People who hate children

[curlcoat]

@Yeticus_Rex

Perspective side note: We all have been those snotty & bratty kids at least once in our lives. Pretty sure we all could have been pitted back in the day if they had the internet.

Well, way back in the day when I was a little kid, we didn’t go out in public much during the years where we were likely to be snotty and/or bratty. I didn’t go to a grocery store until I was at least nine (it was after we moved), or anything other than a McDonalds type restaurant until I was 12. And yet, somehow I learned to grocery shop and restaurant manners. Go figure. And guess what! Both my parents worked/went to school until I was seven or eight!

[curlcoat]

@mswas

Who is being used and abused? Your imaginary persecution complex is none of my concern. You have to share your nation with people who disagree with you boohoohoo. You’re a big fucking crybaby.

I know this is the pit and all, but good lord that was immature. Lets take them one at a time here -

1. My taxes are not imaginary. The requirement that I work holidays because I “didn’t have a family” was not imaginary. The jobs/advancements I lost because it was assumed I’d be like all other women and quit to have babies was not imaginary. The expectation that I put up with damage to my property because “they’re just kids” is not imaginary. The fact that it is OK with everyone that the kids across the street scream for hours, yet it is illegal for my dogs to bark is not imaginary. Just a few examples there.

2. I imagine that when the blacks were told they had to share a nation with people that disagreed with their impression that they were humans, who should be equal, they didn’t particularly appreciate the “boohoo”. Obviously, we don’t have it as bad as the blacks, but the point is - just because a majority thinks “X”, doesn’t make it right.

3. Pointing out inequities makes me a crybaby? Okaaay.

[keturah]

@curlcoat

The original point was that (to use your interpretation of the law) I have the same rights of access to stores with any service dog or dog in training that I have. The original question was, if that dog were to start screaming for no real reason or run amok down the aisles, how many seconds of patience would you have for that? Why is it, by law, that I am required to remove a service dog that is creating a scene but no one is required to remove a toddler? The service dog actually has a function there - the toddler doesn’t. And don’t say “well duh, the toddler is a human” - the handicapped person is a human too.

To address your original point/question service dogs are given leeway because of the human that they will aid. Also, not to seem trite, but can you cite the law that requires removal of a service dog in any circumstance?

From your posts I take that you train service dogs. You have to take them out when they are puppies in order to let them learn about the world to train them, correct? Do they always behave the first few times? I’m pretty sure not–as a matter of fact, while working in a restaurant I once cleaned up pee from a service dog, happily. In my little corner of the world, service dogs wear specific gear that identify them as service dogs in training. IME most people allow extra leeway for the these animals sometimes erratic behavior with no pissing or moaning.

[keturah]

@curlcoat

Well, way back in the day when I was a little kid, we didn’t go out in public much during the years where we were likely to be snotty and/or bratty. I didn’t go to a grocery store until I was at least nine (it was after we moved), or anything other than a McDonalds type restaurant until I was 12. And yet, somehow I learned to grocery shop and restaurant manners. Go figure. And guess what! Both my parents worked/went to school until I was seven or eight!

Did you ever think that you learned these things in spite of rather than because of your parents? You are obviously unhappy with your upbringing–maybe you could take a step back and hope that all of these little humans you detest may have a happier upbringing. Maybe they will not have to suffer as you profess to have suffered while learning to live and belong to a responsible society.

[RickJay]

@curlcoat

One doesn’t have to actually pop the kid out to get stuck raising it ya know. In my case, I ended up with my last two brothers, until I escaped the family home.

“Escaped” from who, then? I’m guessing your parent(s) was/were there and you just helped out, like most older siblings, which is, well, a pathetic comparison to actually raising a child. You seem remarkably bitter about the most conventional, mundane things.

The original point was that (to use your interpretation of the law) I have the same rights of access to stores with any service dog or dog in training that I have.

Liar. This wasn’t your original point at all; you were claiming DOGS had a right to access. Dogs have no such rights.

