It’s clear that the ass-kicking this judge gave defense counsel was entirely deserved - but still, it’s hard not to feel for the guy. The judge scared me, and I’m just sitting at school watching this on youtube.
For those of you at work - this video is a clip from the People’s Court (a sort of televised small-claims arbitration program). Defense counsel has just finished presenting an argument to the judge, and she isn’t impressed. She starts speaking about that, and defense counsel - a second-year law student - starts arguing with her. Then she makes her ruling, and the kid says “well, that’s your opinion”. And then the fireworks start.
I don’t claim to be any sort of master litigator - I’m just a second-year law student myself. But I’ve done some intra-school moot court competition, and moot court for our Legal Rhetoric class, and I’ve had (mock) judges shoot down my arguments. It stings, a lot. But the only acceptable response to any decision or instruction from a judge is “Thank you, Your Honor”. Or, if you happen to interrupt in the heat of the moment, you say “I’m sorry, Your Honor.” You show the court deference, darnit. This clip, in 90 seconds, provides a great explanation for why you do that.
I would have been on the judge’s side if it was a real court, and not a game show. The kid should have used a Big Lebowski (Sorry, I mean the Dude) voice. “That’s, like, your opinion, man.”
Holy crap. That judge showed restraint. That is one of the dumbest things I have seen a law student do. If it was an actual court I could see him getting handcuffed and put in jail for a brief time for contempt. OK maybe not, but he was a dumb-ass and got what he deserved.
I think you meant “chastisings shouldn’t be done in public”. I take your point - but this is private arbitration, not a courtroom, so it’s not as if the judge can hold defense counsel in contempt. It’s either a public shaming or no remedy at all. Well, maybe not - the judge might have been able to accuse the kid of violating the University of Miami Law School’s honor code - www.law.miami.edu/publications/pdf/honorcode_05_06.pdf . Section 103(p) states that
is a violation of the honor code. Section 1.01(a), in turn, lists one of the objectives as
Honor Code violations can be punished by anything ranging from an informal reprimand to expulsion, and so it seems likely that, if the judge had wanted, she could probably have filed a complaint with the school. The kid certainly acted unprofessionally, and in public. But the whole process is more of a pain in the ass than it’s worth probably. On the other hand, the “public shaming” remedy was quick, easy, and likely quite a bit of fun.
I tend to side with the judge here, but this isn’t a real court, and there is no avenue for appeal. From my understanding, the parties agree to dismiss their real court cases, and abide by the decision here.
Now, if the judge misapplies the law (which I’m not sure what the original argument was) then, in this case, you’re screwed and you lose, so you have to be insistent.
She can’t, on one hand, demand the reverance and respect for the law, while on the other hand turning the law into daytime TV entertainment…
It’s true that if the judge on one of these game shows misapplies the law, there’s no real room for appeal, but since the money comes out of the show, not the losing party, no one really loses anything.
Since it’s clearly a TV show, an entertainment venue, why should the TV judge be accorded the same respect as a real judge, especially since, as is stated above, the money comes out of te TV show’s coffers, not the losing party’s? Why not call her a dumbass bitch? What the hell could she do about it, except respond in kind?
In my understanding, both parties are paid an appearance fee, and any judgement monies are subtracted from that fee, so in essence, you are fighting for more money in your pockets.
And, for me, it would be a matter of personal pride to win the case…
She is a real judge, for one thing. And I think her point was that if he was going to go on the show and act like he knows how to be a lawyer, then he should act like he knows how to be a lawyer.
In my original response I forgot to keep that in mind. I completely agree. But he better not ever act like that in a real court. Now I guess I will have to go post in “How has the Dope changed your mind” thread. Thanks EC.
You’re right that there’s not much the judge can do about it, but she should still be afforded respect. I’m no fan of The People’s Court or its ilk, but the fact remains that it isn’t just a game show. It’s arbitration, and it’s binding - parties who’ve already filed small-claims cases agree to withdraw their civil claims and abide by the judge’s decision on the show. The fact that a camera is in the room makes the whole thing into a bit of a tawdry affair, which is one reason I’m not a fan, but Judge Millian really is a former Florida judge, and she really is trying to decide these cases as the law says they should be decided. To my mind, a judge in a private arbitration proceeding is absolutely worthy of respect. And there is no reason for a second-year law student to fail to show it. We’re taught better than that.
No she isn’t. Once you step down from the bench you are a regular person entitled to no more respect than anyone else. Just because she used to be a judge doesn’t mean she is one now, and playing one on tv does not make you one either, even if you once held the actual position.
While I agree that the kid was a total dip, I have to wonder if that was the proper behavior for a judge to take. From the clip, it seemed as if he was explaining what he meant by putting the woman “on notice,” and the judge was explaining in his documents how he didn’t (she was not giving her ruling.) He mouthed off, she got all huffy and immediately ruled for the plaintiff. Does that mean, all you have to do is piss off a judge and they can automatically rule against you? It doesn’t seem right.
Which goes back to my post. In a “real” court, you could state your case, be polite, and let the judge rule.
Then if a judge had misapplied the law (I’m not saying she did or didn’t) you have an avenue for appeal to correct the error.
This this daytime TV court drama, the judge’s order is final and there is no appeal. So if she is misapplying the law, you MUST be forceful in getting heard because it is your only chance.
I don’t know, I think being a former judge and a former law professor (at the kid’s own law school, no less), does entitle her even on a social level to a certain amount of respect. And what Mr. Excellent says here is exactly right:
If I agreed to a binding arbirtration hearing run by a retired judge, I would absolutely consider that person as worthy of respect during the proceeding as any “real” judge.
Other than the money, I don’t understand why people would want to litigate on TV. And why would a second-year law school student want to go on TV, opening himself up to ridicule? It doesn’t make sense to me. It always seems to me that these Court TV things are staged. The judge in this video makes a ruling and then just walks away without adjourning. I never get these things.
I take your point - but this is private arbitration, not a courtroom, so it’s not as if the judge can hold defense counsel in contempt. It’s either a public shaming or no remedy at all. Well, maybe not - the judge might have been able to accuse the kid of violating the University of Miami Law School’s honor code - www.law.miami.edu/publications/pdf/honorcode_05_06.pdf . Section 103(p) states that