We got a pound-puppy as well, who we think was taken from his mommadog when he was too young. This is the method we used to educate, train, discipline and socialize him. It took a while, but he eventually figured out what we were doing and now thoroughly enjoys it.
Oh, my, that’s EXACTLY what happened with CurrentDog. He was sweet, and cuddly, and mellow, and real relaxed…and had a real nasty case of Kennel Cough. We got that all fixed up and BLAMMO, dog from hell.
Couple of things from my experience with CurrentDog:
He needs his exercise every day. And not just a romp around the yard, either, but a good long walk. Even now, at age 5, if he doesn’t get at least a half-mile to a mile walk every day, he’s a major handful of energy and a real Pain In The Butt.
However, if he does get his walk every day, it ramps his energy down enough that he’s a real sweetie and waaaay more tolerable.
And, once he learned how to trust us and accept DogDad as his “momma dog” (DogDad’s the one that does the “flip the dog over and cuddle him”), he turned into a real sweetie snuggler. In fact, lately he’s been totally convinced he’s a lapdog. Seventy pounds of lapdog. Ooooof. But he is a real sweetie snuggle bum, NOW. So you may just have to get past the “don’t know how to behave, don’t know how to trust you” phase and she may turn out to be a snugglebutt after all.
We noticed that when CurrentDog was sick, as a puppy, it tamped down his energy enough that his real personality was allowed to shine forth, instead of his energy-driven hyperactive pain-in-the-buttness.
So she may eventually grow into the snuggledog she was at first.
Just some encouragment.
Oh, she’s a dominant one, all right. Tonight, she growled and bit me when I tried to take a piece of rawhide out of her mouth. She also barks at me sometimes when I tell her “no.”
She is submissive with my older dog, probably because the older dog bit her when she was tiny and scared the living beejesus out of her. Now, whenever big dog growls (which is frequent) Polaris instantly falls over and shows her tummy. Not that it helps-- big dog then treats her like a chewtoy.
I’m not about to scare or hurt her the way big dog did but it would probably clear up our dominance issues if I did!
Polaris gets lots of excersize-- she goes to puppy daycare while I’m at work and romps with the other little dogs. She has a blast, and comes home tired and happy. We also play fetch in the evenings. My livingroom is twenty-nine feet long, so it’s a good long run for her back and forth.
Ok, you know you need to do something about this starting right NOW, yes? That shouldn’t involve hurting the dog or even being rough with her. Try the NILIF (Nothing in Life is Free) approach.
Basically, the animal has to work for attention, food and play. We had to do this with our Sasha, who was a very dominant dog. She finally got the point. Of course, she still back-talked me to the end of her life, and frequently thought she knew better than I did about any number of situations. But those are things to love about dominant dogs. They just have to learn that YOU are MORE dominant.
Getting her into an obedience class would help a lot too.
I love how these things sound so horrible when you’re not there doing/seeing it.
The best game in our house is “kick the dog”. Dog rolls onto her back and barks. We take a foot, shove it under her back and “kick” (push up on her back which makes her wriggle. She barks and wags her tail. We also play kick the dog standing up. Take the side of your foot and place it on her shoulder, then push to one side. She bites our jeans and absolutely loves it. It’s harmless, but it’s still “kick the dog”.
True! I actually hesitated a little about posting lest someone get the wrong idea. Jasper loves it when I wrestle with him. Including “lying” on top of him.
The suggestion to attend a dog obedience class is an excellent one.
Dogs, of course, have a very different psychology being a pack animal. Generally they’re very sensitive about their feet, tails and face – all points of attack. Many dog trainers will tell you not to let the animal lick you nor put their paws on you, as those are dominance traits.
I know a dog trainer here who believes that key phobias are instilled in puppies at the ages of 3-6 months. Animals all have “imprinting” ranges (including humans for voice inflection and other characteristics), as we know from the famous Conrad Lorenz experiences with geese. This trainer believes that it’s that the 3-6 month age range in which you can easily train a dog NOT to bark – or to be afraid of men with hats.
My own Lab is a very well socialized dog but hates having her paws held – though she’d gladly plop down on me on the floor or sofa.
Incidentally, once you’re established as the “alpha” in the house, virtually all dogs have a hard time having their head higher than yours. It’s really funny to see a 75-lbs dog at ease in the house – but the minute I lie prone on the floor she lays down.
We’ve already got her in obedience classes. The first training session with the dogs present is Monday.
Archergal, my trainer uses the NILIF approach, too. It’s a hard method for me, because I’m used to treating my older dog completely differently. She’s a free-feeder, for example, and she pretty much does as she wants to. We’ve never had problems with her-- she’s just naturally a good dog, I guess. (She’s so obediant, that I can do that trick where you balance a treat on their nose and make them hold it until you tell them they can have it.)
The trainer also uses the clicker method. Polaris seems to respond well to it.
Mooney252, I had never heard you shouldn’t let a dog lick you-- those are kisses! (In the wild, puppies lick the faces of adult dogs in submission, IIRC). I can understand not allowing them to lick your face-- I forbid my adult dog to do so-- but only because it’s gross (I’ve seen where that tongue has been!)
When you say they shouldn’t put their paws on you, what do you mean? Jumping up on people and resting the paws against the legs, or standing on your lap?
Obviously dogs that jump on people as a greeting are a problem with people, particularly women who might worry about runs in hosiery or fur on clothing. People who are afraid of dogs are particularly disturbed by the animal jumping on them.