The original question was, if that dog were to start screaming for no real reason or run amok down the aisles, how many seconds of patience would you have for that? Why is it, by law, that I am required to remove a service dog that is creating a scene but no one is required to remove a toddler?

To answer the question that isn’t stupid (the first one) I’d have lots of patience if a handicapped person’s service animal had a bit of a tantrum and start howling or some such thing; why would I get worked up about that? Sure, it’s not pleasant to hear a dog howl, but so what? It would not be fair to a person needing a service dog to wig out over something that trivial.

Fortunately, this sort of thing rarely happens, just as children rarely have serious meltdowns. If either scenario become common it’d be a problem. They’re not common problems, either here or where you live.

The service dog actually has a function there - the toddler doesn’t. And don’t say “well duh, the toddler is a human” - the handicapped person is a human too.

Nobody’s suggesting throwing handicapped people out of stores. Perhaps you’re insane.

Amazing how you think you have any idea what the children are like here.

It’s pretty logical to assume they’re like kids everywhere. I’ve been all over your state, incidentally, for long periods of time, in many areas, and my experience in public places there is precisely the same as it is anywhere else I’ve been.

If I had kept them, I could send you the reciepts to replace the planters in the front yard that the neighborhood children destroyed. Or I could send you a picture of the damage in the shell on our truck, courtesy of the kids climbing in the tree in our yard, bending a branch so it scratched hell out of the truck. Or pictures of the dents in our fiberglass garage door from the soccer balls. And we live in a fairly high end neighborhood. I don’t have a digital video camera so I can’t send you videos of screaming babies in stores, or kids on heelies running into shoppers - sorry.

Well, of course you don’t have video. All you have is your imagination, which I am guessing exaggerates the truth by an order of magnitude (at least.) Look at your claim that “parents don’t adapt to anyone at all,” which is obviously a lie, or your bizarre rantings about taxes (as if you didn’t go to public school; why should you have been supported in school but not have to do your share?) You’re a bitter old nut, the kind that blames everything, real and imagined, on whatever identifiable groups you hate.

My sister works in a constituency office for an MPP (our equivalent of a state representative) and she has a few constituents just like you. They call constantly and demand something be done about the neighbours who’re breaking everything; with one it’s kids, with one it’s “Japanese” (she’s an old lady and doesn’t realize her Asian neighbours are Vietnamese) and with one it’s just all nearby neighbours. Invariably, the problems are insanely exaggerated; one incident, or none, that happened years ago if it did at all, is parlayed into a hundred incidents that are almost all nonexistent or attributable to something else, like the wind knocking branches off trees. In one hilarious case, the lady who complained about her neighbours insisted the MPP and my sister come out and see “All the green and white and black paint they’re splashing on my porch.” Turned out it was bird shit. She was leaving birdseed on the porch, and they were crapping on it.

You’re going to be one of those crazy old ladies. You’re well on your way.

[mswas]

@curlcoat

I know this is the pit and all, but good lord that was immature. Lets take them one at a time here -

1. My taxes are not imaginary. The requirement that I work holidays because I “didn’t have a family” was not imaginary. The jobs/advancements I lost because it was assumed I’d be like all other women and quit to have babies was not imaginary. The expectation that I put up with damage to my property because “they’re just kids” is not imaginary. The fact that it is OK with everyone that the kids across the street scream for hours, yet it is illegal for my dogs to bark is not imaginary. Just a few examples there.

Maybe you lost jobs and advancements because you weren’t as good at your job as you thought you were. Hillary Clinton wasn’t passed up and she HAD a kid. Yeah, you put up with property damage because they are just kids, human beings need to advance to a higher level of understanding, just like you did.

2. I imagine that when the blacks were told they had to share a nation with people that disagreed with their impression that they were humans, who should be equal, they didn’t particularly appreciate the “boohoo”. Obviously, we don’t have it as bad as the blacks, but the point is - just because a majority thinks “X”, doesn’t make it right.

You’re the one who doesn’t accept real actual people as being humans, and you invoke solidarity with the oppression of black people? Really?

3. Pointing out inequities makes me a crybaby? Okaaay.

Wow you are really batshit.

