I’m going to start my own web business and need to get a website designed/ built. I know next to nothing about such things so have been doing as much research as I can but there is so much out there it is hard to know what’s good and not good.
It will be a site that caters to peoples design needs. It need not be large - 3-5 pages. It will need to have a questionaire and a Paypal link for payment. For photos, I plan to link to an outside site like Flickr.
Any help or advice is greatly appreciated. So far I am thinking of using these guys:
If you only need a small site, with no programming, e-commerce, or fancy bells and whistles, you’ll probably get a much better price with a freelancer than a big company. Big companies have a lot more overhead, and it just doesn’t make a lot of sense if your entire website is 5 pages. Hundreds of pages, I could see, but not five.
I’m not sure what you mean by “caters to people’s design needs.” Are you an interior designer? Graphic designer? (If you’re a graphic designer, I probably don’t need to tell you that knowing “next to nothing” about website design ain’t so hot, and may affect your ability to get clients…)
Anyway, full-disclosure, I am a freelance designer/marketer, so if you have specific questions you can feel free to ask me/PM me/otherwise contact me. And yes, I’d definitely charge less than 3 figures for something like this. That’s really high.
Wow, neither am I! Stock photo overload! Too many fake toothy smiles! Argh! It burns!
I agree with Kaio, try to find a small local firm (or person) to design your site, though making sure it’s someone with several years of experience, who have examples similar to your own intentions, would be the best plan.
Never go to a web “design” company that doesn’t have it’s own standards-compliant web site. Their own code is crap. Their visual design has too much of a “Slick Willie” look to it. A cursory look at several of their client sites indicate they use purchased templates and not their own designs. Their price range doesn’t support anything other than those rebadged templates.
BTW, if you plan to start your own web business, you don’t link to an outside source like Flickr. There are plenty of apps to do your own internal photo gallery.
Sorry, I meant less than 4 figures. Duhr. For something like a basic 5 page site with no backend, it would depend on what specifically you’re asking for, of course, but a very rough estimate would be around half what 123Triad quoted you.
Anyway, yes, there are also really simple to install/use photo gallery apps that you can include on your own site, which will look more professional. I useGallery 2, which is open-source, free, and I found it pretty easy to customize. The bulk of the “work” was just flipping through the theme library to find something I like.
Flickr has the advantage that it’s also an online community, which would give you a means of networking and directing traffic to your site. I’ve seen a number of pro photographers who post to Flickr. Although I’d probably suggest having the Flickr account in addition to your own gallery.
I also have website design related questions. I hope it’s ok to put it in this thread. If not, I’ll start a new one.
Do those of you who are designers have favorite sites in terms of design, or a link to a compilation where I can cruise for concepts? I’m considering doing website design as a side job, and I’m having trouble making my sites look more “sophisticated”. I don’t want flashy (ha ha!), designed for designers type ideas, just simple and clean. Needless to say, I haven’t had much luck except looking at big corporate sites. The sites I might be interested in doing are much simpler, small businesses, no e-commerce or interactivity.
Rates. Kaio, I know you threw out an estimate of less than $1k for a basic site, but can you go into a little bit more detail about how you determine what to charge? No doubt that’s too simplistic, but I’m curious.
Generally if I’m looking for inspiration on a particular project, I spend a couple hours Googling as many websites as I can find in the same industry as the client. I don’t know of a particular compilation, other than checking out the portfolios on web designers’ websites. In either case, you’ll see a bunch of crap, and a few stand-outs, and mostly it’s just a matter of sifting, and spending enough time on it to get a feel for what works and what doesn’t. When I was just starting out my designs were pretty clunky, but over the years I’ve gotten a lot more refined. I don’t know of any particular shortcut to experience. You’ll get better at it over time.
I never know where exactly the legal line is for being able to have a specific discussion on rates (there’s a certain grey area where, apparently, it can be construed as price-fixing. IANAL, I dunno, so I err on the side of caution.)
I used to charge a flat fee for a website/project, based on how extensive I expected it to be and how long it should take. I gave up on that after a few years because it was becoming ever more complicated to explain what they got for that flat fee, in what ended up being extremely minute detail, because I somehow always ended up with clients who were very fond of scope creep. In other words, a project that started out at say 10 hours, would get sent back again and again for revisions, additions, and “hey I just saw this on someone else’s website and want that too!”
So at this point I just charge hourly. I base my rates loosely on what I usually get from the mar-com temp agencies I work with, plus extra to cover the fact that I’m the one doing the legwork on the administrative side. From this, and based on my level of experience, I figure this is pretty darn close to market rate or better-than for what I can offer. The hourly rate for design plus site coding/build-out is about 30% more than what I charge for production only, or other minor things like doing text/photo updates to an existing site.
When pricing a project as a whole, basically I tell the client that I charge $X per hour, and here’s how long I expect it to take, for a total of $Y to $Z. I also give a basic outline of how I manage workflow (the number of mockups I’m planning to do, then one round of edits to the one chosen mockup, then site build-out, not including things like content creation). This is to keep the client in mind of the aforementioned scope creep; if they decide they want an extra round of edits, or want me to write/copy edit their content, or just have to have this cool widget they just discovered, they know it’s going to cost them more than the original estimate. This works out better since a client won’t try to badger you into including “just one more thing” in the flat project price – since I bill hourly, I’ll do whatever you want, even if it wastes time, and it’s your responsibility to keep within your budget. (Although I will speak up when they ask for something outside the original estimate, and tell them it’ll probably be another X hours on top of the original project, do you want to go ahead?)
Knowing how to estimate hours is also something you get a feel for with practice. Everyone has their own way of working. To be honest, I’m almost always a little off in the estimate, but almost always as an over-estimate, so my clients stay happy anyway. For something as basic as a 5-page website, with no e-commerce or database stuff, just 5 pages of content and that’s it, I figure 2 mockups plus edits plus final build is likely 8-10 hours. More, if you’re also asking me to write/edit content, or include something like a blog or the aforementioned gallery software, which would involve setting up a database and customizing the software.
One other thing: if you freelance, come up with a clearly defined payment policy. I’ve gotten stiffed on bills before, mostly because I was trying to be accommodating (e.g. doing something “rush” and not having them pay me first). It gets tough to pursue those things since it’s hardly worth spending additional money trying to collect $200, but in a slow month that $200 might be critical for paying rent. I have a written contract which has to be signed, and I always collect a non-refundable deposit, before I lift a finger to work for a client (I’ve had clients claim they never told me to go ahead with a project and refused to pay, even though they had, and they knew it). I also have a policy of not releasing files until the balance is paid, unless the client specifically makes arrangements for some other payment plan, which again has to be in writing.
I do offer an initial consult/meeting to discuss project needs and scope, up to about an hour, for “free”, although it’s actually also built into my hourly rate. What we sort out there is what I base my estimate on.