Spread it around to who? Newton now has Greg Olsen and some warm bodies to throw to.
Maybe Cam can tape some of the $20+ million a year dollars a year he’s being overpaid to entice people to catch the ball.
Who? Who?? Ted Ginn! Jericho Cotchery! Brentsin Bersin! Corey Brown! Ed Dickson!
Oh… yeah… :smack:
Hey, I’ve heard of two of those guys! I think they were in the last Madden game I bought. In 2007.
Which reminds me of the Eli contract situation.
If all QBs were getting a new contract right now, Eli should probably be paid around (tied with a bunch for) 4th. I’m thinking something like:
Rodgers, Peyton and Brady tied for most money. (And Peyton is barely in this list.)
Eli, Big Ben, Russell Wilson, Flacco, Luck and Brees tied for 4th.
Philip Rivers, Tony Romo and Matt Ryan tied for 10th. (maybe bump Rivers up a category?)
Everyone else…wow there are a lot of crappy starting QBs this year.
The thinking for the above list is superstar clear Hall of Famers get the most, followed by face-of-the-franchises with rings (Luck has no ring but come on, he’s great) followed by clearly good franchise leaders who haven’t had a lot of post-season success.
Anyway, my point is that obviously in a vacuum, Eli doesn’t merit “top paid guy in the league” money. But that’s not how it works in the NFL. Clear franchise QBs who have accomplished something get paid top money when it’s their turn to sign a contract. This raises the bar for the next guy to sign, and everyone (good) gets a turn to raise the bar for everyone else.
Having gotten tired of all the “Eli sucks! One Hail Mary isn’t worth $100 million!” on the official Giants discussion forum, I popped in my tape of the 2011 playoff run, which I hadn’t watched since it happened. Eli was a flat-out stud, converting 3rd downs at an unreal level. So far through 2.5 games (halftime in the Conference Championship) he’s something like 6:1 TD:Int, 100+ passer rating, and 18 of 24 on 3rd down, converting 16 first downs. On third down (and mostly long) he’s converting a first down 67% of the time with a 75% completion rate. It’s just nuts.
Another thing to consider is that Eli clearly elevates his receivers. Some of Eli’s best receivers have gone on to other teams, where they promptly aren’t even good enough to get on the field. Hakeem Nicks? Sucked with the Colts. Steve Smith? Couldn’t get off the bench for Philly. Mario Manningham? Couldn’t even dress for a game with San Fran. Not that Eli turned Manningham into a star, but he sure was a playoff star.
When was the last time a Giants WR went anywhere else and was any good? The old joke used to be “former Giant, now good” as a shot at the organization not being able to get talent out of its guys. Now it’s “former Giant, now bad” because they seem to only succeed with Eli.
So you have a clear franchise QB with two rings who elevates his receivers. Sure he has off years instead of off games, but he absolutely qualifies as the “next guy up” to raise the salary bar. Guys who don’t meet that definition are guys like Cam Newton and RG3.
I’d say everyone in my three lists above qualifies, though Matt Ryan is borderline.
I’d agree with your list if you swapped out Matt Ryan for Matthew Stafford.
[I’m a Lions homer, though :D]
The problem with Eli is he has laid some real turds, too. He’s not as consistent as the top guys. But it’s not out of line to put him in that 2nd tier.
I’d bump Matt Ryan down from that tier 3 group and leave it with Rivers and Romo. I like Stafford better than Ryan as far as QB Matts go anyway.
ETA: Didn’t even see DadWagonDriver’s post. That’s funny.
Yep, I could easily be convinced on on both Ryan and Stafford.
To be honest I kind of just forgot about Stafford. I would have put him in with the tier 3 guys if I’d remembered him. And Ryan was put there just barely.
As a Ravens fan, I have a hard time putting Flacco up at fourth, but I also have a hard time arguing against it. I guess I see a difference between guys like Roethlisberger and Brees - who drive their teams to the playoffs and the Super Bowl wins - and guys like Flacco and Eli, who are solid contributors without being the motors. I’d probably break that tier into 2, moving Luck up with Roethlisberger and Brees (barely - I think with Brees we’re both paying him for past performance rather than what he’s going to do in the future) at #4 and bumping Wilson down with Flacco and Eli at 7. None of those last three guys is really the exclusive face of his franchise the way the other three are, and they all got a lot of help from their defenses when the other three don’t. Roethlisberger would have been in that same category after his first championship, but the second bumped him up.
Guess where Eli finished in PFF Rankings last year.
18th.
Under Alex Smith. Just above Mike Glennon.
Guess where Eli finished in Passer Rating in 2014.
Still trailing Alex Smith. But a step above Jay Cutler.
Guess how those showings compared to 2013.
Better. In 2013 he was 30th and 32nd.
And you want to pay him like a top 5 QB? Please do.
Yep. PFF had him as the highest rated QB in 2011 playoffs by a large margin.
But then he regressed to his mean. For two years.
I don’t think, but I am happy to see, teams (other than the Packers) paying players based on those times when they were really good for a short while is the key to success. Flacco. Eli. Cam. I’m more than happy to watch the trend continue (once again) with Eli.
You would likely have said the same thing in 2010, and been incredibly wrong.
That’s your response?
Alrighty then. Good Luck with that.
Yeah, this would have been better.
No kidding. Because nothing counters rational, reasoned statistical analysis like yelling: “SCOREBOARD BITCHES!!!”
And rings. Don’t forget rings.
If you need it spelled out…
Your rational, reasoned statistical analysis would have been to NOT resign Eli in 2010 for his current contract, correct? (6 years, $97 million total, $35 million guaranteed.)
Probably not.
And your point?
I’m guessing your point is that the only reason the Giants won the Super Bowl was because of Eli Manning, and that justifies paying him whatever he demands, even making him the highest paid QB ever. Never mind his slightly above averageness the rest of his career, that 4 game span of great play (ignoring of course the defense’s contribution), is all you need to consider when deciding his worth.
As I said, good luck with that.
“Slightly above average” is still massively better than any available replacement, and Eli has shown he can at least occasionally elevate his game. Maybe if the Packers weren’t QB-spoiled for over 20 years you’d value a not-horrible one more.
That’s it - Eli may be only the third-best quarterback at the family dinner table, but that does tend to make people underrate him. He’s got the record and the rings to show for it. How good would the Giants be with, say, Ryan Tannehill, the guy the Fins are paying like an elite QB, but … isn’t one?
Yeah, QB pay rarely has a great deal to do with objective performance. It’s all about whether you can be healthy, a good face and lucky enough to win a Super Bowl or two.
Joe Flacco has never thrown 30 touchdown passes (9 players did that last year). He’s never completed 64% or more of his passes (12 guys managed that last year including RGIII). He’s never thrown for 4,000 yards (in an era where 10+ quarterbacks do that every year). He’s never averaged better than 7.4 yards per attempt; he’s never had a passer rating over 95 (4-5 guys do both in any given season). He’s never rushed for 200 yards in a season.
Andy Dalton has done nearly all those things, despite having three fewer years in the league. But Flacco has a ring, has never missed a game, and doesn’t turn the ball over much, so he’s the seventh highest paid player in the league.
Personally, I’d rather have Eli than Flacco. Other than what appears to be a remarkably fluky four game playoff stretch in 2012 (3 3-TD games out of four after throwing for 3 TDs just three times in the entire regular season) Flacco isn’t even average. I’d rather have Matt Ryan or even Dalton, in fact.