There are no inequities. People put up with your crying when you were a baby and now it’s your turn. That’s perfect equity.

Taxes pay for many services I don’t partake of, but that doesn’t mean I resent a whole cohort of the population because of it.

You are one of the most selfish people I have ever had occasion to speak to. You are lost in your little egomaniacal fantasy.

I took this to the pit because your position has no value, it is morally bankrupt and not worthy of a thinking creature. It is all about you and you call everyone else selfish.

[keturah]

@curlcoat

I imagine that when the blacks were told they had to share a nation with people that disagreed with their impression that they were humans, who should be equal, they didn’t particularly appreciate the “boohoo”. Obviously, we don’t have it as bad as the blacks, but the point is - just because a majority thinks “X”, doesn’t make it right.

I imagine that when children were told that they had to share a nation with people that disagreed with their impression that they were humans, who should be equal, they did not appreciate the “boohoo”. Obviously, we don’t have it as bad as the children, but the point is - just because one woman says we are equivalent to service dogs, doesn’t make it right.

[keturah]

Another point of interest–Why do you refer to black people as the blacks? I honestly think that you live in a disadvantaged neighborhood based on your description, however I don’t refer to you as white trash. I just think that you are garden variety nuts. You are showing either your prejudice or your age.

[curlcoat]

@keturah

To address your original point/question service dogs are given leeway because of the human that they will aid. Also, not to seem trite, but can you cite the law that requires removal of a service dog in any circumstance?

Here is an example. It is unfortunate that most people seem to feel that a well trained dog is more likely to cause a disturbance than a baby/toddler, but that is the reality.

From your posts I take that you train service dogs. You have to take them out when they are puppies in order to let them learn about the world to train them, correct? Do they always behave the first few times? I’m pretty sure not–as a matter of fact, while working in a restaurant I once cleaned up pee from a service dog, happily. In my little corner of the world, service dogs wear specific gear that identify them as service dogs in training. IME most people allow extra leeway for the these animals sometimes erratic behavior with no pissing or moaning.

“Sometimes erratic behavior” doesn’t tend to translate into running amok or making loud noises for a long period of time, right? (If it does, someone needs to revisit their training.) As for my personal dogs, my current service dog didn’t go out in public - to non-doggy places - until he was over three and had quite a bit of training into him. Most of the training is done at home, in parks, in training groups, etc. Therefore, his “maiden voyage” went without a hitch. He understood his duties and his responsibilities, but if something had happened I’d have removed him from the public eye to have a talk with him. I am far more aware of my responsibility to the general public than the average mother is.

[curlcoat]

@keturah

Did you ever think that you learned these things in spite of rather than because of your parents?

Actually, no. Whatever other problems my upbringing might have had, that was the norm for the day back then. “Children should be seen but not heard” was the rule of the day then. As was teaching them manners at home before taking them out in public, rather than the vice versa that seems to be common today.

You are obviously unhappy with your upbringing–maybe you could take a step back and hope that all of these little humans you detest may have a happier upbringing. Maybe they will not have to suffer as you profess to have suffered while learning to live and belong to a responsible society.

I don’t recall professing to have suffered. Yes, my father was an asshole, but even so my upbringing was not significantly different than the other children of my generation.

[curlcoat]

@RickJay

“Escaped” from who, then? I’m guessing your parent(s) was/were there and you just helped out, like most older siblings, which is, well, a pathetic comparison to actually raising a child. You seem remarkably bitter about the most conventional, mundane things.

Your interpretation, which is incorrect. As for how much I ended up raising my last two brothers, it was far more than “helping out”.

Liar. This wasn’t your original point at all; you were claiming DOGS had a right to access. Dogs have no such rights.

Sigh. Whatever. The dogs have a right to access because of who they accompany. That better?

To answer the question that isn’t stupid (the first one) I’d have lots of patience if a handicapped person’s service animal had a bit of a tantrum and start howling or some such thing; why would I get worked up about that? Sure, it’s not pleasant to hear a dog howl, but so what? It would not be fair to a person needing a service dog to wig out over something that trivial.

