Melin has been banned

[system]

Originally posted by StoryTyler:
I’m curious if anyone else (besides Melin) has received similar missives from this particular moderator on this particular subject. Hard to believe I’m the only one receiving snide, unprovoked comments via email…

Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

Count me in.

Right after the board came back up, I publicly thanked Melin for her help in getting the word out.

Here is the e-mail I received from Jill 2/27:

I also responded to countless IMs and email about tech problems on the board, and I couldn’t care less about getting publicly thanked for it.
But I would say the staff of the SD board took some undeserved flak from Melin in that thread, too.
Jill

Why she chose to send this to me, I don’t know. After a couple of exchanges, Jill replied:

Yeah, I did think it was a continued sarcastic attack against Tuba to call her touchy, etc. and say “she thinks she’s the only one who can talk to Ed.” It was hostile.

Melin still accesses our staff board. We don’t even want people to KNOW there is a staff board, which was made clear to Melin when she was staff. We don’t want people to look for it in order to hack into it. By mentioning it, it did appear that Melin wanted people to think she was on the staff. How else was it relevant at all?

Note that this exchange occurred 1 day before Melin’s letter to Ed. It also seems to imply that Jill is aware of more than what was included in Melin’s post:

They are apparently going to put in a server dedicated just to the
message boards (the staff board is down, too).

and Aster’s post:

I thought it was a good-faith gesture to the corporation to relinquish the
‘keys,’ but you’re still accessing stations you ought not have access to, in
your position. So, not only are you being petty, snide, and sanctimonious, but
sneaky as well, and shouldn’t be trusted.

It would appear that Jill is sending e-mails to people known to be on friendly terms with Melin & attempt to cast Melin in a bad light. At least that would be my interpretation of these messages.

---

Sue from El Paso

Experience is what you get when you didn’t get what you wanted.

UnBan Melin

[system]

Originally posted by Alphagene:

Sue, I poltely ask that you not use that sig outside the Pit, since it is clearly a “complaint… regarding administration of the SDMB”.

Bringing that disagreement into GQ or GD is inappropriate. Plus it means that regardless of the nature of the OP, I would have to “stay the fuck out of” whatever thread you post in, as per Ursa Major’s recommendation to me.

You want to continue to fight for your friend, go ahead. But please don’t do it in a forum where responding to your anti-administrative assertions would be inapproproate.

Thanks.

WTF? I thought NanoByte was the only one who felt obliged to respond to everybody’s sig line in every thread in every forum.

It seems to me that the only guidelines I’ve ever seen reference sig’s is kelli’s “If your sig line is regularly longer than your post, you’re going straight to Hell.” Fortunately, I’ve no worries there.

---

Sue from El Paso

Experience is what you get when you didn’t get what you wanted.

UnBan Melin

[system]

Melin asked me to pass this on:

It is posted here. Go to “More from Melin”.

There’s one more thing I wanted to add the other day, but couldn’t because I couldn’t reach MajorMD, who was on vacation, and get her permission. She has now posted on the Web Board, in the “Melin Has Been Banned” thread, and she has allowed me to discuss an email she had received (one in a series) on Feb 27 from JillGat. MajorMD quotes a portion of that email in her post, where Jill says in part:

“Melin still accesses our staff board. We don’t even want people to KNOW there is a staff board, which was made clear to Melin when she was staff. We don’t want people to look for it in order to hack into it. By mentioning it, it did appear that Melin wanted people to think she was on the staff. How else was it relevant at all?”

MajorMD shared that email with me at the time. This email was sent, with its comment that I was “still” accessing the board (and the implication that I shouldn’t have been), even after I had posted on mfsd that I had accessed with Dex’s permission, and after I had emailed to TubaDiva explaining about accessing with permission.

So, if you think I was paranoid about staff sending around emails about me accusing me of doing things I shouldn’t be doing, and sending them to other mfsd posters to make them think so too, perhaps now you understand a little more about why I came to that conclusion.

