Perfect attendance award

The BBQ Pit
61

[QUOTE=tdn]
I’m a little confused about something here. Teachers (or school systems) are required to supply pencils and tissues?

I remember that as a student, I had to bring in those things for myself. There was a special day from Hell every year in late August, called Back to School Shopping. We spent a small fortune on pencils, pencil sharpeners, pens, notebooks, paper, protractors, contractors, farmtractors… Whatever.

The only pencils I remember schools supplying were those really fat ones we used in first grade.
[/QUOTE]

How did you ever get a farm tractor in the classroom? :smiley:

My son’s school provides the vast majority of the day-to-day materials and supplies. Parents were, however, asked to donate stuff like boxes of pencils, erasable markers for the white board, and other “disposables.” The reason for this is three-fold. First, it helps free up the school’s supply budget for things like paper and toner that teachers use a lot. Second, the teacher doesn’t have to spend money out of her own pocket for this stuff. Third, it eliminates the need for school-wide rationing, hoarding and (frankly) theft. The only thing the parents have to contribute is tissues; we are expected to bring in one box per semester, for a total of 50 boxes for the class. Most parents contribute more, of course, so that really works out to 75-100 boxes. All this has the effect of spreading out the cost from one teacher to 25 sets of parents. I think I spent $15 or so on my contributions, which is pretty much a negligible sum. Multiply that out by 25 families, and that comes to $375, which the teacher doesn’t have to spend herself, and when you multiply that out by the 17 individual classes, works out to $6375. That $6400 buys an awful lot of paper and toner.

And, as a parent, I’d rather kick in a smallish amount in supplies if it means making sure my son’s teacher has the means to do her job. I know other parents have contributed other material things like cover drawings for class projects along with bindery services. Another parent’s company donated something like $500 worth of office supplies like staples, paper clips, post-it notes and so forth. Heck, one of my own high school teachers was married to a doctor, and she got him to order stuff like tissues and feminine hygiene supplies for her classroom because it was vastly cheaper for him to order them through his supplier as part of his regular order. He also went above and beyond and got donations of anatomical models and charts from some of his drug reps for the biology classrooms. It cost him little to nothing to do this, and he and the drug companies got some goodwill out of it.

My point is that you shouldn’t be shy about asking for what you need. Many parents are happy to spend a little if it means their teachers (and thus their kids) have what they need, and there may be parents in your classroom who work for companies that will donate supplies or whatever in the name of corporate citizenship. Can’t hurt to try.

Robin

62

[QUOTE=silenus]
By law, students have to be provided with the necessary supplies if they don’t have them. This was initially to prevent the poor from being discriminated against in education, but today you have families that just don’t feel like buying supplies for their kids. They expect, and the law requires, that the school provide them.
[/QUOTE]

Really? How long has that law been in place? Is it a state or federal law?

It would never have occurred to me to ask the teacher for a tissue. Besides, I had perfectly serviceable sleeves.

63

[QUOTE=silenus]
By law, students have to be provided with the necessary supplies if they don’t have them. This was initially to prevent the poor from being discriminated against in education, but today you have families that just don’t feel like buying supplies for their kids. They expect, and the law requires, that the school provide them.
[/QUOTE]

The other thing to consider is that I believe that many school districts have enacted austerity measures to stretch budgets. And these measures often have the effect of placing huge barriers between teachers, as the students’ representatives to the supply chain in the school district, and the supplies. And many teachers got into the habit of purchasing their own supplies simply because they were sick and tired of trying to jump through hoops for what their students needed.

Which left the school districts convinced that the austerity measures were working for their state purpose - controlling costs. So more got enacted. It’s not that the supplies aren’t there, very often, it’s simply that the procedural hoops necessary to get the supplies are so arcane no one has the time nor energy to do more than a desultory stock from central supply.

I don’t want to give the impression that I think this is the way things work in all school districts. Nor that it’s the only possible reason for teachers feeling the need to supply things for their students. I do believe it’s another factor in some cases.

