Need Aussie Advice re: AU Universities

In My Humble Opinion
1

My son will soon be receiving his undergraduate degree (US – Michigan State). He is planning on obtaining his Masters degree in Epidemiology, and has decided to apply to Universities in Australia in addition to Universities in the US.

He sent an email to “IDP Education Australia” in Sydney, and received a list of schools that offer Epidemiology Masters. Obviously, we know absolutely nothing about these schools.

Do any of you Aussie Dopers have any feedback regarding any of these universities? Good or bad. Any information is better than none. Should he avoid any of these? Are some more highly respected than others?

The University of New South Wales (UNSW)
Deakin University (Deakin)
La Trobe University (La Trobe)
The University of Melbourne (UniMelb)
The University of Adelaide (Adelaide)
Charles Darwin University (CDU)
University of Western Sydney (UWS
University of Western Sydney (UWS
Southern Cross University (SCU)
Curtin University of Technology (Curtin)
The University of Melbourne(UniMelb)
RMIT University (RMIT)
Griffith University (GU)
Australian National University (ANU)
Monash University (Monash)
The University of Newcastle (UoN)

(Please note that I have cross-posted this query at both the SDMB and the G’Dope message board. I hope no one takes offense at this action.)

2

All of them are decent universities, Melbourne, ANU and Monash would probably be counted as “prestige” universities, although not in the same way you’d talk about American Ivy League universities.

But rather than look at the institution, look at:

  1. The course itself. You’ll probably find that some of the courses are much better than others, and not necessarily in the bigger unis. The newer unis will often do better in non-traditional and newer fields of study.

Be worth doing a bit of research by seeing who is publishing good stuff in the field from what universities. Have a look on the websites, there will often be a student survey of courses which might give you some idea about the quality of teaching.

The Good Universities Guide can probably help you with more information:
http://www.thegoodguides.com.au/site there is also an associated site with information for international students: http://www.studiesinaustralia.com/
2. It’s also worth considering where the university is. If your son is coming all the way to Australia to study, it’s worth considering where the uni is in relation to the things your son is interested in and wants to do. The University of Melbourne and RMIT are right in the middle of Australia’s second largest city, with all that offers. Monash and Latrobe’s main campuses are in Melbourne but about an hour out of the centre. Deakin’s main campus is in Geelong, a regional city about an hour and a half from Melbourne, but right on the coast and about a half hour from serious surfing.

The University of New South Wales is in Sydney, which is Australia’s largest city, and very expensive to live in, the Uni of Western Sydney is at Penrith, an hour and a bit out of Sydney. Newcastle is NSW’s second biggest city, a faboulous spot, about two hours up the coast from Sydney. Southern Cross Uni is in Lismore, a regional town of NSW.

Griffith is in Queensland on the Gold Coast which is a good idea if you like warm weather. Charles Darwin has campuses in Darwin and Alice Springs, so if your son likes diverse communities and wants a taste of outback Australia, that might be a choice.

ANU is in Canberra, Australia’s capital and Curtin is in Western Australia, which is a long way from the other cities of Australia, but has lots to offer in terms of things to do.

The point really is that beside the courses themselves, your son needs to think about what else he wants out of studying in Australia. If he’s very self-reliant and wants to just put his head down and study, a quieter, regional campus with cheaper living expenses but fewer services might appeal.

If he’s not so confident, would like to be sure there were other international students and lots of services, or if he’s a party animal, then studying on a campus of one of the bigger city unis might be a good idea.

If he’s a bit insular or lacks some confidence, Melbourne or Sydney might suit because they would probably be more familiar in some ways, than, say, Darwin or Alice Springs. On the other hand, if he’s interested in new cultural experiences one of those cities would be an exciting place to study.

So my advice would be to think about what else, apart from the course itself, your son wants to get out of studying in Australia and then look at which universities can offer that experience.

3

Griffith is not on the Gold Coast – that’s Bond University. Griffith’s got two campuses one at Logan and one at Nathan, both in suburban Brisbane. The Logan campus is close to the Gold Coast, we can get to the Gold Coast in about 40 minutes. However life in Logan is nothing like life on the Gold Coast.

Other than that nitpick, blackhobyah has good ideas and info.

4

Curtin University in Western Australia is close to my old home. I didn’t attend it, but know it well enough. Curtin traditionally has had a technology and science focus (and a growing business school). It’s a university with a huge overseas student population, mostly from south-east Asia. The campus is large, modern and very well-equipped–a direct result of oversea’s tuition fees.

Curtin is regarded quite well, but in Western Australia it’s second in prestige to another university (which isn’t on your list). It’s located close to the centre of Perth.

To the list of “prestige” unis, I’d add UNSW.