Then you are far more patient than most folks. There are many people that “wig out” just because the dog is there, not doing anything at all. If nothing else, look at the difference in access between dogs and children and then tell me that most folks don’t care if they share space with a dog.

Fortunately, this sort of thing rarely happens, just as children rarely have serious meltdowns.

I suppose it would depend on your definition of “serious meltdown”.

Nobody’s suggesting throwing handicapped people out of stores. Perhaps you’re insane.

Uh, well, if the service dog is thrown out do you think the handicapped person just lets it go run into traffic?

It’s pretty logical to assume they’re like kids everywhere. I’ve been all over your state, incidentally, for long periods of time, in many areas, and my experience in public places there is precisely the same as it is anywhere else I’ve been.

Lucky you. I think however it is more that you have far more tolerance for kids misbehaving than non-parents do. God knows the parents of the kids don’t seem to notice what is going on.

Well, of course you don’t have video. All you have is your imagination, which I am guessing exaggerates the truth by an order of magnitude (at least.) Look at your claim that “parents don’t adapt to anyone at all,” which is obviously a lie, or your bizarre rantings about taxes (as if you didn’t go to public school; why should you have been supported in school but not have to do your share?) You’re a bitter old nut, the kind that blames everything, real and imagined, on whatever identifiable groups you hate.

Not even going to bother to respond to this since it is beyond reality.

My sister works in a constituency office for an MPP (our equivalent of a state representative) and she has a few constituents just like you. They call constantly and demand something be done about the neighbours who’re breaking everything;

Since I have never called anyone about any of these sorts of things, this obviously doesn’t apply to me.

[curlcoat]

@mswas

Maybe you lost jobs and advancements because you weren’t as good at your job as you thought you were. Hillary Clinton wasn’t passed up and she HAD a kid.

Oh, yeah, that’s realistic - compare Hillary Clinton to the pink collar jobs I held. Especially since Hillary rode her husband’s coat tails.

Yeah, you put up with property damage because they are just kids, human beings need to advance to a higher level of understanding, just like you did.

Say what? You are seriously telling me that it is OK for children to destroy things just because they are children, with no recourse?

There are no inequities. People put up with your crying when you were a baby and now it’s your turn. That’s perfect equity.

Taxes pay for many services I don’t partake of, but that doesn’t mean I resent a whole cohort of the population because of it.

You are one of the most selfish people I have ever had occasion to speak to. You are lost in your little egomaniacal fantasy.

I took this to the pit because your position has no value, it is morally bankrupt and not worthy of a thinking creature. It is all about you and you call everyone else selfish.

OMG, I’m batshit? Are you totally unaware of what you just posted there?

Actually, I don’t think you are crazy, I think you are typical of your generation - arrogant and completely unconcerned about anyone other than yourself and yours. Unable to think for yourself, unconcerned with history so unable to learn from it and extremely narrow minded (“my child has a right to be here, but those awful Mexicans don’t”). I’d be worried about what you all are going to turn this county into, except that the powers that be don’t care about you either.

[Loach]

Maybe they are damaging your property because you’re a douche nozzle. Kids are perceptive that way.

[starwarsfreek42]

Today a bunch of kids were congregated in a corner of my yard, and I yelled at them to get off my lawn. Made me feel manly. If they had been damaging my property, I’d have called the cops.

[Idle_Thoughts]

Dnfft! (cc)

[even_sven]

@curlcoat

Well, way back in the day when I was a little kid, we didn’t go out in public much during the years where we were likely to be snotty and/or bratty. I didn’t go to a grocery store until I was at least nine (it was after we moved), or anything other than a McDonalds type restaurant until I was 12. And yet, somehow I learned to grocery shop and restaurant manners. Go figure. And guess what! Both my parents worked/went to school until I was seven or eight!

Well, you didn’t learn how to act like a human in society, you dried-up broken souled bitter freak.

[Left_Hand_of_Dorkness]

@curlcoat

I fail to see why I am expected to put up with your - er - unpleasant children.

