– duffer has completely lost his shit. How is it in the deep end, buddy?
– eponymous is being a lot more civil, but is clearly biased. No, it’s not inherently wrong for a union to negotiate from strength, or to strike. But can you honestly say that the TWU’s particular demands are reasonable? Or that MTA (and the city in general), given the rapidly escalating pension costs, doesn’t have a responsibility to soften the blow and remain on solid financial footing? Before you answer. . .
– No one seems to have kept up with the latest news about the negotiations. The most recent MTA offer was as follows: new TWU members still pay nothing toward their health insurance, and still retire at 55. The Union gets an 11% raise over three years, and an extra holiday (MLK Jr. Day). In exchange, the new members must contribute 6% of their salary to their pensions, up form 2% (present members would see no change). Link.
Even if you really do think that the MTA’s demands are unreasonable, the fact remains that the strike is illegal, and for good reason. It’s the holiday shopping season, and many stores are running a deficit every day they stay open because no one is shopping. Hundreds of thousands can’t get to work, maybe two million more are seriously inconvenienced in the effort. Many children can’t get to school, and the ones who can sometimes don’t have teachers.
Because you can’t replace 34,000 workers at the drop of a hat, obviously. Because it’s more practical, for now, to hope that an agreement can be reached with the current crop of workers. Because the MTA is negotiating in good faith.
Negotiating “in good faith” cannot possibly include using the time, money, and jobs of 8 million third parties as leverage. The strike is immoral.
Most public sector employees in New York are unionized and the Taylor Law covers all of them. I am a unionized NYS employee, and there are a lot of things I expect my union to do, even though we can’t strike. I expect it mostly to enforce the contract. I expect it to make reasonable demands and negotiate back and forth. I do not expect them to put me in the position of striking or scabbing supposedly to protect people who are not yet dues-paying members, but more likely to keep union leaders from being remembered as the ones who “sold the unborn”. Unless the strike ends quickly, this will go to arbitration, with or without the TWU’s agreement and the TWU knows they won’t get everything they are demanding in arbitration (neither will the MTA). They are almost certain to lose on the new pension tier-especially now that the offer includes retirement at 55 with a higher contribution from new members.
The MTA can’t immediately fire all the workers because the terms of the previous contract are still in effect and therefore it will take time to fire them.Doesn’t mean it can’t be done, just means it will take time.Probably longer than the arbitration will.
Thanks for the clarification, sunfish. Despite what some people think, I wasn’t trying to lie (cue ominous music) with statistics, I just saw that on the blog and thought it was both humorous and relevant to the discussion. But you are right, the numbers are already ridiculous enough without statistical manipulation.
The strike is illegal. Bloomberg should do what Reagan did with the air traffic controllers. Start hiring replacement workers now. Announce a 10 day amnesty - anyone willing to come back to work within 10 days can keep their jobs. After that, their jobs are gone, permanently. In the meantime, arrest the union leaders and charge them with breaking the law. I understand the union is already being fined $1 million per day.
There’s a reason it’s illegal for these guys to strike. It cripples a city, and hurts the nationwide economy. They know that, they agreed to it. Part of the reason they have the sweet deal they have is in compensation for their no-strike requirement. They violated it. They’re done. Give them one chance to come back, and if they don’t take it, they can find other jobs. Or rather, they can be hired back into the non-union transit system at a big cut in pay.
Same reasons any other union exists, one might imagine.
Because that would take many months, meanwhile the city would be paralyzed and that is obviously (or should be obviously; apparently it isn’t) the overriding problem. The transit system needs to get running again now, and the only way to do it is by getting these union workers back on the job now. Can you think of a more effective means of doing that than what is being done already?
The desire of some to see some simple acts of vengeance occur, regardless of consequences, that we’ve seen in this thread is typical of their positions on other matters we’ve discussed.
Shouldn’t this be Trinidad-American? Or if African-American=black, why even bother to bring up his race? Do you hear people referring to other union leaders as white?