I am sorry for the mistakes I made in handling this situation. I am only human, as the cliche goes, and I am at least as likely to make mistakes as the next person, maybe more so. I am sorry for overreacting, sorry for not trying to resolve the matter in a less-lawyerlike manner, sorry for letting Terey and Jill and TubaDiva and Aster get to me with their digs. I should have handled it better. I’m even sorry for pissing off Ed; for a few minutes there I actually thought we were both trying to return to normal, civilized relations, which I’m sure we both would have preferred, and I blew it. It’s true; maybe since we had had that friendly conversation in the IM, he would have responded more positively than I gave him credit for if I had, as someone else put it, said “pretty please.” I should have at least made the attempt. So Ed, I’m sorry for not giving you the chance, for assuming that you would have simply blown off my concerns unless I carried a big stick.

And, amazingly enough, JillGat IM’d me on March 10, and somewhere in there we both kind of said I’m sorry to each other. I’d like to think that we both meant it.

Damn, it’s late, and I’m tired and weary. To all of you who are also weary of having to have lived through this, I apologize to you too for my part in it.

Love,

Melin

---

Sue from El Paso

Experience is what you get when you didn’t get what you wanted.

UnBan Melin

[Alphagene]

It seems to me that the only guidelines I’ve ever seen reference sig’s is kelli’s “If your sig line is regularly longer than your post, you’re going straight to Hell.” Fortunately, I’ve no worries there.

A sig line is part of your post. I’d rather you not drag your crusade all over the whole MB, no matter how noble you perceive it to be. I’m trying to appeal to your reason, not to Official Board Policy.

If you want to announce your feelings to provoke debate and change, keep it where debate is appropriate. If you just want to make a scene, you’re bordering on trolling, which is really something I’d rather not see from you, Sue.

Is all this really worth it?

---

Gypsy: Tom, I don’t get you.
Tom Servo: Nobody does. I’m the wind, baby.

[OliverTwistofLime]

Originally posted by OpalCat:
** Well no, it obviously isn’t a necessity. However I note that you registered in Feb 2000…Melin has been a part of this community for several YEARS. If you participated in a club for several years (for example) and were abruptly banned, it would probably bother you too.

**

OpalCat: Yes, I registered in Feb 2000. But I know what I think better than you or anyone else. I understand that you and Melin have been a member of the SDMB community for years and would be upset. So would I probably. But I would then remind myself of what my mother used to tell me: When you get kicked by a donkey, consider the source… And if I felt I was wronged or if I deserved being banished, I would still say Adios or perhaps Auf Wiedersehen and go attend to something more important and write to my Cyperfriends by e mail or other means in the future. Possibly tell the friends to join me at someother message board.

In any event, I find it impossible to determine who was wronged without knowing everything on both sides which no one can tell by just reading posts. I think people have showed Melin their support and sorrow and nothing more will be accomplished. The Die has been cast.

---

Don’t ever say 288 in polite company. Its just two gross!

[TwistofFate]

PCW, I’ll be sorry to see you go. this is getting ridiculous. We dont need our good posters going.

Melin contacted me yesterday with a very nice e-mail, which in part talked about sorting things out with the admins, and wanted someone to broker it.

Ed’s response removed all possibility of that.

This is my last post on the matter. The actions here sicken me.

[kellibelli]

I was not going to post anything to this effect until I saw PurpleCrackWhore’s post…and I felt compelled to agree.

Despite the personal enjoyment I get from the posters here, I cannot continue to patronize this board as long as the administration persists in this behavior.

I will miss my pals here, but by staying, I indicate with my silence, that I condone the actions taken. I dont.

I cannot sacrifice my self-respect in exchange for entertainment.

Marva said it all far better than I could. If anything should change here, email me.

[C_K_Dexter_Haven]

<< Mods took a position, on their own, about a board matter, and flung it at Melin. That position, of course, was that she was nosing around without authorization in restricted parts of the SD site, and that she was posing as a mod.

Did Ed fire them, like he did Melin? No. Did he call them on the carpet? No. I guess that because it was Melin, it was OK. >>

No, he didn’t fire them. He asked them to stop, they stopped. This was the original problem, too, BTW. Quoting from Ed’s last post: “For the record, she got into a public dispute with another moderator and kept arguing after I ordered her to stop, so I fired her.” Ed knows we’re all human, we make mistakes (I obviously made a mistake in asking Melin to finish up a Mailbag item after she was fired from staff, and I’m very sorry for the uproar that has caused.) When a staff member makes a mistake, Ed asks/tells them to desist, not to do it again, or to correct (as appropriate.) They comply. No problem.