You can fail to see why all you’d like, but the fact remains that you ARE so expected. If you don’t put up with a child you find unpleasant, socially speaking, YOU are the one who will pay the consequence.

Christ almighty, if you were in my class, this level of whining and petulance would have landed you at the silent lunch table by now. I do not tolerate it.

[Left_Hand_of_Dorkness]

@curlcoat

Then you are far more patient than most folks. There are many people that “wig out” just because the dog is there, not doing anything at all. If nothing else, look at the difference in access between dogs and children and then tell me that most folks don’t care if they share space with a dog.

Two points:

1. Three people have responded to your idiot hypothetical so far. All three of us have said that yes, we’d tolerate a howling service dog.
2. Yes, let’s look at the difference in access between dogs and children. Notice something? Unless the dog is helping out a person (or training to help a person), society is much more tolerant of children in public places than of dogs in public places. Society thinks you’re wrong.

Got it?

SOCIETY THINKS YOU’RE WRONG.

You’ve got probably the dumbest persecution complex I’ve ever seen (well, there was that Youtube video of the woman traumatized by the rainbows in her sprinkler, I guess that was dumber). You demand that a significant portion of the earth’s population bend to match your will, even though society at large doesn’t want that to happen; when it doesn’t happen, you complain that this portion of humanity is self-entitled. It’s jaw-droppingly insane.

I recognize that nutjobs can’t even hear it when they’re called nutjobs. I’m not calling you one for your sake; it’s clearly for my sake. It’s therapeutic to label you after reading such nutjobbery.

[Kalhoun]

@curlcoat

Single parents are far more likely to have someone who watches their kids while they work, no? As for learning about the world around them, babies under the age of one don’t need to be drug about the store - that is far too young for learning much of anything.

Feh. You’re clueless. Utterly clueless.

You don’t try to make the child do anything, you remove him from the public until he can control himself. As for my having to live with it, you are a prime example of what I was talking about, as you completely ignore the fact that there is no tradeoff. Parents these days expect that the world around them will adapt to whatever they want/need, but the parents don’t adapt to anyone else at all. Particularly the single parents - they decide to have a kid(s) without a partner and everyone is supposed to feel sorry for them and support them, and god forbid if you tell one of them to just suck it up.

Um…no you don’t. In extreme cases, parents DO adapt. What you’re talking about is day-to-day upset children, and no…the expectation the vast majority has is that YOU suck it up so the parent doesn’t have to abandon a cart of perishable foods, juggle multiple children out the door, or miss a bus or myriad other consequences that are far harder to deal with than YOUR having to deal with a crying child.

Oh…and that crack about unpartnered parents? Tatoo a big “L” on your head. You’re off the beam.

Of course, I didn’t say a thing about leaving any children at home alone, did I? As for children being a part of life, they are a part of your life, not mine. Unless and until you all show more tolerance for the things that are important to non-parents, I fail to see why I am expected to put up with your - er - unpleasant children.

Repeatedly saying that children aren’t part of your life is just making you look silly. If they weren’t a part of your life, you wouldn’t be participating in this thread. Children are a part of everyone’s life. Unless you’re a bubble boy or something.

[keturah]

@curlcoat

Here is an example. It is unfortunate that most people seem to feel that a well trained dog is more likely to cause a disturbance than a baby/toddler, but that is the reality.

This cite does not say what you think it says. As a matter of fact it further supports what I was saying.

What I asked for was a cite for the law that says that service dogs and the handicapped owners are required to leave if someone is offended by or thinks that the dog is a disruption. Additionally, I have not seen one person in this thread who is offended by service dogs, but plenty who hate children and wait with bated breath for one of them to make a sound so they can act put upon. I guess I just see absolutely no evidence that most, or even a vocal minority of people are concerned in the least about service dogs and their place in society. I’ll tell you what–provide one thread about people bitching about the disruptions caused by service dogs, how they are service dog free and how everyone else should keep their service dogs at home until they are certain that they will never irritate anyone. Surely that wouldn’t be a problem, right?