Martin Luther King was conservative

I have always heard this line trotted out, and I decided to dive into the internet to find something that articulates this view:

From http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2006/01/martin-luther-kings-conservative-legacy:

I disagree already but let’s read some more.

No, his primary aim was to change the law that made it a crime for a black person to sit in the front of the bus. And this is in fact what happened. And if it had been his aim to make “neighbors of enemies”, he failed miserably. The actions of the Montgomery Bus Boycott–along with the decision of Brown vs. the Board of Education which preceded it–was only the beginning of the civil unrest and divisiveness that would mark the 1950s and 60s.

Which makes Dr. King different from any other social activist of the 20th century how? Malcolm X also thought that the Founding Father’s had great principals. But he, like Dr. King, recognized that the principals were never implemented and that it was time for people to stop pretending that they had been. Is there a companion piece to this one esteeming Malcolm X’s conservativeness?

Liberals aren’t in opposition to religious faith. Some of the most devout people I know are liberals–and use their faith to inform their politics. Unless the author can produce a cite showing that King advocated a government infused with a specific religious belief system, then all we can really say is that King, as a man of the cloth, was appealing to the religiousity of his audience, who needed to hear that God was on their side. If he had been Buddhist and had said a just law was a “code that squares with the universal righteousness of the Noble Eightfold Path”, I doubt he’d been seen in the same light. So it’s not his spirituality that the writer has latched onto. But his open belief in a Christian God.

This is just crazy. Liberals don’t have morality? They don’t judge people based on the content of their character? The writer seems to be conveniently forgetting that many conservatives do NOT judge based on the content of character. They judge based on appearance, even apart from race, and they always have. “Long-haired hippie” is not a term that liberals coined. If I walk into the uber progressive Quaker church up the street with tats on my arms and spiked hair, either no one will bat an eye or I’ll get complimented. Will this happen if I walk into the Church of Christ church? I grew up in a pentacostal church. I know the answer to this question.

Liberals are not perfect, mind you. But from my experience, they tend to stay away essentialist arguments. If a certain racial demographic is disproportionately represented in crime statistics, they tend to seek external variables such as socioeconomics and discrimination in the justice system to explain this pattern. Conservatives seek internal variables, such as moral failings of the family structure brought about through inferior genetics and/or culture. Because these factors are intrinsic, they are used to justify prejudice (“Blacks can’t help being dumb and sociopathic, but I don’t see why I have to hire 'em.”)

The same with gender. Liberals are more open to the idea that our notions of differentness are social constructs. Men and women are different biologically, but gender roles are primarily the result of culture. Conservatives see differentness as being fundamentally real, not products of our imagination. That is why they have always opposed social movements that change power imbalances between groups. They see these imbalances not as the result of cultural whims–but the outcome of nature. It is natural for blacks to be subservient to whites. It is natural for women to be in the home, barefoot and pregnant. It is natural for the rich to get richer. Etc. etc.

For us to believe the author that judging people as individuals is a conservative philosophy, we’d have to throw out the overwhelming pile of evidence that goes against this. And I’m not buying that simply judging people is a conservative thing. Everyone judges people based on their own set of values. Everyone has their own code of ethics and morality. It’s just that some people are more vocal about their judgment.

And this is why Barack Obama was admired by conservatives for working as a community activist before turning to politics. Oh, wait! This didn’t happen. Just like the conservatives of his day didn’t admire MLK for working with his community. They saw him as “rabble-rousing”. He would have been rabble-rousing whether he had been a politician or a humble preacher.

It’s actually funny because conservatives have NEVER been shy about mandating social change through legislation. We are seeing this right now. But unlike the author, I don’t see a problem with trying to get your voice heard using political machinary. A movement has many fronts, and grass-roots activism doesn’t effect much change if it only stays in the grass.

This implies that King would have been anti-Affirmative Action. That’s a mighty big assumption. And it again ignores someone like Malcolm X, who was much more self-deterministic than King. As a defender of 2nd amendment rights, I would think Malcolm X would be very much admired by conservatives.

King was not considered the poster boy for conservatism when he was alive. I don’t understand why we should consider him one today.

Can anyone provide a better argument for King being a conservative? And not just a conservative of his day, but one based on contemporary standards? Because the things I know about King–his views on racial and socioeconomic equality, his anti-war stance–do not align with conservatism. Sure, the things that would allow us to accurately nail him down on the political continuum–his views about social welfare programs, Affirmative Action, gay rights, economic regulation, tax laws, environmental protection–are not known. But it sure seems safer to put him in the liberal/progressive corner than the conservative one.

I think this is the core message here: “Today, this is the Conservative message.”

Good job, guys, it’s 2012 and you’re acknowledging that what Martin Luther King was saying back in 1955 was right. It’s nice to see you finally got on the bus, as it were.

