Wrong.
There is nothing right about allowing a pedophile a soapbox for spewing the kind of shit Cesario has spewed here before.
Astounding. I want to believe you’re whooshing us. Please tell me you are.
After a decade, hundreds of thousand of posts, and tens of thousands of threads we haven’t figured out whether a thread “can remain civil and reasonable even in the face of something we find personally repulsive”?
Was this a question in your mind? Because I have seen hundreds-----and likely thousands----of threads that answer that question without a shadow of a doubt.
Have you read posts from this guy? Did you think this was going to be a SDMB Dr. Phil episode, where we all come away with a keener appreciation of each other? Have you read his posts?
Is this a topic you’re interested in, and did you really think a thread like this would actually “gain a lot of valuable information about the psychology of a pedophile; the same way it is important to learn about the psychology of all people,…”? Are you in the habit of gaining insight about weighty matters like this from an internet message board?
Lastly, the line that has me equally stunned and enraged, do you really believe that “If a thread like this failed, that says something about all of us, and it’s not a good thing”?
I mean no disrespect, but this is probably the most misguided most in recent memory.
I am sorry I have stunned and enraged you. I am sorry you have such a deep and personal fear of the exchange of information. I think that in the interest of being gentlemen, we ought to agree to disagree because I stand by every word I said in that post.
I’ll be frank: your attitude upsets me more (and I’m not prone to being upset easily) for just how misguided it is.
I’m all for free speech. But this place purports to be a community.
Look at Giraffe’s Pit OP!
I don’t doubt you’re well intentioned. But if your attitude is pervasive enough to carry the day and allow this…person… a voice to espouse his filth than I don’t want to be part of this community.
I apologize as well.
I feel strongly about this. Very strongly.
And I’m sure my attitude reflects that.
I agree he is being disruptive by shoehorning posts about his sexual desires into unrelated threads. This should be stopped. I wouldn’t have a problem with one thread that he could post in and discuss it, and others could ask him whatever they wanted. If the mods saw fit to confine him to that one thread, and prohibiting him from posting elsewhere, I would be in agreement.
There is such an unbelievably deep social taboo against pedophilia, I truly do understand why it is so repulsive to people. There are also extremely strong taboos against cutting open dead people and looking at their insides - but if we didn’t do that, we’d know nothing of medicine and anatomy. Sometimes in the interest of knowledge, inquiring people must withstand disturbing things.
Those not cut out for this are free to exclude themselves and I don’t begrudge them their desire to do so.
It doesn’t change the fact that you know how this place is. A thread like Cesario proposes will not be on in which where everyone has their pinkies out and observe proper decorum at all time.
THIS thread is barely civil and only because it has to be as it is in ATMB.
And if you really think this is about some sort of fear of discussion, you are sorely mistaken. It is all about not giving a pedophile a soapbox to pontificate on his deviant practices.
You both said what I feel so well. I think I would have different feelings about the possibility of such a thread as suggested by the OP if at any point the OP had expressed the slightest awareness that his sexual desires were not just statistically deviant, but actively repugnant to a large percentage of the population. I would definitely have more sympathy for him.
And I’m also a little grossed out by the suspicious that the OP is currently reading this thread and getting off on this discussion.
These things are not remotely like each other.
If you want to learn about pedos, I’m sure there are plenty of message boards where you can learn all you want and more.
This thread is more than barely civil. I think it is quite reasonable and everyone here has conducted themselves well. Let’s not sell ourselves short.
I think one thread where this person can answer questions about his condition would be appropriate, soapbox or not. Others should refrain from attacking him. If they can’t do this, they should simply stay out of the thread.
As I said, you are free to read whatever pedo board you want for all of the information you want.
As for me, I don’t want that crap here.
But I guess some sort of idealistic notion of free speech or whatever is more important to you than the feelings of others.
The feelings of others are important, but they should not stand in the way of a discussion as long as everyone is being civil and respectful and not engaging in personal attacks. As I have said - several times - everyone is free to view whichever threads they want, and there is an ignore function on the board.
And how you got to 11,000 posts and believe that this guy deserves------or will receive----- civility and respect baffles me, frankly.
This is the best summary of what I believe should be the course of action.
You think the number of times Argent Towers has posted bears on his ability to determine what level of respect another person deserves?
I hate ATMB in general and try to stay out of the discussions because I think the attitude in here is nothing like the attitude of the board population as a whole, but this conversation in particular kind of worries me. What’s the worst thing that can happen? He’s not actually going to take advantage of children in the thread… the only effect that refusing to allow discussion will achieve is that the people who don’t want to think about it at all won’t have to, I guess. But that isn’t really anybody else’s problem.
The guy’s willing to talk about a subject that I don’t know very goddamned much about. He’s smart, he’s willing to tolerate a lot of abuse for what he says, whether dispensed righteously or otherwise, and he’s playing by the rules of the board. What exactly is the harm?
It’s not like if he crosses a line the presence of this one particular thread is going to prevent that from being dealt with. He’s currently being pitted for talking about the subject matter in other threads, which obviously offends people. To put it another way, if he can’t start the thread, shouldn’t we just ban him as a democratic exercise of “our” right not to have him talk about things that are gross? He’s gonna talk about it one way or the other.
I’m trying to think if letting this play out could be a good thing. There is no doubt in my mind that it will be a trainwreck; I guess the real question is, should the mods/admins pre-emptively prevent a trainwreck like that.
I don’t understand how the board can ban posting about illegal activities such as illegal downloading or the like, whether or not they have occurred, yet allow a pedophile to post about his impulses. I believe that if he wants a forum for his views, he should find one or start one someplace else. It’s not the place of this board to provide a forum for everyone and everything.
And perhaps one victim of child sexual abuse may be okay with it as they have stated, but I doubt the rest of them are going to be okay with it. Telling them “just don’t read it” is dismissive and condescending.
I believe that the free speech issue here is more one of falsely shouting “fire” in a crowded theater. It can cause too much harm. Not all speech is protected. And, the likelihood of bringing in more pedophiles from the web looking for justification and information is pretty much guaranteed.
Sometimes I just wish I could download an album for free off the internet, because I want it, but I can’t, because it’s illegal. So I don’t download music illegally.
Or, sometimes I wish I could just blast a fat rail of coke after a long day at work. But I don’t, because it’s illegal. I just think it should be legal.
See, I said those things, and I don’t think I’m going to get banned for it. And you can tell me whether you think it’s wrong for me to have those impulses, and why.
Again, what’s the harm, specifically?
I agree, and while it might be interesting to gain some insight on the mental illness that is pedophilia, 1> I think we’d get higher-quality insight from a qualified mental health professional and, 2> my understanding is that he doesn’t even recognize it as an illness, so his own insight would be extremely limited, at best. It’s probably more likely he’d use it as a soapbox or as a means to justify himself to himself (which is obviously not healthy).
Plus, I think it opens up all kinds of legal/liability issues for the Reader and the message board.