Minorities in film/TV: Demonic or angelic, never mainstream

This discussion started in another thread asking people what they would like to see (such as in fiction) that is never shown.

I thought one line of discussion was worth spinning off into its own thread. It started when someone said:

And I replied saying that in the past gays, tribal people, racial minorities, foreigners, etc., used to always be portrayed with demeaning, insulting, or demonizing stereotypes.

Now, when they’re portrayed, the stereotypes are more often positive stereotypes, but they’re still marginalized because the audience is reluctant to accept minorities in the role of everyman.

I said that minorities will not start to be treated with the full range of fictionalized attributes until minority actors are accepted in roles that are not specifically written for minorities.

Then someone asked me if I was whooshing. I was definitely not.

Constanze then posted information about studies showing that movies suffer financially and audiences react negatively when minorities are cast in central roles.

Now I have come across an articleabout some viewers’ reactions to seeing black actors cast in major roles in The Hunger Games, even when the original novel described them as being dark-skinned:

So here we have it. Can we have a discussion about how people classed as minorities–whether based on skin color or sexual orientation or otherwise–still suffer from the assumption that they are not “regular Americans” and the mass audience is reluctant to accept them in mainstream roles? How black actors can’t try out for parts that aren’t pre-labeled as “black”? How black women–even the most spectacular actresses, like Halle Berry–hit a ceiling in mainstream entertainment?

And how all of this ties into the fact that where minorities were once commonly portrayed in the chains of negative stereotypes, have at the very least started to graduate to positive stereotypes, and so it’s not so unfair that when you do see a black character or a gay character that he or she will be “perfect” in some way?

It’s still racist (or some other “-ism”), but it’s a step forward.

It’s the same with aliens – either they’re wonderfully wise and godlike, or they’re completely evil. The one exception was Men in Black.

But movies deal in stereotypes all the time, even among non-minorities – the action hero, the evil villain, the love interest, the comic relief, the best friend of the female lead, etc.

there have been some small steps in “ethnic neutral” casting - Will Smith in various things as hero; Keira Knightley’s black husband in “Love Actually”(& the little white boy in the same movie has a crush on a black girl - race is not noted in either relationship).
But it’s going to take a long time. I thought gender equality would be here by now, but gender stereotyping is as strong as ever.
Stereotypes are lazy writing, and thus will probably continue.
Those twitter comments re the Hunger Games casting as pretty discouraging - but it’s only a very few out of hundreds of folks seeing the movie. There will always be hateful extremists. We can only hope for the majority culture to change.

My first thought was of Mitchell and Cam, the gay couple in Modern Family. They definitely exhibit some steroetypically “gay” mannerisms, but they are also portrayed as individual characters with strengths, weaknesses, and personality traits unrelated to their sexual orientation. Seems to me that fits with the OP, unless I’m reading it wrong. Do you want them to be gay, but no mention ever made of that fact? Because that would seem unrealistic.

Remember Charlie (Aisha Tyler) on Friends? They brought in a black love interest for Ross late in the show’s run, allegedly to counter criticism that there were no minorities on the show. But she *may as well *have been white. No mention was ever made of her ethnicity, no exploration of the challenge of interracial dating, no jokes about Oreos, nothing. Does anybody think that’s better, to scrub away any hint of a character’s heritage to the point of blandness?

A better example is Winston on New Girl. His blackness doesn’t define him, but on the other hand, he and the other characters seem to know that he’s black. Imagine that! I think the balance is about right there.

On Happy Endings, there’s an interracial couple that know they’re an interracial couple, and a gay guy whose running joke is that he does not appear to be gay. I don’t think any of the characters I’ve mentioned are either demonic or angelic. They’re just characters with various traits.

I do realize that all of my examples are sitcoms, but that’s what I tend to watch, so there you go. Sitcoms can be a decent window into current pop culture attitudes, though, and I think attitudes toward racial and sexual minorities are becoming more enlightened all the time.

Pieces Of April is a quirky little dra-medy from 2003 starring Katie Holmes as an estranged daughter that tries to cook Thanksgiving dinner for her family to reconcile, her boyfriend is black and it is one of the few depictions of a interracial couple that feels authentic and where it is irrelevant to the plot(it is used for some humor with her family). Amazingly as well he is depicted as a real person and not some kind of moral lesson, he buys stolen property because it is all he can afford. I wouldn’t go out of my way to see the movie but it really impressed me with how it was handled(it is hard to describe its all in the subtle things).

Interesting point about Will Smith. He claims that Cameron Diaz was replaced in Hitch by Eva Mendes because the studio said that the public wouldn’t accept a sexual relationship between a black man and a white woman.