And that’s the major distinction here. When asked to comply, someone who outright refuses to listen to Ed’s instruction, has no right to complain about being booted.

[Diane]

To those of you who feel the need to leave the board in some sort of protest - :rolleyes:

Anyone want to join a pool in betting on how many days it takes for them to come back?

I’ll say it again, I think it really sucks that Melin is banned and I will miss her, but the rest of you suffering from hysterics, IT IS ONLY A MESSAGE BOARD FERGODSAKE!

---

You turn me on. But maybe it’s because I just spent 20 years in the jungle, getting it on with anything I could attract with a piece of fruit.

[Coldfire]

I have very little to add: I hardly knew Melin, and I certainly never had any problems with her. But I do feel the need to express my anger at posters now attacking Ed Zotti over this. I’m sure he needs no defending (as he is probably quite capable to do so himself), but why don’t we all calm down for a minute and see what he REALLY did?

The Reader was threatened with a law suit. Eds bosses (who pay his fucking SALARY, mind you) got a bit nervous about the idea that a ticking time bomb was posting to the MB (hence, being in continuous contact with the MB and its staff). Whether or not Melin actually IS that ticking time bomb, is irrelevant. She certainly made it SEEM that way to threaten with a law suit, even IF she later withdrew that. So the guys upstairs decided that to avoid any unnecessary risk, Melin should be banned. Which Ed did.

Was the reaction from Eds bosses a knee jerk one? Perhaps.
But it was understandable.

Were their personal issues that may have influenced Eds decision (especially, the wording of the message itself) to ban Melin? Without any doubt, yes. To what extend, we do not know.
But you can’t blame the guy for being human.

Ed, I understand your decision and think nothing wrong of it, even knowing that it means that a poster like Melin (most of whose posts were really enjoyable and intelligent) will not be seen here anymore. I think your choice of words is mainly what got you into trouble here, what with the irritated undertone and all. But I understand it completely, and you’re quite forgiven for sounding somewhat annoyed.

Not that you NEED any of my forgiveness, of course

Furthermore, although I RESPECT the fact that people are deciding to leave over this, I absolutely do not UNDERSTAND it. For me, the board is the posters. I like most of the posters. Why would I leave over ANY administrative decision? Even if it DID affect one of my closest friends, that STILL wouldn’t be a good reason for me.

The only thing that could drive me away from this board is a lack of interesting topics. Either that, or a surplus of threads like this one.

Dixit.

[Yue_Han]

You FUCKERS!

I warned you.

The day this broke I said that the only result of bitching about this will be a lot of good people leaving the board.

Melin isn’t coming back. Ever. And the more shit you rake up, the more trouble you start, the more other people will leave for good.

YOU WILL NOT ACCOMPLISH ANYTHING POSITIVE BY DOING THIS. Arguing about this will destroy, not create. You are ravenous vengeful basrards.

And MajorMD- despite a disagreement in the past, I once had respect for you. But Melin=Christ?! WTF? Grab a clue with both hands and hang for life, you crazy bitch! She was banned from a messaage board. This isn’t even the only Straight Dope Message Board on the Net. She isn’t dead.

As a reasoning person the comparison is absurd.

As a Christian the comparison is insulting.

I hope you’re all happy with what you’ve done here.

–John

[Rysdad]

Originally posted by Alphagene:
** A sig line is part of your post. I’d rather you not drag your crusade all over the whole MB, no matter how noble you perceive it to be. I’m trying to appeal to your reason, not to Official Board Policy.

If you want to announce your feelings to provoke debate and change, keep it where debate is appropriate. If you just want to make a scene, you’re bordering on trolling, which is really something I’d rather not see from you, Sue.**

Shit. Sometimes ignorance wins.

Alpha, you suckup, I generally enjoy and respect your offerings, but you can take your nose out of Ed’s ass now.