But I’ve had dog trainers note that it’s a dominance behavior. And if you’ve been around groups of dogs, you’ll see the alphas try to force more submissive dogs to the ground in that fashion. The trainers that I’ve discussed it with say to resist it in virtually all circumstances: whether those pugs think that they belong in your lap or a Labrador that wants to jump on a person in greeting.
Our Lab, who’s pretty submissive, will only risk the behavior when she thinks that it’s time to play or walk or rarely when it’s well into dinner time and I’m still at the computer keyboard. And it’s never for more than a few seconds.
I found the perfect solution to this behavior. I bought a water-pistol and shot her in the face every time she did it. Within an hour, she had stopped, but, unfortunately, the water pistol was not a quality product. (I should have bought a better one, but I never thought that water pistols varied drastically in their well-made-ness.) Once I replace it, I think I’ll have her broken of that behavior quickly.
My older dog will sometimes lift one paw and place it gently on a leg or arm. I’d always seen that as a guesture of affection-- should I be reading something more sinister into her motivations?
Clicker training is excellent. And while you may not have to do the NILIF with your older dog, your pup is a totally different animal. If you’re already having some issues (growling and biting you when you try to take something she wants away from her), it’s really important to start establishing who’s the boss now. She’s already gotten the idea that what she wants trumps what you want.
And I don’t think it’s obedience that holds a dog still when you balance a treat on its nose – it’s just doggy self-control. But that’s just MHO.
Not sinister, no, but usually the dog doing that is asking for something, whether it’s petting or food or whatever. My Bouncer dog does that when he wants me to pet him. I am occasionally willing to be manipulated by my dogs. But I know that’s what’s happening when it happens.
Just wanted to chime in and say my family and I have two dogs, almost night and day. The one more like yours is a bit big for her breed (Papillion) and had a hell of a time with a straight leash (but does not mind the one that wraps around the body much). She is very shy, very scared (doesn’t like being in the front yard, even with my Dad, who she practically glues herself too.)
Anyway – when we first got her, she would never, ever roll over on her back. That was 6-7 years ago I guess. Over the years, she got more used to it and does roll over, though she returns back to normal right after your hand leaves. I have to pick her up very slowly, and usually she doesnt squeak (but we don’t hold her for long.)
But a few weeks ago during Spring break, before I went back to college – she jumped in my lap while I was on the recliner (she doesn’t mind laps anymore, if Dads not home to give her attention) and I gently pushed her over to the crook of my left arm, so that her belly was showing completely while I reclined. Not a big deal, except for the fact that Mom had a hell of a time verbally coaxing her to get off me so we could go to eat. She laid there, on her back, completely sprawled in my arms, for a good 3 minutes, staring at mom like she was nuts about wanting her to move.
It was a great day. And this was the same dog that refused to show her belly for even a SECOND, refused to be held, refused to be picked up when she was a puppy. (Though again I think some of the issues came because of her high size compared to breed.)
Well, tonight, she allowed me to hold her for a little while. She’d been playing on the floor of the library for a long while. I was reading in the chaise when all of a sudden, BOOM! I was hit by a puppy cannonball. She investigated my book, chewed a moment on my robe (a sharp NO! stopped that) and then laid down. I stroked her back for about a minute, and then she bounded away.
In about twenty minutes, she did it again. I’m not so sure I should encourage this, because my trainer said she should be kept off of the furniture for status reasons, but I was enthralled with having a puppy curled up on my lap.
I didn’t go to Archergal’s links, but I know the tide turned in our house when I put my alpha bitch pup on her back, got in her face, and told her in a deep, decisive, loud tone that I AM THE ALPHA BITCH IN THIS HOUSE! NOT YOU! YOU DO AS I SAY! I kept her there for a full half a minute, even though she was very unhappy about being in the position. When she got up, she was very quiet. She sat mutely looking out of the sliding glass door for a long time, and when she came out of her reverie, she was pretty much a changed dog. That seemed to settle it for us, but she was a very smart dog and always quick to learn a new idea.
It goes without saying that you need to be absolutely certain your dog will not bite you when you do this. Some dogs will. And some dogs will take offense in other ways.
My dog is most emphatically not a lap dog. She will tolerate me holding her in my lap for a few minutes but then is ready to get down. She really hates being on her back while being held. However she is a very loving and cuddly dog. We sit on the couch or on the bed and she is right there ready to be petted and snuggled with. She is perfectly comfortable with being rolled over for tummy rubs as long as she is on the couch. I also often hold her with her back feetstill under her and her backside sitting on my leg but holding her upper body in a hug. I got her as an adult dog and think she got dropped or something when she was a puppy. She also panics when I move her from the center of the bed closer to the far edge so there is room for me to lay down. She acts like she is about to be shoved over the edge which I have never done but who knows what happened before I got her. I don’t very often put her in positions where she is unhappy but sometimes you just have too.
She has growled and snapped a few times, once at a party at my house, she had a rawhide chewie and I reached down to pet her. she growled and snapped which of course got her scolded and the treat taken away. When I gave it back to her, I let her chew on it on moment and then took it back. I did this several times. And although I know she doesn;t understand what I am saying, i told her emphatically everyhting she has belongs to me, all of her food she gets because I say so, I am the alpha bitch etc. etc. We haven’t had this problem since and I regularly remove food from her grasp. (there are idiots who throw chicken bones out of thier car windows for some reason, I had to pry her mouth open and take the bones out of her mouth. She still managed to swallow them but apparently they didn’t bother her. whew!)
