family problems would it cause??? The only one I can think of is if, say, one is married with someone like you who can’t bear pot smokers.
Honestly, you’re totally clueless about pot. This thing is vastly less harmful and detrimental than alcohol. Actually, it’s essentially not harmful at all, except for some rare people I already mentionned and when people drive under influence.
Yes, it’s wrong to break the law, but other then that, WHY ELSE IS IT WRONG?
You can go to jail.
All companies test for drugs, if the test is positive, you will not be hired and you will never be hired at that company. Some companies share their lists of unemployables.
Drugs will deterate your health over time. If you need a cite you are not serious.
Drugs impare your judgement, and most who take them will deny this and drive anyway.
People who love you don’t want to see you throw you chances at life away on drugs, it hurts them to see you stoned. Your family, your children, and me.
Please stop doing drugs, now, while you still can, they are addictive, no matter what you think.
Love
If it remains illegal you will go to jail, yes. But that’s not what you were asked, was it?
Companies can do drugs test and fire you for those reasons. They are stupid companies to work for. If you are fired for smoking dope (if it was legal) then you should be fired for smoking tobacco as well. What I do in my own home, legally, should be no concern of my employer.
Drugs deteriorates your health, fast food deteriorates you health, aging deteriorates your health. So what?
Drugs do impair judgement. That is why we have laws against things like drink driving. 99% of drug users would respect laws against them driving under influence. That still doesn’t stop the 1%, but that’s the same for those on alcohol now.
Stop going on about how drug use, any drug use, ruins families and leaves you worthless and alone. You smoke and you have a happy life, no? So can’t you understand that you have no actual concept, let alone experience, of what could actually happen with sensible use of drugs? Just reiterating your points doesn’t make them right, you know.
There is no such thing as sensible use of illegal drugs. The statement is irrational.
I keep repeating the dangers because they are real and present.
All companies, repeat, all companies test for drug abuse, it is required by their insurance companies.
Don’t throw your career away on a stupid act.
http://www.teens.drugabuse.gov/mom/mom_mj3.asp
Read the same for other sources, I could supply a hundred.
Please don’t do drugs, don’t crash and burn before you learn how to fly.
Love
The statement is not at all irrational. However, just to go along with you, does that mean you can sensibly use marijuana in countries where it is legal (or states where it is legal, since possession of marijuana is not illegal in every US state) but not in countries where it is illegal? If the illegality is the problem, then it is easy to fix, no? If it is not the illegality that is the problem, then why keep mentioning it?
From firsthand experience, I and others can definitively state that this is clearly false.
Regardless, you can’t test for “drug abuse.” Using a drug and abusing a drug are completely different, and there is no objective test for determining abuse, but rather there are certain general criteria that must be met and observations made. A urine test or blood test doesn’t test for abuse, merely use.
If you were really interested in promoting love, you would actually study the subject. The way drug users are treated in the United States and the War on Drugs does far more damage to society and to drug users than the damage caused by the actual use of the drugs. Drugs are a health problem (if they’re a problem at all), nothing more and nothing less. Every drug has its costs and its benefits, and individuals should not be punished criminally for weighing and acting on those costs and benefits.
I suppose you could find some very small companies that don’t test. OK, Most companies test for drug use.
Now I did not make the laws, and some of them might not be that good, but they are the law, and you will get thrown in jail for illegal drug use.
I had a prof, in college that was a member of the ACLU. Occassionaly a student would want him to help them with the courts after being caught using illegal drugs. He was a kind, intelligent person, he said “you knew the law and you did it anyway, I’m sorry, I can’t help you.”
If you fight the law, the law will win.
Please don’t do drugs, get smart.
Love
lekatt, we are trying to discuss whether drugs (marijuana, specifically) should be illegal, not whether they should be used. If you decide that you want to contribute to that discussion, let us know.
I actually wish someone who was against legalization and had some arguable reasons would show up. As it is now, this thread is pretty much a bunch of people saying “ditto.” If the topic was expanded to discuss all illegal drugs instead of just marijuana, there would be more diversity of opinion. I tend towards what I would guess is a libertarian view in regard to drugs, which is that they should all be legal unless the legalization would directly harm others. For instance, antibiotics should remain available by prescription only because overuse of them can result in resistant strains of the things they are used to treat.
Why are you still going on about the illegality, lekatt? We have said time and time again.
This is not about supported drug use when it is illegal. It is about discussing whether or not it should be legal. You have said no. We get that you are opposed. We get that it is illegal. We do not have to be told several times, like some people.
I don’t think there actually is a logical argument against drugs, other than that banning all drugs prevent unnecessary harm to your body. To be against one drugs is to be against them all really, you can’t support caffeine or nicotine when it has the same narcotic and addictive effect of, say, cocaine or heroin. Obviously one is stronger than the other but it makes their effects no less reason to ban them.
You are totally, flat out wrong about this. Please quit making stuff up to suit your arguments.