“We have concluded the rocks here were once soaked in liquid water,” said Steve Squyres of Cornell University. He’s the principal investigator for the science instruments on Opportunity and its twin rover, Spirit.
“The second question we’ve tried to answer: Were these rocks altered by liquid water? We believe definitively, yes,” said Squyres.
Well, it certainly increases the chance that there was once life on Mars. But until we get down to some serious study to find it (if it exists or existed I should say) we won’t know for sure.
I doubt whether the existance of liquid water on Mars (something thats been suspected for quite a long time) will have a profound effect on our outlook about ourselves or our view of the universe though. Finding life on Mars or maybe Europa though…THAT would fit the bill of changing our outlook.
For the past decade or more , we’ve been told that water once flowed on Mars. Then, the evidence was macro-level-- photos of large valleys and river deltas .Today’s announcement is of new evidence at the microscopic level. The new evidence is nothing more than additional support for the older theory.
It’s nice, but no revolution.
Yes, and no. Over the last few years, I think quite a few scientists were beginning to doubt the past existence of liquid water on Mars, as some of the old theories about liquid water causing those macro level features were being questioned- some were saying that it was carbon dioxide leaching or some such. In any case, there were a raft of explanations for everything we had seen on Mars that didn’ involve liquid water. So today’s announcement is quite significant, though as a cynic I’m waiting for the next group of geologists to find another non-water explanation for what’s been found!
First of all, the probabilities for of life elsewere in the universe have increased. I do think now that every star with a planetary system, can have 2 planets with liquid water and capable of supporting life.
OTOH this also means that a planet with plenty of water can become waterless and dead way before the star expands and burns everything. Instead of counting with billion of years, intelligent life will have less time to figure out were and how to travel to other planets. Before, the big problem was the star expanding (or it blows up, take your pick). Now, it looks like only a few hundred million years are needed to turn a planet with plenty of water into a desert. For us living today, this is no problem. For the future of humanity, this is a fearful lesson.
It took us 2 million years to go from stone tools to do baby steps in space. We have plenty of time, but I do wonder if we will blow it for the future generations before they inherit the universe.
Who says Mars is dead?
While the “shrimp” in this picture, and the “rotini” in this one (in the crevice near the pics center) hardly constitute proof that there ever was life on Mars, if there were lifeforms complex enough to leave macroscopic fossils it’d be an indication of an ecosystem that was far enough along to be difficult to kill off.
I think the scientists are once again being too hopeful, I’d like to talk with one of them when they get back see why they conclude this is and not other possibilities.
It is quite possible that Mars was once soaked in an Acid Bath…it would have the same oxydizing effect that water does, and I don’t see how any chemical situations on Mars today shows either one senario or the other.
If they say they found the microscopic evidence then there’s no reason to disbelieve it, but I’d sure like to see the Data myself, or hear it from one of them just to know why to them, the Data is conclusive over the top that it was Water that soaked Mars, and not an Acid.
Good news, but I don’t think this is the mystery solving Data set, after all it is only a picture of a small crater of this planet, it is hardly a comprehensive view of the whole World. We’d need to go there ourselves to get that much information.
I think the suggestion is that it was acidic water, at the least. I would expect a bath of acid to leave copious amounts of a particular salt, though, wouldn’t it? And besides, there’s already water on Mars, in the polar caps. If the place could support lakes of liquid acid, it likely had the atomospheric pressure and temperature to support liquid water. Since there’s already water there, you would assume that there was water in the past. Which would be liquid. So, even if this is nothing but the sign of a pure acid lake, there must have been some liquid water someplace else, right? And would it not be in a cycle of precipitation like on Earth? I would think so. If so, how could the acid stay pure? It would mix with water in the cycle of precipitation one way or another. They say there’s lots of sulphur at the site…pure sulfuric acid has a melting point higher than water (10 deg. C). So even if it was pure sulphuric acid, and it was liquid (as it would have to be to make an acid bath) it’s plenty temperate enough for liquid water. True, sulphuric acid has a much higher bioling point than water (337 deg. C), but would we argue that this place was once so hot that only water vapor existed?
