My wife is being sexually harassed. Am I doing the right thing by doing nothing?

In My Humble Opinion
61

[QUOTE=NinetyWt]
Isn’t Mrs. R a bit young? I know that I didn’t gain this empowerment perspective until I was 25 or so, at least. I say encourage her, but also see if older women whom she trusts might get involved. Not that any of you guys couldn’t tell her how to do it - but this is something she needs to learn how to do, how a lady does it.
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That’s interesting, I didn’t consider age, though I’ve no idea of Mrs R’s. **Nashiitashii ** and I are discussing this,(hooray for working from home!) but she’s going to chime in on it.

62

[QUOTE=Acid Lamp]
Her behavior indicates that maybe it’s gone way too far already, and she’s scared.
[/QUOTE]

We haven’t actually heard anything from her about this. She is in a position where she is being disrespected, going against her wishes on this won’t help. She doesn’t need to be treated like a kid while manly men fight it out on her behalf. If anything she needs to be treated with more respect.

My best friend is a female co-worker, I’ve seen her deal with situations like this (minus the porn) a few times. I only know about it because she trusts me to listen; when she asks for my advice it’s there but that’s only happened twice that I can recall. She’s not going to run home and tell her boyfriend about every guy that hits on her, it happens every week. If it were my wife going through it, I would have a very hard time approaching it so calmly. I say trust your wife, she’s smart enough to have a job and feed herself and get to and from work and function in an adult world, she should be able to handle this.

63

When I was being bullied at work, the best thing my husband said to me was “I know we need the money, but I need you healthy more. If you need to quit, just do it.” And I did, after taking all the steps I could think of to get her to stop (short of confronting her, because I wasn’t as comfortable with confrontation back then). If my husband had gone to my workplace and done or said anything, my response would have been, “That was very gallant of you, but have you lost your freakin’ mind?” Sometimes being part of a partnership means letting your partner do things their way, even if you would very, VERY much like to do them differently.

Is it just me, or are we seeing the responses generally split along gender lines here? Skald was basically asking for a woman’s perspective, and we’re giving it to him. You guys telling him to go to her office with both guns blazing are not helping him.

64

DianaG’s freakout aside, I think there is a certain point at which I would have to do something about it, regardless of my wife’s feelings. Dealing with it by not dealing with it, but then taking all that pain home to me is not a viable long-term solution that I would want to be a part of.

Edit for Featherlou: I wouldn’t do any of it “with guns blazing”, nor with violence. The man is HR. He should know better ways.

And no, I wouldn’t be bothered at all if, in a similar but opposite position, my wife took it upon herself to bitchslap some upper management cow who wouldn’t leave me the fuck alone. I’d smile in UMC’s face and say “I didn’t do anything because you’re a relative of the boss and I figured you’d just lie about everything and get me fired. But you…you should be worried about my wife.”

Then I’d take my wife out for a very special dinner. :smiley:

65

Who is treating her like a kid? I said that her behavior is weird, and that her spouse has a right to ask her why she chooses to do nothing about the issue. The fact that she cries about it in private obviously means it hurts her and she doesn’t consider it to be no big deal. I never said he ought to ride to the rescue.

I’m not a psychologist or a counselor, but in my experience they only time women put up with this kind of garbage behavior is when they feel too intimidated to do anything about it.

66

[QUOTE=Wile E]
Whether you agree with the book or not, this exact same scenario was in Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus and it’s true. Women just want sympathy, not advice and they definitely do not want the man to take over and tell them what to do. Don’t offer advice unless you are asked directly.
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I hear this generalization repeated over and over, and it bugs the shit out of me. Now hear this: Men don’t appreciate unsolicited advice any more than women do. Women aren’t any less likely than men to give unsolicited advice. People all love to bitch about their problems, receiving sympathy that is free of advice or judgement. It may be true that women are more likely to start and continue extended conversations about their problems.

67

[QUOTE=Chimera]
DianaG’s freakout aside
[/QUOTE]

So indicating that he should respect her wishes, and asking people to consider it from her point of view is “freaking out”? How very feminine of me, I suppose. :dubious:

68

[QUOTE=Cosmic Relief]
Now hear this: Men don’t appreciate unsolicited advice any more than women do.
[/QUOTE]

Sure, but I think that in general, when men relate a problem to someone else, they consider that to be a solicitation for advice. Women tend to consider it to be a solicitation for sympathy and/or support.

This is a vast generalization and not directly applicable to any specific situation, but it’s a general trend that I have found to be true in a lot of my interpersonal relationships.