It shows there’s hope that anyone can figure out what’s morally right if you give them enough time. Liberals can continue to work for social progress today, secure in the knowledge that the conservatives who are opposing them now will join the cause in fifty years.

Your link does’t work for me.

Certainly, at the time, it was not a conservative message. The conservatives fought his message tooth and nail. It had some trappings of what we associate with conservatism (religion), but that’s incidental. I think your analysis is sound, and the writer is really stretching things to claim what he is claiming. That is, if you are quoting the article fairly, which I have no reason to believe you are not doing, but can’t verify since the link doesn’t work for me.

Sorry about that:

When the conservative movement in America adopts most of King’s beliefs, not just the ones that are universally popular today, then they might lay claim to his mantle. But as long as they find “social justice” to be a deplorable thing, and view the crumbs that fall to the poor from the tables of the rich to be the only moral way for the poor to grow richer, they’re kidding themselves.

That’s always the nagging question, isn’t it? Are they kidding themselves, or kidding us, or some blend of both?

They claim Ayn Rand despite her being an atheist who was into free sex and birth control.

This also boggles my mind.

But not free birth control.

She still cashed here SS check and used Medicare :slight_smile: I’m betting she would have had her insurance pay for “free birth control” too :wink:

King wasn’t a conservative in his time nor do I necessarily think he’d be one now.

However if he had never been killed I imagine a King in his 80s would probably identify with at least some of the same things that religious fundamentalists identify with today.

I’ve known enough black baptist preachers here in Virginia at least to say that while some 80% of their politics on the real political issues (economics, social policy, labor policy etc) are Democratic in nature they to a one also have some of the social conservative positions of guys like Pat Robertson.

That doesn’t make them conservative nor would it make King a conservative, so the premise of the cited article is wrong. But if you were to take one strand and say it were true, it is true that many black religious leaders share certain social conservative values with Republican christian fundamentalists. They have too many differences to put them on the same side of the aisle though.

“Of all the forms of inequality, injustice in health care is the most shocking and inhumane.”

– Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

Well, that is another item that would make Dr. King to be at odds with the current conservatives.

Conservatives also claim, almost to exclusion, Jesus, the liberal guy who taught us to care for each other without abandon, to make peace not war, to judge not, the power and need of forgiveness, and the perils of wealth. Color me surprised.

I don’t see how forgiving people, charity, and not being greedy is contradictory with conservatism.

So was Stalin.

Some of these same idiots try to claim that the Nazis were leftist (because it was National Socialism).

Wasn’t health care more affordable in general in the 1960’s? I think MLK would see us as regressing. Whites whose parents were “middle class” are now getting the treatment blacks used to.

The barrel is pretty chock-a-block with fish. To keep with a recurring theme in the thread: how about pointing to a major Republican push on the “replace” part of “repeal and replace Obamacare.” Not too forgiving of people who fell on hard times (probably deserved it). Certainly not too charitable, and rife with greed.

Unless, of course, the vast majority of Republicans and associtated voting bloc aren’t true Scotsmen.

Considering the politics of his wife, Coretta Scott King, and his protégées Jesse Jackson and Joseph Lowery, I think the idea that King would have become a political conservative is a real stretch.

If Obama were to hold a prayer/press conference in which he begs God to forgive the US for all of its sins, historical and current, as well as all the sins of all the terrorists trying to get us, you better believe conservatives would be shitting bricks.

Do you remember the Republican debate where the crowd cheered at the notion of someone dying because he doesn’t have health care? And the folks on stage just smiled and said nothing? Do you think conservatives are in favor of social welfare programs, in general? If the government were to create a scholarship program for poor high school students, funded by savings resulting from cuts to military spending, do you think conservatives would be happy or angry? When the government was gushing billions of dollars of wasteful spending on an illegal war halfway across the world, did conservatives complain? Or did they complain when the government started talking about pulling out of wars and creating a system in which affordable health care was available to all citizens?

Way back when you were in kindergarten, I created a SD thread decrying budget slashes to the free/reduced lunch program and other welfare programs–including those devoted to the elderly and veterans. It was full of righteous indignation. Guess who complained about people “stealing” their money to give to the poor? Guess who wanted to shift the focus on fixing the moral failures responsible for hungry children rather than simply feeding the hungry children? Hint: It wasn’t our liberal posters. (Wow, reading that thread is weird. I was a Christian back in those days. A lot can change in ten years!)

In summary, forgiveness, charity, and not being greedy are certainly not in conflict with a political philosophy that is truly “Christ-like”. Conservatives can call themselves Christian and actually be telling the truth, but conservatism in its current political form is about as far from “Christ-like” as you can get. It’s embarrassingly greedy, war-mongering, and non-compassionate. I do not see how good conservatives can not see the contradictions of their brethren.