That’s you’re own fault then.
You posted the OS article in post # 4296.
The link was provided in a response to your post in post #4298.
If you didn’t see it, it’s on you.
here it is again
This has been out for months.
It is not established fact, but there is evidence that the incident began at the T because that’s where his keys were.
Yep, and there’s evidence that the incident ended 40 feet to the south, because that’s where Martin’s body ended up.
George doesn’t do a very good job of getting us from point A to point B, however.
No, but that’s apparently what happened.
And you don’t find it odd that George can’t construct a reasonable story as to how it happened?
Interesting.
Why would the location of the keys indicate the location of the initial incident?
That doesn’t really match Zimmerman’s version of events of where Martin’s dead body ended up. It seems to me the location of the dead person is vastly more important than the location of someone’s keys; the keys could have been dropped at any time, whereas Martin was dropped only once. If in fact Zimmerman was ambushed there, as he (and you) have claimed, and was knocked to the ground and “relentlessly” beaten, how did Martin’s body end up so much further south? Did this relentless beating somehow inolved Zimmerman scooting himself forty feet south while lying on his back? That’s a trick.
Since this is the “humble opinions and speculation thread,” not the “state as proven facts things that are not proven facts” thread, allow me to humbly speculate; a likelier version of events, to my mind, which would explain why Martin ended up dead south of the T-intersection, is that Zimmerman is lying; that, in fact, he went south from the T after Martin.
Again, that is my speculation, but it does match the facts as we have them; it’s a much better explanation than Zimmerman never going south. I don’t know how Martin ends up where he does if he attacks Zimmerman at, or west of, the T-intersection, and promptly knocks Zimmerman down and pummels him. He wasn’t shot by a cannon.
I’m not making an especially wild or crazy speculation there, either. It’s really the most logical explanation. It’s what gets Zimmerman and Martin to where it appears the altercation actually took place, and it’s consistent with what appeared to be his state of mind.
Now, whether or not the prosecution has some evidence to support my speculation I do not know. Angela Corey’s career is probably riding on it.
If you get punched in the nose, and dazed, covering forty feet isn’t difficult. That’s not far, and Zimmerman must have been trying to shimmy from under Trayvon. It seems more like making mountains out of molehills. IMO
If you get punched in the nose from a south-easternly direction, maybe stumbling forty feet -back- to the west/north-west might not be that difficult.
Getting punched in the nose and stumbling -forward- to the south is odd, don’t you think?
I don’t think people really appreciate that 50 feet is a sizable distance. It’s not the kind of distance someone would be expected gloss over in a story recounted from memory.
Zimmerman claimed that immediately after he was punched, he fell to the ground and stayed there until he fired on Martin. He repeated this claim multiple times when he was interviewed the night of the shooting.
Even in his reenactment, when it’s clear he realized his gaffe and added the “stumbling along, pushed along” detail to account for some distance, he’ still ended up placing the site of the shooting at least 30 or 40 feet away from where Martin’s dead body was found.
LOL at the notion that Zimmerman able to “shimmy” this length of distance while having a teenager pound his head in the concrete at the same time.
It is also consistent with the statements of W11 and W6. W6 was quite clear that the fight started far away and moved closer to him. The fact that the flashlight on the key chain was still on when the police got there is also indicating that Zimmerman was using the flashlight when he dropped it. In this case the physical evidence and the witness statements reinforce each other.
Yes. And both the physical evidence and the witness statements contradict George’s statements.
Lay down on your floor and try to shimmy forty feet. See what kind of effort and speed that entails even without someone straddling you and holding you down.
Walking forty feet is easy. Stumbling forty feet? Possible, I suppose. Shimmying forty feet? Not happening unless you are a snake.
The timeline was published nearly three months after the incident and I haven’t seen any article cited where the prosecution corrected it. The prosecution owns it now. You guys are arguing that some numbers in the reports are gospel and some are crap because 80 seconds makes it very hard to prove 2nd degree.
Does anybody actually have a cite from a newspaper that the timeline published in the Sentinel is wrong
Why the F*** do we need a cite from a newspaper that a timeline in another newspaper is wrong?
Once more - and I’ll type slow so you understand - WE. HAVE. THE. ORIGINAL. DOCUMENT.
So what? Is there some reason to think that the prosecution has to issue press releases about every detail included in the document dump?
It’s just one document among many.
I don’t think there’s any real content to this statement.
It’s still a document created by Singleton. the prosecution has not endorsed it. They have released it.
Your assessment of my motivations is faulty fyi. So don’t infer very much from your assessment.
The actual argument is that the system set up to accurately record time stamps on the event logs is more reliable than the notes taken from the records created by that system.
Just a quick question here.
How is a report about a report about the event log more authoritative than the actual event log?
Why are you trying to find a document which is even further removed? I don’t get it.
Why not just examine the primary document?
[QUOTE=JoelUpchurch;15303130 ]
The fact that the flashlight on the key chain was still on when the police got there is also indicating that Zimmerman was using the flashlight when he dropped it.
[/QUOTE]
Which is a fact that might end up further negating his already tenuous credibility.
IIRC, Zimmerman told the cops that the reason he didn’t immediately return to his truck after ending the call with nonemergency is because his flashlight wasn’t working and he was afraid of walking in the dark.
Oh it’s worse than that - remember he first says that he didn’t walk back because ‘he didn’t want to walk back in the dark’ (so I guess George just planned on wandering around until the morning?).
So he’s admitted that he didn’t go back to his truck right away.
His story now is that he was walking right back to his truck when he was ambushed by Martin the uber-criminal who successfully sneaked up behind his prey and…said something to him, giving George enought time to turn around and reach for his phone. Or something.
You really need to look at the evidence. Zimmerman had two flashlights, which were both found at the scene. The larger flashlight wasn’t working, so Zimmerman used the one on his keychain. I find it hard to believe that you are not aware of this.
Are you being obtuse on purpose? Do you suffer from some horrible reading disorder?
We’re aware of the fact that the flashlight on his keychain was working. Which is why we’re calling BS on his claim that he didn’t want to ‘walk back to his truck in the dark’.