Because Jennifer Aniston calling somebody an oreo (especially the girlfriend of one of her best friends) is the height of realism. :rolleyes:

Charlie’s race wasn’t a factor because it would have made absolutely zero sense to make her seem “more black.” She was a paleontologist like Ross. The vast majority of her scenes took place at a paleontology conference or at their college or in the Friends apartment. She acted like one of Ross’ nerdy girlfriends because that’s all she was.

And not for nothing, but Aisha Tyler is a massive nerd in real life too. By her own admission, she’s obsessed with home brewing and video games.

No, no, the one exeption is Star Trek… and Babylon 5… and Alien Nation… and… hmmm… :slight_smile:

Seriously though, and based on a recent thread on the multi-ethnc, multi-racial, and err… multi-species-al mix in Star Trek, I’d suggest that SF may generally be an exception to this thread’s assertion on the role of minorities.

Stanley and Darryl on The Office, not to mention Oscar, seem pretty ordinary. Kelly’s also pretty normal, although an incredible flake.

On Absolutely Fabulous, Edwina’s white ex husband comes out of the closet and his partner is a black man. Nothing is made of either the sexual orientation or the race of either character that I can recall.

What about Psych? Gus isn’t angelic, demonic, unequal, dumb-sidekick, or anything else, and although the show does make a lot of black jokes, they’ve been best friends “almost since birth”. Oh, and Shawn (James Roday)'s real last name is Rodriguez. There’s another minority.

But I’ll leave that one open for discussion; I’m curious what others think.

Scrubs
Donald Faison - his blackness is mentioned a lot (although sometimes mocked by John McGuinly’s character). Although surgeons and doctors, the cast are pretty much everymans.

From watching both UK and US shows I get the impression that mixed-race couples are far more mainstream (in the nature of the OP) in UK productions.

well he’s back mentioned two other examples from Love Actually above of mixed couples where the race/ethnicity of either party isn’t even commented on.

I’ll throw in as another couple of examples from Doctor Who: Rose and Mickey (as a couple), and Dr. Martha Jones. I recall only one mention of Martha’s race and that was when visiting Elizabethan England.

From that point on, after “hanging a lampshade on it”, the matter is ignored. And it certainly wasn’t an issue in other episodes (as I recall).

Foreman on House is neither hero nor villain.

With Dr. Jones :wink: didn’t it come up again in the episode where The Doctor wiped his memory and hid out as a schoolteacher in a pre-WWI boarding school? Martha had to disguise herself as a servant, and I recall someone (a student? another staff member?) commenting that she couldn’t be expected to be anything more. When Martha revealed to the school nurse/the Doctor’s romantic interest that she (Martha) was a physician, the nurse didn’t believe it as much because she was black as a woman.

Oh, and to go back to balanced depictions of minorities, the co-worker/best friend of the lead character on the sitcom “King of Queens” was black and (from what little I saw of the show) was not depicted as either the zany comic relief or the oh-so-wise friend but as a regular guy.

In I Love Lucy the main couple was white/hispanic and I can’t remember it even once being mentioned or a joke being made about it, there wasn’t even any cultural clash humor. So how about that, mature attitudes in the 1950s.

What made me think of this was very recently seeing something about how there are now white/hispanic couples on TV! Wow modern wonders eh.:smack:

Not quite true. IIRC, Martha winds up being the inspiration for at least one of Billy the Bard’s “dark lady” sonnets.

I’ve only seen a handful of I Love Lucy reruns, but there was plenty of culture clash jokes to be found. Ricky was always an equal though. There was never any “laugh at the immigrant” moments.

similar to “King of Queens” situation just mentioned, Mike’s best friend in “Mike & Molly” is black. But while these characters are neither all good nor all bad, they don’t get much development other than being one of the main characters’ friends. Not like being a second lead. More like the female lead’s gay best friend in many comedies. a good role to stick a minority in. better than nothing, I suppose.

oops - sorry to post again - but I just saw Foreman on House mentioned. an interesting case. His background was mentioned many times, but his actual role is not the all good nor all bad stereotypes.
Didn’t “House” also make a point of having a Jewish character? been so long since I watched…

OZ had a very diverse cast – although it was still probably a bit whiter than the average maximum security prison population – and the black, Hispanic, Asian, etc. characters weren’t “angelic” or “demonic”. They were just as flawed and human as the white characters.

OZ shanked a lot of stereotypes in the side. There were also characters who were “situationally gay”, characters who were probably bisexual even if they were in denial about it, and characters who were straight up gay. OZ loved messing with gender stereotypes, and the gays were no exception. There was Jason Cramer, who was somewhat effete but also a badass boxer and not someone to be messed with (he was in prison for decapitating his boyfriend). Richie Hanlon, possibly one of the nicest characters on the show and who suffered one of the most senseless and tragic deaths (killed by Stanislofsky for a murder he didn’t commit). Torquemada, the imposing, gorgeous, and predatory drag queen (who gets his man and as happy an ending as can be hoped, I guess).