64

Norine, Aaron is also in a Title I school, which is why he gets all the day-to-day stuff he needs. We did take him school-shopping to get stuff for home, because he can’t take his school stuff home. And nothing says “school” quite like going to Target for new crayons and notebooks. There’s just something magical about that, y’know?

Zambini57, schools are now being expected to fill a lot of functions other than purely educational. What was unacceptable for you and me 20 years ago is now the norm, and schools have to step up to remedy that. In addition to teaching kids how to read and write, they have to teach life skills like handwashing and hygiene that you and I probably learned at home. Some also have to deal with homeless kids and kids in foster care. My son’s school district has a significant population of kids whose parents are attached to the Army War College, so mid-year transfers in and out are common, along with the resulting adjustment problems to both the student and the classroom. All of this is in addition to the regular academic and administrative headaches of No Child Left Behind and various other state and federal regulations, not to mention the occasional pissing contests between the school and the school board, and the school board and “taxpayers’ rights” organizations.

Considering how many problems students and teachers already have, I think it’s not unreasonable for parents to spot the teacher a box or two of Kleenex.

Robin

65

Could someone please link to or provide a definition of what a Title 1 school is?

66

You know, years ago, I taught in a military prep school for seven years. It was the best job I ever had. I really felt that I made a difference.

I was good at it, too. Even though I had an engineering degree, and not an education background, I seemed to have a knack for teaching. I was selected as “Science Instructor of the Year” twice, and “Instructor of the Year” once.

I taught three 25-student classes, usually with only one prep. I wrote my own syllabus, which only had to be approved by my department head. I never lacked for supplies. The office equipment was up-to-date, and got better the whole time I was there. Laser printers were replaced regularly–the nearest one was across the hall from my office. By the time I left, we had a copier/printer that could print handouts and tests double-sided and stapled directly from my computer.

The students were generally motivated to succeed, and being a military school, I didn’t have to put up with any misbehavior in class. Students that nodded off in class were required to stand up at the back, and continue taking notes. In seven years, I had exactly one student actually mouth off to me in class–he was restricted to quarters for a month!

My pay was that of a Navy officer, so it was very good. (Six years later, working as an engineer, I still don’t make what I did then!)

I often wonder if I should have gotten certified and gone into teaching in a high school, instead of going to work as an engineer. At the time, I didn’t do it because it would have been just about exactly twice the teaching load for half the pay. It’s threads like this that convince me that I made the right decision.

This is really too bad. I wonder how many other teachers leave the profession or never go into it because of stupid shit like the OP describes.

67

[QUOTE=What Exit?]
Could someone please link to or provide a definition of what a Title 1 school is?
[/QUOTE]

Ask and you shall receive.

Robin

68

In my recollection, which is only a few years out of date at this point, most students came with their own pencils, pens, and notebooks. Teachers generally adopted the policy that if you needed a replacement pencil, you had to show them your old broken pencil, or leave something in trade (shoe, calculator, etc). They were a bit more free with the loose leaf notebook paper, but that really got cracked down on after a big round of budget cuts. Tissues were always available, and since they were always in the same box type, I’m guessing the school supplied those. I know supplies were locked up, but teachers never seemed to have to grovel for them. Matter of fact, as a student I went to pick some supplies up for a teacher, and got them without a hassle.

That being said, I know almost all my teachers had a significant financial investment in their classrooms, and they barely got paid enough to deal with my classmates, much less deal with them and buy stuff for them.

69

Wow. This thread has really made me step back and thank my lucky stars for my school’s bookkeeper and secretary. I don’t think either of them has ever told me “no” or ever failed to have what I needed by the end of the day.
When my child was sick, and I was away from work during the cutoff for payroll, my bookkeeper filled out my leave forms for me, so I wouldn’t miss any pay. The secretary knows that if anyone calls trying to sell me something, that I am “in a meeting”, and she saves all the little cracker packages from her lunch salads for my child to eat after school.
Thanks, Dopers, for making me realize I really need to send those ladies some appreciation flowers!