BTW…does my sig annoy you?

Good.

---

I voted for Melin

[RTFirefly]

I may have misinterpreted the threads from last summer, CK, and if I did, I apologize.

I’d understood, from my reading of last August’s threads, that Melin kept on arguing with Ed (about the sudden expansion of the rule), rather than continuing to argue with Jill on the thread (after Ed told her about the rule change). My bad, if I got that wrong. (I went back and re-read Ed’s posts from the time; they’re not exactly clear regarding what or where Melin kept arguing. I guess I missed that detail in Ed’s last post on this thread.)

If Melin disobeyed an order (as opposed to arguing with her boss, for a reasonable length of time, about the advisability of the new policy), that’s a different thing. Even when the boss is wrong, you’ve got to shut up and fall in line, once you’ve given your best shot at trying to convince him to make what you think is the right decision.

My other objections to what Ed has said still stand. And I still think the bit about Melin’s sig line was a ridiculous bit of hooey: nobody could move their eyeballs to the left, and look under her name? Mods were being driven up the wall by her sig?

While I believe Ed was wrong to kick Melin off the board, I also believe it’s an issue where people of good will can disagree. But this business of overlooking more pertinent details, and responding to red herrings, and this business of supposedly not being able to kick someone off the board for threatening its existence (Ed’s claim, after all) but then doing so over the triviality of Melin’s sig line…geez. Not to mention the occasional ‘It’s my board, so I don’t have to listen to you’ attitude. No, he doesn’t, of course, but what’s your right, and what’s right, are more than occasionally distinct.

Ah well. I’m tired of beating my head against this one. The decision’s not going to be unmade, but unlike PCW and whoever else, I doubt I’ll stop posting here. See you in a better discussion soon, I hope.

[Nurlman]

You know, at this point, the horse’s carcass has long been dragged away to the glue factory, and you people are now reduced to standing around arguing about what color it was.

And what’s great about that is that intelligent people start to say really absurd things when they want to keep arguing but there’s nothing left to argue about.

My nomination for looniest argument is this one, by PurpleCrackWhore:

How is PROFESSIONAL prejudice any different than RACIAL or RELIGIOUS prejudice? Are all the lawyers on the board now a threat… or just the ones who use a Signature line that annoys you?? What about those posters who are married to lawyers?? Or those who happen to have lawyers as close friends? What if I shop where lawyers happen to shop? Does that make me susceptible also? I mean after all… I HAVE shared space with OMG…a LAWYER.

Folks, this is now officially Silly. Ed has made his decision. Those who are displeased with it have registered their feelings and have made all of the reasonable arguments there are in support of their position. Those who are pleased with the decision have done the same. There are enough facts and arguments here to allow anyone new to this dispute to completely evaluate what happened and form their own opinion with full awarenes of the issues. Let’s not belabor this anymore.

[coosa]

How many of you who are so vehemently defending Melin and vilifying Mr. Zotti and the rest of the staff have read the entire mfsd thread “And what the h is wrong with the web board anyway”? Especially those of you who are threatening to leave the board over this?

I did. The entire 147 posts, in order. I was also present when the original dustup occurred, read all of that (was actually upset enough to leave for awhile), and have been pretty much reading the board ever since.

I’m sorry, but Melin got what she deserved. I support Mr. Zotti 100% in this, and hope that he stands by his decision to never allow Melin to return to this board. I would not feel comfortable posting here if she did, and will not knowingly post to any board or newsgroup that she is a member of.

I can also find no fault with any of the other staff members, and they still have my respect and admiration.

I have, however, lost quite a bit of respect for several other posters here, who in my opinion have acted and are still acting in a very immature manner.

I’m sorry if this has created any enemies for me here, but I felt that since there have been so many negative and critical remarks addressed to Mr. Zotti and the rest of the SDMB staff, I should follow my convictions and speak out in support of them.

---

Some days you’re the dog, some days you’re the hydrant.

[Ed_Zotti]

Users are reminded that they are guests here and that we expect them to keep a civil tongue. The following are examples of unacceptable behavior:

You’re an idiot.