This seems very odd. Why make a special point over his race?
I would love to see Sam Stone’s idea acted upon. Unfortunately, if you don’t get a large percentage of the striking workforce returning, the NYC transit system is fucked. I don’t like to use unskilled to describe bus drivers, train operators, and conductors. These people have a skill, honed through OJT, that will be lost to the system. You cannot just hire a school bus driver, stick him in a city bus with a map, and expect it to work smoothly. And there is no private equivalent for operating a subway. NYC’s aging (some might say ancient) equipment also has many quirks that can’t be taught.
There are a number of workers who do not agree with the strike, but are either afraid or unwilling to cross the picket line. But crossing the picket line wouldn’t help, again, unless a large majority choose to cross. You cannot handle NYC transit with 1000 people (well, maybe at 3:30am, but that’s about it).
The people of NYC are being held hostage needlessly. Even with the fines under the Taylor Law and the $1,000,000 daily fine, this will cost NY far more than it will cost the union or the individual workers (and IMNSHO, anyone who voted for a strike should be fined 3 days pay per day missed, and those who voted against should only lose 1 day’s pay per day missed).
I think the Italian transportation workers union (whatever it’s called) got it right when they went on strike a few years back. Instead of walking off the job, they kept the buses and trains going on their usual schedule (well, as much of a schedule as Italian public transit keeps anyhow…), but refused to collect fares. In this way they put pressure on management while maintaining public goodwill. The TWU in NYC is apparently blind to good PR practices, regardless of the neccesity and/or greedy idiocy of their strike. :wally
You can’t drive “some” of the buses and subways (assuming mgmt rose through the ranks and are trained and all certifications are current). Running 2-3 train lines infrequently and a few dozen buses is not going to help the city. I think they would actually make things worse.
I didn’t say “some of the buses,” I said “some of the management.” I don’t know how many managers/supervisors there are. Would there be enough to fill in?
In a word, even without knowing the actual numbers…no.
First, the only managers / supervisors who would be able to fill in would have to be ones who came up through the ranks. Two, after going into management, they would have to maintain whatever certificates or training MTA deems necessary to safely operate the system.
Even if they get 1/2 the buses and trains running, they wouldn’t have a support staff. Stations, buses, and trains are in bad enough condition as is. Hordes of people trying to catch the few trains/buses will turn them into dumpsters. The system, operating at capacity, is packed in the mornings. The only saving grace would be that next week is generally a slow week.
On the Philip Lopate show this morning this morning they had some self-righteous Union rep talking about how they’re victims of racism, evidenced by Bloomberg calling the strike “thuggish.” Just when I thought they couldn’t lose any more of sympathy…
ivylass, to continue, I don’t know if you are familiar with service NYC mass transit provides during rush hour. Most subway lines run trains into Manhattan every 3-5 minutes. On my pathetically inadequate Queens bus line that takes me to one of those trains (when I’m going midtown; when I go downtown I can walk to a different train line), there are at least 6 buses running the ~35-40 minute route in the morning. And they are all full, subways and buses alike. Lose a driver or two on the buses, or a train or two, and there are ripple effects throughout the morning commute.
Regarding support staff…are the mechanics and the janitors (do the janitors clean the buses?) on strike, or is it just the drivers?
When Ivylad was working, he had to maintain a CDL even though he was a mechanic, not a driver. Mechanics were often required to drive the buses, even if it was just around the parking lot.
According to this (the redirected site for TWU Local 100), this includes maintenance crews, switching crews, and signal maintainers. I can’t find anything which lists exactly who is covered among the Local 100, but I didn’t search too deeply.
This really sucks for me, I’ve scheduled a week’s vacation to NYC starting January 11th, if those jerks get all those seminars and functions cancelled I hope that Pataki goes all Reagan on their heinies.
Pataki doesn’t have the balls Nancy Reagan had. Now if Guiliani were governor (which I am glad he isn’t), they would have been fired last week in a preemptory move.