One should also note that shooting down spy planes is not in and of itself considered any sort of provocation, but rather an occasion for the nation flying the spy plane to apologize to the nation being spied on: see U-2 Crisis of 1960.
So, this isn’t even weak; it directly contradicts the idea that Iran is being provocative towards the US, and shows that we are in fact being provocative towards them, if you’re of a mind to think that.
You’re several days late with that information. See post #68.
They are perfectly entitled to shoot down any foreign aircraft spying in their air space. And as this wasn’t a manned vehicle, despite whatever your disengenuous wording might seem to convey, doubly so in this case.
Meanwhile let’s remember Iran Air Flight 655
Are you suggesting America would not shoot down any Iranian spy planes it detects in US airspace?
I’m suggesting that shooting down another country’s aircraft is a provocative act, which is all I was responding to.
Of course, if had been the U.S. shooting down an Iranian spy plane over Iraq, I’m sure you’d all be saying, “of coure the U.S. has the right to shoot down the plane” - right?
Responding to a provocative act (violating sovereign airspace) is itself provocative? Nonsense.
Of course. No inconsistency there. Any sovereign nation has the duty to defend itself.
But Iraq is not a sovereign nation, despite pretensions to the contrary; and the U.S. “defending” it from Iran is like one wolf defending its kill from another.
So long as the supposedly sovereign nation authorised the action I’d have no problem at all either. Even if it was a real plane and not some crappy drone.
Even if it is true that a US drone spying on Iran was shot down in Iran, on *whose * part is the “provocative act”?
Doesn’t matter, just tell the Americans to go send their people in and kick some ass, right? :rolleyes:
Gawdamighty, Sam, have you learned nothing at all?
I’m sorry, but this is just beyond the pale.
Any nation has a right to defend itself against spying from another nation.
To claim that Iran is being provocative by shooting down an American spy plane is a direct contradiction of recognized international law.
I am absolutely appalled at this blatant display of ignorance.
This is NOT the same thing as saying, before we go down this path, that Iran isn’t being provocative with a lot of the other things it does. It is. No doubt. But this doesn’t qualify.
This, as a matter of simple fact, was a provocation by the US against Iran. Iran would have had every right to bring this before the UN for condemnation, had they been so inclined.
They weren’t. That in and of itself is a sign that the Iranian regime isn’t nearly as whacked out as the pro-Administration extremists like Sam Stone say they are.
I am sick and tired, beyond sick and tired, I am absolutely up to my eyeballs with disgust at the constant, four years long by now, hankering after war, war and more war.
Enough already.
Even more astonishing is that Sam is a professed small-l libertarian, which goes clean against practically everything W (in practice) stands for.