Oh, and Oblio, why don’t you OBLOWME!

Fuck you, Ed.

…

Grow a pair of gonads and admit your error, you weakling. You’re the one who should take a hike.

Fuck you again.

get a fucking clue.

…

As for your involvement with this issue, I only point out that you suck and have no background by which to have any opinion.

…

But for fuck’s sake, get out of this debate and leave it to those in the know.

…

I will poke my nose in when I see someone getting their nose into something they have no idea what the fuck they are talking about, and Calif, you are one of those.

If you thought an email to someone you know has no respect for you would be well-received, you’re a bigger fool than I gave you credit for. My bad. That you whine and moan about being hurt and misunderstood and wronged after doing so only underscores your disingenuousness and your pathetic need to play the martyr. And that’s YOUR bad.

…

Don’t you ever wonder why so many people don’t like you?

…

As far as I’m concerned, this little email issue is closed. Got that, Jillybeans?

And MajorMD- despite a disagreement in the past, I once had respect for you. But
Melin=Christ?! WTF? Grab a clue with both hands and hang for life, you crazy bitch!

Alpha, you suckup, I generally enjoy and respect your offerings, but you can take your nose out of Ed’s ass now.

Users are allowed more latitude of expression in the BBQ Pit than in other forums on the Straight Dope Message Board. That doesn’t mean anything goes. You are free to disagree with other posters or with the administration of this board in strong terms. You are not free to post gratuitous insults, obscene taunts or other unprovoked personal abuse. Further instances of such behavior will be deleted. Repeated violations in this or other threads may result in your being excluded from the Straight Dope Message Board.

[Alphagene]

Thanks for your brilliant insight into my behavior, Rysdad. Now let’s stop and think… what could I possibly gain by kissing Ed’s ass? My double postings will be deleted faster? Maybe he’ll shoot me a complimentary SD coffee mug? Gee whiz, won’t I be the luckiest poster in the world? Lord knows I have no desire to moderate.

I asked her to ditch the sig because we’ve done this shit before, Rysdad, and if you’ve read the various Melin threads, the vast majority of people here are either ready to move on, fucking tired of hearing about it or just don’t give a shit about this ex-poster.

It was boring hearing Melin bitch about it, it’s boring hearing Sue bitch about it, it’s boring hearing Opal bitch about it, and it’s really lame to see you bitch about it in a sig line just to spite little ol’ me. Or is your nose too deep in Melin’s crotch to notice that?

Melin’s gone and she’s not coming back. Go back and vote for her all you want, Rys. Give her a fucking tiara. Cannonize the broad, for all I care. She’ll still be gone. The difference between you and me is that I realize that in the grand scheme of the things the absence of Melin on this board has no real impact on my life whatsoever. But excuse me for not wanting one internet persona ruin this board more in her absence that she did with her presence.

She’s gone. And no “clever” sig or voting spree is going to bring her back. You can “Fight the Good Fight” and the rest of us can go on with our lives both on and off this board. Sound good? Swell. Enjoy.

---

Gypsy: Tom, I don’t get you.
Tom Servo: Nobody does. I’m the wind, baby.

[Dirty_Devil]

What Coldfire said.

(And PCW, you know I’ll miss you, but I think you’re making a mistake by leaving.)

[Ursa_Major]

That has got to be one of the most embarassing simulposts I’ve ever seen, Alph! I would suggest that the best way to let the matter drop is to stop protesting about those that won’t. By insulting posters who don’t agree with what happened here, you are simply provoking them to respond. You even started a thread questioning their motives. I know you’re smarter than that.

[Rysdad]

Originally posted by Ed Zotti:
** Users are allowed more latitude of expression in the BBQ Pit than in other forums on the Straight Dope Message Board. That doesn’t mean anything goes. You are free to disagree with other posters or with the administration of this board in strong terms. You are not free to post gratuitous insults, obscene taunts or other unprovoked personal abuse. Further instances of such behavior will be deleted. Repeated violations in this or other threads may result in your being excluded from the Straight Dope Message Board.**

Will this dictum be enforced more energetically than the “no jerks” rule has been?

---

I voted for Melin