70

[QUOTE=black rabbit]
I’m a mid-level IT manager with 5 years of experience in the industry, working at a small company in a mid-sized Midwestern city. I make more than a local public school teacher with 25 years of experience and a doctorate.

If my employer asked me to pay for my own cell phone, which they’d then demand I use for work related purposes, I’d seriously consider walking out the door.
[/QUOTE]

I agree with you when it comes to a “profit generating enterprise” the last thing I would expect is for one of my techs to be shelling out pocket money for parts unless it was being reimbursed that day. Creating problems for someone who probably drives 4-5 times their salary in revenues is a recipie for disaster.

For things like teachers…no incentive. If anything there are probably more incentives in admins contracts to not spend money, than there are to properly equip their staff.

71

[QUOTE=drachillix]
I agree with you when it comes to a “profit generating enterprise” the last thing I would expect is for one of my techs to be shelling out pocket money for parts unless it was being reimbursed that day. Creating problems for someone who probably drives 4-5 times their salary in revenues is a recipie for disaster.

For things like teachers…no incentive. If anything there are probably more incentives in admins contracts to not spend money, than there are to properly equip their staff.
[/QUOTE]

Well, to reiterate MY point: It has always been that mechanics supply their own tools. It doesn’t matter if you work for Shadetree Sam’s or if you work on aircraft like I do.

Sure, the company will supply specialized tools that cost tens of thousands of dollars and need to be kept calibrated to meet FAA requirements, but for hand tools, the mechanic supplies them.

And to reiterate my other point: any one who would walk away from a good paying job, uproot their family, subject their children to tearful good-byes, go through the hassle of selling a house and buying another, all over some trivial cell-phone thing, is, and always will be considered a stupid individual in my book.

72

[QUOTE=Zambini57]
And to reiterate my other point: any one who would walk away from a good paying job, uproot their family, subject their children to tearful good-byes, go through the hassle of selling a house and buying another, all over some trivial cell-phone thing, is, and always will be considered a stupid individual in my book.
[/QUOTE]

What the fuck are you talking about?

73

[QUOTE=Miller]
What the fuck are you talking about?
[/QUOTE]

What the fuck do you think I’m talking about, jackass? Read the thread. black rabbit said he would walk away from his company, which is paying him a great salary, if they …fuck you, read it for yourself before you mouth off.

74

[QUOTE=Miller]
What the fuck are you talking about?
[/QUOTE]
You would do yourself a favor to not waste time trying to figure it out.

ETA: Obviously, leaving a job = uprooting the family, etc. I don’t know about others, but for me, it means finding the same job across the street, or down the block, at the employer IMO will provide me the best package (not necessarily salary alone).

75

[QUOTE=D_Odds]
You would do yourself a favor to not waste time trying to figure it out.
[/QUOTE]

Yeah, OK. Good job Mr. Suck-Up. Defer to the one with thousands of posts, like you have, by the way. Don’t even consider what I have to say.

My question to the both of you: Do you think it is worthwhile to give up a steady job with a great salary over something as minor as what black rabbit stated?

I read your edit, how many people can just walk across the street for a new, better job? Not many. Not even you. I think you’re full of bullshit. You leave a job over something as trivial as that, no one across the street is going to hire you,

Word gets out.

76

[QUOTE=Zambini57]
Yeah, OK. Good job Mr. Suck-Up. Defer to the one with thousands of posts, like you have, by the way. Don’t even consider what I have to say.

My question to the both of you: Do you think it is worthwhile to give up a steady job with a great salary over something as minor as what black rabbit stated?

I read your edit, how many people can just walk across the street for a new, better job? Not many. Not even you. I think you’re full of bullshit. You leave a job over something as trivial as that, no one across the street is going to hire you,

Word gets out.
[/QUOTE]
Yes, I do think it would be a good reason to leave a job.