The sulfates (as I understand it) only get formed on Earth by dissolving it in water and letting it evaporate. They made up about 40% of the rocky outcrop which was examined.
Also the jarosite found by the spectrometer is sulfate/hydrate, it must have water to create it. This is just my take but I aint no scientist.
Well Loopydude, the point is there are other alternatives, as you pointed out an acidic water solution would have an oxydizing effect. And I would think that provided correct conditions over time, the only evidence of an “Acid Bath” that would remain is the Iron-oxide.
However, the point I’m trying to not make is not that they are wrong, they might be right, but that is this another hopeful conclusion or is it a beyond the doubt conclusion?
It looks like it is pretty solid.
But given the history of studying Mars, it is very well possible that Life-seeking hopefuls are just seeing what they want to see. The conditions on Mars could have been very aqueous and still not be viable to life forms.
And considering that Earth’s strongest life forms live near volcanic vents, I think we’d definately need to take a larger look at Mars’s Volcanoes than its possible watersheds.
Yes, but I don’t think that any scientists are saying that the (probable) existence of water on Mars at some time in the past proves that there was life there. It does, however, mean that it is more likely that life as we know it (that is, using water as a solvent) may have evolved on Mars at some time.
First of all, you’re assuming that the distribution of life on Earth can be carried over to that on Mars. Even if that were true, many more species have evolved in or around water than volcanoes.
So, if once there was water, or acidic water, or some kind of liquid on the surface of Mars in sufficient quantities to form lakes and rivers – where has it gone? Under the ground? Evaporated into space? Seems hard to believe there could be that much liquid locked up in the polar ice caps. Mars is cold enough to be permanently covered with ice, like Antarctica – but it isn’t. Where is the water?
This link is very good for describing the history of the Martian atmosphere, the mechanisms by which it may have been lost, and the way water related features have been created both before and after the loss of the bulk of that atmosphere…
I’ve had the privilege of speaking with any number of JPL people after various local public events. The impression I get from most of them is not that they are, by and large, rabid exobiologists, although there are some. I always get the feeling they talk about life on Mars as a way to get headlines, and hopefully, funding.
When they talk about water on Mars, their eyes usually light up more when they consider the possibilites for separating the Hydrogen and Oxygen to make more rocket fuel. Existing life would get in the way of that, actually.
Heh, yes, well still all I was saying is I just hope it’s not another wishful jump to conclusions. But like I said, in this time, it probably isn’t.
Squeegee “Um, where exactly do you think they’ve gone?”
They went to JPL and are staying there on “Martian” time until the Rovers “die” from power loss.
dwalin, “First of all, you’re assuming that the distribution of life on Earth can be carried over to that on Mars. Even if that were true, many more species have evolved in or around water than volcanoes.”
Actually the first life most likely evovled around underwater thermal vents (close enough to a Volcano). Or it really gained a strong foot hold there after it was created…say by organic compounds struck by lightning or whatever…
[evangelist]My frey-unds, the recent announcement that the planet Mars was once covered with water is a blessing for the faythfull. For you see, it is nothing more, and at the same time nothing lesssss, than a glorious testimony to the almighty and proof of the enduring truth that is the Bah-ble.
It is clear to me (smack podium) and to all who choose to see, that…Mars, created at the same tahme as the earth which we call home, was also blessed with the miracle of liyfe. Indeed, it may even be that Mars and the Earth were much more alike than they seem today.
Pause
But why, you ask, is Mars do different today? Why, reverend, is it bare and lahfless?
The answer my frey-unds, can be found in the book of Genesis. For it is written that the lor-duh grew angry and chose to smite the unbelieverrrs with a flood. A great flood that COVERED THE EARTH! But one man and his family were saved to start again. Yes my frey-unds, I am speaking of Noah. The ancestor to us all who was the only truly right-e-ous man in his tahme. He and his sons and their obedient wahves took in the animulls two by two. And only because of them, and the mercy of the lor-duh are we here today.
But what does this have to do with Mars? You ask? The answer my frey-unds is obvious.
MARS HAD NO NOAH! Nobody among the once glorious people of Mars was devout enough to be saved and the vengeance of the lor-duh, was visited upon that planet, as a lesson for us all today.
