The Best of the Best Lesbian Erotica has a story that details just such an experience that Lumpy describes, only the woman is aware at the start that it’s a pre-op drag queen, and has an affirming and positive experience that examines what it means to be female. Also in the anthology is a more depressing, but ultimately affirming story about a lesbian and a FtM. I bought it, so put me in your non-castrating group.
I’ve known several transgendered/transsexual people, immediate disclosure has always been part of the deal, and it has hampered, but not deadened, their ability to date, have sex, and form relationships. My friends are mostly pre-op, not post-op, but not being fully open with someone right away seems like a very bad way to start a relationship.
Why would someone be a pervert if they want someone with diverse plumbing, or ambiguous or androgynous sexuality? I think what Daniel is trying to say (and if I’m way off, my apologies) is that while identifying as a full/true female or male is very important to the person who has transitioned, it may be less important, as a selection tool, to the sexual partner, for whatever reason. Maybe the two don’t mesh because their priorities and expectations differ, but geez, that’s no reason for close-mindedness and condemnation.
What about the transsexuals that you don’t read? Are you telling me that your transdar is 100% accurate?
Sure, I’ll agree that 100% of transsexuals who practice immediate disclosure practice immediate disclosure. But that’s kinda tautological, now, isn’t it?
You wouldn’t know about the ones that are stealth, because you’re not going to be disclosed to (stealths only disclose anonymously or in safe spaces) and a lot of them pass so well that you’d never guess it on your own.
Nope–I’m defending the idea that people should be honest with one another in the courting process about things the other person is likely to find important.
Perhaps if you go back and read that you’ll notice a parenthetical comment; I thought that was strong enough.
Out of curiosity, what makes a man who is attracted to transsexuals “creepy” or a “pervert”? Maybe I’m naive, but I don’t see how having a pro-transsexual inclination is in itself a bad thing.
Actually, let me state that more strongly: your misrepresentation of what I said pisses me off, Kelly. I said:
I did NOT say that they have the same “obligation of disclosure.” I said they faced vaguely similar difficulties.
Since you need me to spell it out for you: transsexuals sometimes find that potential dates are scared off by finding out about their transsexuality. Herpes-positive folks sometimes find that potential dates are scared off by finding out about their herpes status. VAGUELY, I said. VAGUELY akin.
I did NOT mention anything about an obligation of disclosure there. In fact, I said I could understand how a little bit of reiticence would be the best strategy.
You may be looking to be insulted, but I’m not going to oblige you. You may apologize or not, as you see fit, for the misrepresentation. Honesty remains important to me.
I think I can understand that. Are you Latina, juanita? If so, would you want to go to a Web site for white guys looking to date Latina women?
It does seem creepy somehow, like the folks there are wanting to date a fetish and not a person. Which there’s nothing wrong with, but I wouldn’t want to be their date.
I’m sure that there are plenty of people who specifically want to date transsexuals who are not perverts. It’s just been my experience that the vast majority of them are, in fact, perverts. This is an empirical observation, not a conclusion from first principles.
Juanita’s black, so I think she would probably strike out at that site.
I can certainly see that it would be off-putting if your race or your transgender status is the only aspect of one’s persona a potential suitor found appealing.
OTOH, is it wrong to find TG folks more attractive in general. I find muscle fetishists to be creepy, but if I were single, I’d want a potential mate to be interested in my physicality.
D’oh! But the same idea applies, I think: a site for white guys interested in dating black women would be a little weird. (I’m a paleskin redhead, and I’d be ooged out by a site for folks wanting to date a redhead).
At any rate, what Kelly says about empirical observation makes complete sense.
Diet Vanilla Pepsi is not that bad. There’s no way I can excuse this hijack by claiming it’s analogous to a misunderstood, transgendered cola, but really, it’s quite good as diet colas go. Especially with at outdoor barbecues where they’re roasting a big 'ol hog.
BTDT…that was even before I knew she was a mtf post-op. Of course, that’s out of a grand total of 1 known mtf I’ve ever known of, so I can’t say all good-looking postops are unattractive.