5

Buggered if I know whether Adelaide’s any good for epide…epidepi… thingy.

I do know Uni of Adelaide has a reputation for being about ‘stats and rats’, Flinders (also in Adelaide) has a more hands-on attitude, and Uni of SA is out to
show the world how darned progressive it is… which is sometimes very good and sometimes just means the courses are inconsistent. Apparently the psychology studies at UniSA are excellent, but that’s not likely to be useful to you. :slight_smile:

I’ve heard lots of good things about Flinders Uni in Adelaide, and not so much about Uni of Adelaide. Though my info is about five years old, and Adelaide Uni have been doing a lot of advertising in the last couple of years, so maybe they’ve pulled their socks up and finally found their way into the Century of the Fruitbat.

6

Well, as seems to be obvious from other people’s suggestions, if you want advice on which university is best for the particular subject of epidemiology, you’ll have to do some more intensive investigation.

Austrlian universities really don’t get ranked the way that US schools do, although there are some informal ranking systems that can be of general use, like those listed on this page. Personally, i’ve always been more concerned about how good a university is in the particular field that i want to study, so you really need to find out about epidemiology programs.

All that said, my own personal experience encompasses the Univeristy of Sydney, and the University of New South Wales. I began my undergraduate degree at U.Syd., but transferred to UNSW after my freshman year. The main reason for the shift was that UNSW seemed to have better US History courses available, and it also offered a major in Spanish and Latin American Studies, which i wanted to do.

UNSW is generally considered one of the top two or three universities in Australia. I really enjoyed my time there, and i think it’s a very good school. At the graduate level, the Australian National University in Canberra tends to be considered at or near the top, along with UNSW and Melbourne (but again, it depends on your field). ANU was originally designed primarily as a graduate institution, and it still takes its graduate school mission very seriously.

As far as living goes, it’s true that Sydney is expensive, although rents haven’t increased as much as housing prices over the past five years or so. The rental market has also been hit somewhat by an oversupply of rental properties. I was surprised when i visited Sydney last November to find that rents had not increased very much since i left the city three years before, while the purchase price of houses had doubled in the same time period.

Also, as with most expensive cities, there’s a reason the prices are high: because so many people want to live there. I grew up in Sydney, so take this for what it’s worth, but i think it’s a fantastic city to live in. The weather is great, there’s heaps to do, and it truly is a world-class city.

Despite being a Sydneysider, i love Melbourne too, and would be quite happy to end up living there. It’s a really great city, very cosmopolitan, with vibrant arts and culture and great shopping. Shame about the weather. :slight_smile: I tend to find some of Australia’s other capital cities a bit sleepy, although Adelaide has really livened up over the past ten years or so.

7

Great ideas from blackhobyah.

The only Australian university in that list I can really comment on is Curtin University of Technology in Western Australia where I completed a Bachelor of Science.

Friends who are allied health professionals (mainly Speech Pathologists, Occupational Therapists and Physiotherapists) who graduated from Curtin and have gone on to work overseas have always been able to snap up work very quickly, and I’ve heard a few times that it’s because the courses at Curtin are quite well regarded in the allied health field (this feedback mainly comes from the UK, I guess).

I went back to the main Curtin campus a couple of weeks ago and it’s looking great – much cooler than when I graduated and that was only a few years ago! The architecture is very modern (meaning that some buildings are amazingly beautiful, while others look like oversized toilet blocks) and they must be putting big bucks into landscaping. They’re using lots of native Australian trees and plants so the place is much more “Australian” looking than some other Australian uni campuses that have architecture and gardens that would make you think you were in England.

As a student, your son could have an excellent standard of living in Perth as the cost of living, particularly for decent housing, is much cheaper than in the big capital cities. It is also good if he likes outdoor pursuits like going to the beach, camping, sports etc. Probably a bad move if he needs a different bar or club to go to every night of the week as he’ll run out of choices by about Thursday night of his first week.

This probably sounds like I’m just talking my own uni up… I’m not – I certainly have a few issues about the place, particularly in terms of it starting to seem like it places more importance on revenue raising rather than concentrating on maintaining/improving the quality of teaching (IMO), but that really seems to be an across the board problem with many universities at the moment.

8

I’ve studied at 2 universities in Australia, and worked at 3, so I think I can claim less bias than most.

As others have said, there’s much less difference between the “best” and the “worst” among universities in Australia than among those in the US. In addition, the oldeest univerity in each state has an undeserved amount of prestige just based on the fact that it is the oldest.

So I think that you need to look at other specifics, as others have suggested, such as how good the particular school is, how attractive the city that it is in for living, and how exensive the city is for renting a place to live (that’s the main variable in terms of cost of luving in Australia: how much is costs to buy or rent housing).