69

[QUOTE=DianaG]
So… she’s an intelligent adult when she behaves in a way you approve of, and an incompetent child to be protected when she doesn’t? Does she *know * that’s how you feel? Because it may not be what she believes she signed up for.
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Having seen women my own age (25) do stupid things for the sake of “not making a big deal out of the situation,” I must admit that a lot of women, regardless of age, seem to feel that it’s their duty to take abuse and play the part of the “incompetent child” when things like this happen. I have my own experience with people doing awful things to me and having to learn to stand up for myself, but it seems like a lot of women never get to the point where they’re actually doing it, hence the “incompetent child” role. I must admit, though, that I still have trouble not falling into this stupid behavior in some situations, as I realize that there are some people who are going to cause a fuss just because you don’t have a penis and you’re not eighty million years old, and it’s best not to even bother trying to do anything but get them to shut up and go away.

Either way, sometimes, despite the best practices within trying to empower women, we still have women who refuse to do the right thing and thus punish themselves and allow themselves to suffer for the sake of not stirring the pot. Your reaction seems to be that you’re encouraging her self-destructive behavior rather than encouraging the husband to try to help her empower herself. Yes, we don’t always want advice when we rant, but this is a pretty damned serious issue, so, whether she likes it or not, she should be getting encouragement to do something and not behave like a blubbering idiot and do nothing.

[QUOTE=NinetyWt]
Isn’t Mrs. R a bit young? I know that I didn’t gain this empowerment perspective until I was 25 or so, at least. I say encourage her, but also see if older women whom she trusts might get involved. Not that any of you guys couldn’t tell her how to do it - but this is something she needs to learn how to do, how a lady does it.
[/QUOTE]

I’m still finding my feet when it comes to appropriate ways to discourage bad behavior in people who are senior to me by a few decades, and I’m 25. I have, however, more or less figured out that it’s totally fine to stand up for myself against people who are within ten years of my age and are more likely to understand that I’m berating them for doing something wrong, and not just being an “uppity woman.” It sounds like the nephew of the owner can’t be that much older than Mrs. R in this situation, and somebody needs to encourage her to stand up for herself. Just sitting there and taking it isn’t working, and at the very least, she could tell him to fuck off and leave her alone (but in a more polite wording) and see if it does anything. He may have his head so far up his ass (as most employee-relatives of company owners often do) that he doesn’t realize that other people have their own thoughts and ideas. Mrs. R should be making it absolutely clear to him that his behavior is inappropriate and that, if he does it again, she’s going to HR/her lawyer/the big boss over it; it’s not her husband’s place to say this, but it is her husband’s place to empower her and help her understand that she’s got to stand up for herself in this situation. Nobody deserves this kind of abuse.

70

[QUOTE=DianaG]
So indicating that he should respect her wishes, and asking people to consider it from her point of view is “freaking out”? How very feminine of me, I suppose. :dubious:
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Not “feminine”, just obnoxious. Don’t read in motives that do not exist, just for the sake of justifying your feelings.
When you get married, you aren’t alone anymore. Deciding to take on the world by yourself and tell your spouse to stay out of it is selfish behavior. The problems that affect you in such a serious way impact your spouse and your relationship.

On the other side of the same coin, deciding to deal with a serious issue that impacts both of you by refusing to deal with it is not a solution. It is a guarantee that both of you will continue to be impacted by that problem and it is quite likely that the problem will get worse, not better.

I had this problem with my ex-wife, who thrived on creating problems and then refusing to deal with them. Who actively worked to thwart my resolution of problems. Because she was mentally ill and “Problems = Sympathy from Others”. Not saying that Skald’s wife is like this, but that this is my history, my reason for being bothered by this kind of behavior.

Sexual Harrassers feed on silence and passivity. Silence implies consent. “She didn’t scream rape, so it must not bother her…so I’ll do it again! Only this time…”. Failing to do anything about his repeated behavior is only going to lead to more behavior, more serious behavior, more frequent behavior. The fact that the offender is the nephew of the owner is very problematic, but it is also a damned good reason to nip this behavior in the bud right now, before he becomes settled in the pattern, before he gains more power in the company, before he does this to others.

71

[Moderator Note]Anonymous suggestions of illegal violence isn’t “macho”-it’s juvenile posturing, at best. I don’t want to see any more of it in this thread.[/Moderator Note]

72

[QUOTE=MsWhatsit]
Sure, but I think that in general, when men relate a problem to someone else, they consider that to be a solicitation for advice. Women tend to consider it to be a solicitation for sympathy and/or support.
[/QUOTE]

I guess I have to disagree. I have never known a man to relate a problem as an implicit request for advice. It’s true that when men are talking about problems, they often make an explicit request for advice, but that isn’t always the case. Quite often it’s just venting, explaining an irritable mood, or explaining the delay in some other task.