And yes, it is that easy for me to get a job. But I choose to live in NYC just for that reason, being in the financial services industry. I’ve had very good offers to uproot to one or two shop towns, but I prefer to know that if my company turns sour (like one of my major competitors did about 6 years ago), that there is a vibrant market for my skillset from a large number of employers, both big and small. Additionally, my skillset is highly in demand in the current market (and that is taking into account the layoffs in the industry happening due to the sub-prime mess and falling markets). I don’t know black rabbit’s situation, but if my company, which has been very good to me thus far, started to nickle and dime me, I would assume that management no longer values my services like they did and I would find an employer who would.

And regarding siding with Miller - it has nothing to do with his post count and everything to do with your post content. You thread-shit wherever you go. But play the low-post-count martyr, it’s good for a laugh.

77

[QUOTE=Zambini57]
My question to the both of you: Do you think it is worthwhile to give up a steady job with a great salary over something as minor as what black rabbit stated?
[/QUOTE]

Nitpick: blackrabbit never said she would definitely leave a job over that, but that she would seriously consider it. I assume if it would be a huge hassle for her she wouldn’t. (And if I mistook your gender, sorry black.)

As far as your example, Zambini…how often do you have to replace those tools? The initial outlay will be significant, but it’s an investment–you’ll have those tools for a long time, even if you switch jobs. From the sounds of things, that largely isn’t the case with teachers.

78

[QUOTE=D_Odds]
Yes, I do think it would be a good reason to leave a job.

And yes, it is that easy for me to get a job. But I choose to live in NYC just for that reason, being in the financial services industry. I’ve had very good offers to uproot to one or two shop towns, but I prefer to know that if my company turns sour (like one of my major competitors did about 6 years ago), that there is a vibrant market for my skillset from a large number of employers, both big and small. Additionally, my skillset is highly in demand in the current market (and that is taking into account the layoffs in the industry happening due to the sub-prime mess and falling markets). I don’t know black rabbit’s situation, but if my company, which has been very good to me thus far, started to nickle and dime me, I would assume that management no longer values my services like they did and I would find an employer who would.

And regarding siding with Miller - it has nothing to do with his post count and everything to do with your post content. You thread-shit wherever you go. But play the low-post-count martyr, it’s good for a laugh.
[/QUOTE]

Well, I have to again state that I think you’re a blowhard and full of shit.

One of your competitors went down? That means YOU can go down, sweetie, and that means there are some of your precious “skillset” walking the street.

Just keep thinking you are oh-so-valuable. The unemployment lines are full of you.

79

[QUOTE=Zambini57]
What the fuck do you think I’m talking about, jackass? Read the thread. black rabbit said he would walk away from his company, which is paying him a great salary, if they …fuck you, read it for yourself before you mouth off.
[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I did read it. Where did he say anything about selling his house? Or uprooting his family? Or even having a family?

I guess you must not have gotten the memo, but we dissolved the feudal system a few centuries back. These days, most cities actually have more than one employer in them. It’s true! One can leave a job, and get a new job, and still live in the same place! Astonishing, I know, but that’s the nature of the miraculous age we live in!

If you want people to consider what you have to say, maybe you should try posting stuff that isn’t painfully stupid, or transparent trolling. Or, often enough, both at the same time.

If I could get a better job, with better perks, then yes, I would. I’d certainly make sure I had the better job lined up first, and I’m pretty sure blackrabbit would, too. Certainly, there’s nothing in his post to indicate otherwise, regardless of whatever delusional projections you’ve read into his words this time around.

80

[QUOTE=Miller]
Yeah, I did read it. Where did he say anything about selling his house? Or uprooting his family? Or even having a family?

I guess you must not have gotten the memo, but we dissolved the feudal system a few centuries back. These days, most cities actually have more than one employer in them. It’s true! One can leave a job, and get a new job, and still live in the same place! Astonishing, I know, but that’s the nature of the miraculous age we live in!

.
[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I guess if you are talking about working in a call center, or selling shoes at the mall, other than that, you are so full of shit.