My parents recently had a new roof installed. The previous roof was installed around 2001, and shingles have been falling off and re-nailed since around 4 years after it was installed.
The new roof was installed by a multi-state general contracting company. When my parents met with the contractor (not the owner, but one of there guys who handles customers and does estimates) they told him the roof is a plank roof with no plywood sheeting. The contractor looked in the attic (and there are large gaps between the planks. I’d guess around 3/4 of an inch) and he said they need to put down sheeting, which my parents agreed with.
So, they installed the new roof the Saturday after Thanksgiving. My dad was at the hunting cabin and my mom spent most of the day out so she wouldn’t have to be around when they were working.
So the next day I go over there house, go into the attic, and can see the tar paper or whatever they use under the shingles. No sheeting on any of it.
My parents called the contractor about the sheeting and the chimney cricket that they also did not install (but were told to). They said they would look into the sheeting, and would send a crew to install the chimney cricket. When the workers came back to install the cricket my dad was talking to them. They gave no reason for not installing the sheeting, but said they did wonder why it wasn’t installed because the planks were all different thicknesses, with large gaps. But there were not told to sheet it, so they didn’t.
And after all of this, it looks like they will not be fixing the mistake. So far all my parents paid was the first third of the total. My dad is going to call the owner of the company next week, but it dosen’t look good.
Were just afraid that the same thing is going to happen. That shingles will start to fall off again.
Should we contact the better business bureau? Is the lack of sheeting a real concern? This is in Pennsylvania if it matters.
Was the sheeting specified in a written contract? If so, and if the won’t fix it, go to the state conractor’s licensing board, not the BBB. If it’s not in a contract, they’re probably at the roofer’s mercy whether it’s fixed.
The BBB is basically an outdated Angie’s List or Yelp. They’re like the yellow pages of consumer reviews. They’re not going to do anything homeadvisor.com couldn’t do.
First, just to be totally clear, I want to make sure that everyone is on the same page. Did they say sheeting or sheathing?
I ask because sheathing is the plywood/OSB/planks that the shingles are nailed to. Sheeting, though I don’t think I’ve heard the term, would likely refer to the underlayment (or tar paper/felt/Ice & Water)
Replacing the tar paper is just part of redoing a roof. A contractor might try and one up himself by telling you he’s going to put down new tar paper, as if they other guy won’t, but it’s SOP. But if you were actually supposed to get new decking, that’s different.
As others said, look at your contract and bill. If you weren’t billed for it, you may very well be SOL. If it’s on there, I’d demand you get your money back. The first time you brought it up, maybe the foreman just didn’t know it, but now it sounds like they’re refusing. My concern is that if you can get them to redo it, they may not do a good job.
Also, if it getting the deck replaced was required by code for some reason, call your local building inspector, especially if they were required to pull a permit.
Quick question, why were nails popping out on the old roof after 4 years just because of the deck? Was it rotted?
Anyways. This isn’t a matter for the BBB or Yelp or Facebook or Angieslist etc, not yet. Do that later. Assuming you can verify that it’s in the contract (or they violated state/local code by not replacing it), you need to go to the authorities. As I mentioned, you can have your local building inspector take a look, otherwise a local licensing board.
But, really, make sure it’s on the contract. Regardless of what you wanted, what you talked about, what you thought you were getting, if it’s not on contract and you didn’t pay for it, you don’t really have a leg to stand on.
If, when you talk to the owner, he refuses to make good on it, tell him you are first going to the local TV “2 on your side” and make sure it all goes public. Secondly, you are going to the municipality code enforcement office and lodge a complaint with them, and thirdly you’ll be contacting his bond company and licensing entity.
And I don’t care if he said ‘sheeting’ or ‘sheathing’ or ‘wax poodle’. There are industry standards for this sort of work that have to be followed, and he’s on the hook for the warranty period, which is likely to be 10 or 20 years, depending on the product.
The OP did mention “plywood sheeting,” so if that’s language the contractor used, that’s pretty clear, even if sheeting would likely usually refer to something else (an underlayment, as you said).
decking a roof isn’t cheap & would have added significantly to the price of the job, so if he paid for it (or is obligated to under contract), it’ll be there.
my .02¢ - your dad screwed the pooch a little bit by not being around that day. I’m not saying he should have had to have been, I’m saying it would’ve helped.
he would’ve been able to have stopped the forward progress the second it was apparent the delivered supplies didn’t match what what would be required for the job. stack(s) of 4x8 sheets of OSB or plywood would’ve been impossible to miss. and if the supplies weren’t noticed, the labor time to install it isn’t something that if you blink you miss it.
plus, I’ve seen workers do a little better work, be a little more mindful of their process & be lessor likely to take shortcuts when someone is home versus just being a name at the top of a work order.