73

[QUOTE=Chimera]
Sexual Harrassers feed on silence and passivity. Silence implies consent. “She didn’t scream rape, so it must not bother her…so I’ll do it again! Only this time…”. Failing to do anything about his repeated behavior is only going to lead to more behavior, more serious behavior, more frequent behavior. The fact that the offender is the nephew of the owner is very problematic, but it is also a damned good reason to nip this behavior in the bud right now, before he becomes settled in the pattern, before he gains more power in the company, before he does this to others.
[/QUOTE]

This is the point I was trying to get at in my previous post. It’s not acceptable for her to be tolerating the behavior that’s been witness to. It’s not appropriate or acceptable for the owner’s nephew to be doing this to anyone, let alone a fellow coworker, and what makes it even more unacceptable is because it’s in a position that grants him more “defense” or “rights” than those who are unrelated to the owner of the company.

Skald, try to convince your wife to speak up for herself about the issue and take it to HR if she can’t muster up the courage to tell this guy to go suck eggs when he’s behaving inappropriately. All you can really do is encourage her to do what’s right for herself so that nobody else has to go through this kind of treatment from the owner’s nephew.

74

[QUOTE=DianaG]
Seriously, has (nearly) everyone here lost their damned minds?

[/QUOTE]

That’s what I’m saying! You all have gone crazy!

I’m supposed to let my wife continue to be the victim of a sexual crime because she wants to ‘deal with it her own way’ and ‘doesn’t want to make a big deal out of it’?! Especially when said crime notoriously sucks all the self-esteem and hence willingness to fight back out of its victims? Not only, as nashiitashii pointed out, does sexual harassment feed off of inactivity, it fosters it.

If Mr. Rhymer doesn’t take action, this crime will play itself completely out, until the perpetrator gets tired of it and moves on to other victims. The criminal will never be brought to justice and Mrs. Rhymer’s life will be worse off because of it.

If it was any other crime, people would be horrified that someone let it occur without intervening. Harassment? Robbery? Assault? Rape? Murder? Tell me when, if ever, does it become acceptable to take action on behalf of a victim who doesn’t (or can’t) resist?

She told him about this for a reason. Ask yourself: Does she want the harassment to stop? If so, why is it unreasonable to stop it for her, preferably but not necessarily with her help, when she is unable or unwilling to stop it by herself?

75

Look, does she have a plan to deal with this or doesn’t she? If her strategy is to keep a stiff upper lip and ignore him, that won’t do. What he’s doing is wrong, and she must call him on it.

I know it’s scary. I know it could be messy. But for Og’s sake, she can’t be all *I am Woman Hear Me Roar * if she’s not going to 1)Take steps to resolve the situation or 2)Ask for help from you, her soulmate, if needed.

She’s in pain and needs help. She’s refusing to let you help her. That’s showing disrespect to you and the marriage.

You need to find out what she’s doing to handle this.

76

:dubious:

DrCube, are you seriously comparing Mrs. Skald’s situation to robbery, assault, rape and murder? Because let me put it in perspective for you. A guy at work is mean to her.

She can confront him. She can report him. She can quit.

It is *her * place to do one of these things. Because she is a grownup.

And are you really implying that she told **Skald ** about this because she really wants *him * to take care of this *for * her? That’s about the most infantilizing, insulting thing I can imagine thinking about a person.

77

Polite but firm complaints to management, well-documented, can ultimately lead to litigation and perhaps a very generous settlement from the company. Don’t let this go. It’s wrong, it’s illegal, and it has to stop.

78

[QUOTE=Rubystreak]
It’s not your place to deal with it. How would you feel if she came to your workplace and yelled at your boss in the same situation? She is an adult and she needs to take control of things. You can’t force her to and you can’t do it for her. All you can do is support her and try to convince her to stand up for herself. Worse comes to worst, she should start looking for another job, if she refuses to deal with it herself in any other way but crying. But if you get involved, you demean her as a grown woman with her own career (and with legitimate ways of dealing with this that do not involve her husband fighting her workplace battles for her).
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I agree with “you shouldn’t do anything” unless she asks you. SHe hasn’t asked you, doesn’t want your input, and right or wrong, is handling it in her own way. Leave it alone. Leave her alone. She’s a big girl and can read the situation better than you can.

79

But she’s not handling it. Her plan is to avoid him when she can and tolerate him when she can’t.

That won’t stop the situation. It’s not a sign of weakness to ask for help.

80

It’s not a sign of weakness to ask for help, but she hasn’t asked for help. She’s flat out said she doesn’t want **Skald’s ** help.