9

American checking in - I studied abroad for a semester at Murdoch Uni, in Perth (which I know isn’t on your list) while I was an undergrad and thought I’d throw a good word in for Perth (which would be a vote for Curtin, apparently). Perth is georgeous - supposedly it gets the most sunshine for any city in the world, it’s very easy to navigate, and there’s lots around to do. Another upside is that you get to experience, IMHO, a fuller view of Australia than Americans who only go to Sydney or Melbourne. He can always journey to the east coast for a visit.

10

Excellent feedback! You have no idea how appreciative we are for your opinions and comments. They are very helpful. More than I expected.

I’ve spent a couple wonderful weeks with the Kiwis in New Zealand, but have not yet had the opportunity to visit the land of Oz. I kind of hope my son ends up there so I get a reason to come Down Under for a visit. :smiley:

If anyone else sees this and has additional feedback, please don’t consider this post to be a thread killer. More information and personal experiences are welcome.

11

I have no personal experience of any of the universities under debate, having done all of my studies at Macquarie Uni. But my sister has been doing a Masters in Public Health at **UNSW ** and she’s done some epidemiology subjects. She was quite impressed.

12

A quick look through the invaluable EdNA (www.edna.edu.au) suggests the UNSW hosts The National Centre in HIV Epidemiology and Clinical Research (http://www.med.unsw.edu.au/nchecr/), Newcastle has the Centre for Clinical Epidemiology and Biostatistics (http://www.newcastle.edu.au/research/centres/cceb.html), Latrobe has the
Australian Research Centre in Sex, Health & Society (http://www.latrobe.edu.au/arcshs/) and ANU has National Centre for Epidemiology and Population Health (http://www-nceph.anu.edu.au/).

These research Centres are designed as centres of excellence in particular areas and tend to be well-funded and supported by both the Government and their institutions, so it’s likely that the universities supporting these Centres would be a good place to start investigation.

However, epidemiology is not my field at all, so I’m really only going on what I know about how universities in Australia operate, I can’t offer any critical analysis of the work of the Centres themselves.

13

My cousin is head of Pharmacology at Monash, and my mum went to LaTrobe, and they both give them high marks. I know given the choice that I’d live in Melbourne.

The only real contribution I can make is that you should skip Griffith. It’s a nice enough uni, but it’s small, and not worth it if you’re coming from overseas, IMO.

14

Most of what people have said in this thread, I couldn’t add much to, but what I would add is this:

Just because a university is generally prestigious, doesn’t mean it’s great in all disciplines. For example, my mum, as the state president of the APA (Australian Physiotherapists Association) would rate the LaTrobe university phisiotherapy program over Melbourne Uni’s - this is despite Melbourne being widely regarded as a more prestigious institution. Generally, LaTrobe is very good in the health sciences, not so good in some of the other courses it offers.

Now, I know nothing about epidemiology, but don’t just because a university has a generally good name, doesn’t mean it has the best epidemiology course.

The second thing I would add is this:

Where is your son planning to work? All of the unis you listed are known within Australia, and people will rate them as they see fit (and they’re all pretty good). But outside of Australia, people may only have heard of one or two of the big-name institutions. That is - a potential employer might have heard of the University of Melbourne, but probably hasn’t ever heard of LaTrobe - how are they to know whether LaTrobe is a credible institution (which it is) that’s any better than the university with the cool webpage that I setup in my garage and am handing out degrees for $50 a pop. If your son is planning to use his qualification outside of Australia, go a big name uni - UNSW, UniMelb, Monash, ANU… The rest of the world are far more likely to have heard of them.

15

Hi Algernon,

I hope I’m not too late with this. I’ve been offline for about a month.
You’ve received some great info already.

I just want to second what robinc noted about working in America with a little known Australian uni degree under his belt. Something to consider.

I also strongly, strongly advise steering clear of The University of Newcastle for the field your son is interested in. I have attended three different NSW universities, Newcastle Uni being one of them, but don’t want to say much more than that. I highly recommend concentrating on the other universities on his list.

16

Actually, there is a Griffith campus on the Gold Coast.

Sorry, I can’t be of help to the OP. I’m at The University of Queensland, which has a medical program, but no epidemiology speciality.

17

Thanks for the additional information. You all have been extraordinarily helpful.

I’m not sure of the full list of where my son has decided to apply, but I know UNSW is at the top of his list.

18

Hmmm. Turns out that Newcastle was in the top three on my son’s list.

Can you tell us more about the reasoning behind your advice to steer clear of Newcastle?

If you prefer, you can email the info to me: gbakker “at” gmail.com

19

A friend of mine is a director here at dest. I will pass on whatever he can provide.