But it’s good for the OP to be using the correct terminology going forward, and he should be saying “sheathing”. I agree that the guy almost certainly didn’t pull a permit, and the OP should check the contract to see if says the roofer would do that. I’m not sure about PA, but in CA you need to do at least 2 inspections when re-roofing, so the inspector would have caught this and forced a correction.
The rules for a location vary. Reroofing doesn’t require a permit or inspection here. I don’t know if sheathing is required on plank roofs either, mine didn’t have any initially, I had sheathing added when I had the roof done, but there would be no requirement, or at least no enforcement of any codes when reroofing as long as accepted materials are used. The answer will be in the costs, sheathing will cost around $100 per square (100 sq. ft.) just in the materials. That price will vary with location also but I’d expect around $150 per square total cost just for the sheathing.
Since the OP wasn’t present at the negotiation or installation it’s possible this was just a misunderstanding and the OP’s parents will have to live with what they have. And before raising a fuss about it they’ll have to evaluate the possibility that they have no case against the roofer who supplied them with an appropriate estimate or contract, and that bringing this to the attention of local authorities will require them to have the roof redone at their own cost.
Wow … the roofers didn’t lay plywood down first? … that’s a major mistake if the dad in the OP had three-tab composites laid down …
Contact the owner of the company and if he doesn’t re-strip, lay plywood and re-shingle … definitely contact his bonding company … the dad should be reimbursed all the money he’s spent so far and don’t send the company anymore money … they don’t deserve it …
The planks with the gaps is for wood shingles, they have to breath from underneath to last longer … for the most part these wood shingles are outlawed due to the extreme fire hazard they pose, as well as some structural issues (see below) … so when we strip down to these planks, they do need to be covered in plywood for the additional strength and so the composites can be nailed down …
Local terminology may be different … however, around here the term “sheathing” is used for the structural component … nail four boards together in a square and this will bend and flex and “rack” every which way … nail a fifth board at a diagonal and all this stops … so nailing plywood onto the walls and roof framing makes the element a lot stronger … again, around here nobody calls the vapor barrier “sheeting”, thus sheeting = sheathing …
ADVICE TO HOMEOWNERS - Ya gotta gotta save a bit of money every month, you will need to re-roof someday and it’s damn expensive … so often I’ve been asked to bid a roofing job just to have the customer look at me in shock … “I can’t afford that.” … sorry, that’s the cost of being a homeowner, please plan ahead …
Did they even use nails? … a lot of fly-by-night companies will just use staples …
Check with the manufacturer of the shingles. Assuming these are not wood shingles, installing them as you described is likely not in accordance with the manufacturers installation instructions. In that case, you have no warranty on the roofing material. You should have a good case for suing to have the work done correctly, or all money paid refunded.
Thanks for the replies. It is normal shingles, not wood ones. And it was 4x8 sheets of plywood. I was there when my parents first talked to him. We will need to check the local codes and what the maker of the shingles says is required.
I’d swear I replied to the following two posts last night, hamsters must’ve eaten them. Oddly, the multi-quote buttons are still lit up so I don’t know what happened.
Yes, I see that now, I must have missed it the first time around. In any case, it’s still good if everyone is on the same page. For example the OP mentioned plywood sheeting. We don’t know if me made added ‘plywood’ or misread ‘sheathing’.
Or, as you said, if could be what the contractor said or just the vernacular in the area.
Regardless of all this, the OP still has to make sure that it’s in the contract or that they violated local code. Sure, it sucks if he asked for it, but if they only thing that went wrong is that he asked for it or they said they would do it and they didn’t, the local news isn’t going to bother with it.
FTR, I’m not saying that’s what happened, I’m just say he needs to get all his ducks in a row. Check the contract, check the bill, check code, check the manufacturers installation directions (or call them), talk to the local building inspector etc.
What do you mean when you say “And it was 4x8 sheets of plywood.”?
Now, having said all that, the fact that they skipped the chimney cricket as well isn’t very promising. If a permit was pulled on the job, I’d request the inspector to come out and take a look. Tell them you don’t think they did a good job and you’d like someone that knows what to look to take a glance at it. If you haven’t paid them all the money yet AND they did the job incorrectly, you’re going to need some people on your side because you’re going to end up with a construction lien on your house and those can be a PITA.