Anyone know of anything about their failure rates? I’ve installed some a while back, and they are solid, no worries there, but I keep hearing or rather reading questionable things about them, I have good fittings too, resistant to zincification and all. Extra clamp rings, steel cinch clamps and the tools to replace them if they do.
I know mine will be fine, but I wonder why people talk so badly about PEX. its not like my water tastes like plastic or anything. Is it because of plumbers (copper) being threatened by it? I think it works great and only took a few hours to install.
Also, I have a PVC waste pipe that is horizontal, mounting to a vertical drain stack via a saddle gasket (under a cut 2 way PVC T whose plastic wraps around the cast iron) and some worm clamps, I know this isn’t the most professional way to do such a thing, but whats the worst that will happen? A worm clamp fails and it leaks shit water, I’ll just clean and fix it. My question to this part is what would an experience plumber do in this situation? It’s not like I can fuse the PVC to the cast iron stack pipe.
You did ask this before.
PEX works very well, super easy to install.
2nd question
They do make union pieces to join PVC to cast iron and other things.
Talk to a plumbing supplier, they will get you the right pieces
Cleaning up shit water is -0 on the fun scale
The plastic piping that had issues including a class action lawsuit was polybutylene. It fails unpredictable and has caused millions of dollars in damage throughout the country. It has made people very concerned about plastic piping systems.
PEX is not PolyB. It’s been around for and in use for about 40 years and is holding up fine. It’s the only residential piping that is backed with a trade industry warranty(25years).
If the piping will be exposed I prefer copper, it looks nicer. If I was re-piping a house I’d use PEX, it’s cheaper and much easier to fish resulting in less holes needed to run it.
Ahh, Yes I did ask this before… my memory is not what it used to be. Well at least the second part is a viable question. I’ll have to check out some unions or joiners for those, I agree cleaning shit water isn’t fun but, its not much water in use at any given time, traveling in the pipe. Really, a trade warranty? Neat, but Probably only good if done by a licensed plumber though, not myself.
I read about those failing fittings, Zinsco(SP) or something? That’s why I procured some better materials for it, but I had no idea the bad rap was mostly due to those.
Thanks for the answers! I’ll probably use this stuff again given what I’ve read.
I get the impression that plumbers, who spent ages at plumbing school, learning how to plan and fit copper, are reluctant to use plastic because it’s too easy.
As I understand it, plasic pipe is cheaper but the fittings are more expensive. However, because plastic is flexible, you need fewer fittings.
One disadvantage is that there are multiple competing fitting systems, and they each require their own special (expensive) tool. But on balance, running PEX is a lot cheaper, faster, and easier than soldering a ton of copper. Especially with copper prices through the roof, cheap PEX tubing and no need for elbows or other intermediary fittings, PEX really shines.
PEX has been around long enough to prove that it is quite reliable for decades. There is one potential danger - which is that PEX can break down if exposed to sunlight for long periods. So make sure you store it somewhere dark when you’re working with it, and try not to run it next to basement windows.
A coworker had a fire in his garage, and it was extinguished when a water line melted. Lots of smoke and water damage, but structural apparently limited to his garage.
My plumbing supplier sells about 50% PEX, 20% CPVC, 30% Copper. It is a professional warehouse with no home owner clientele.
Plumbers don’t have a shortage or work or a need to hold onto more time consuming methods to stay relevant. Often the use of copper over PEX is because that’s what the home owner wants. Most plumbers are just fine installing PEX.
PEX fittings are typically cheaper than copper equivalents.
Reasons PEX isn’t used over copper:
Burn rating, PEX burns and is toxic so it is excluded from many commercial applications.
It is susceptible to UV damage.
Rodents chew on it.
It must be supported.
Friction loss, PEX has a smaller inside diameter and PEX fittings are more restrictive to flow, this can be alleviated by up-sizing but that eats up the cost savings.
Temperature rating, PEX weakens/melts as temperature increases.
I feel like a dinosaur at the plumbing house, I do very little with PEX. I work with primarily brass and copper. I work on well water systems and typically need to build manifolds for pressure tanks. PEX isn’t a good choice for manifolds and since I usually need to bring the lines floor to ceiling, I need rigid pipe to do so.
I’ve seen a manifold system with PEX before and it looked fantastic, it did have a lot of anchoring apparatus running along with it though, so I could see how maybe that would eat into the savings vs copper/brass though. In my case I have a small two inch section of it that sunlight hits for a couple hours, I just covered with pipe insulating foam.
[QUOTE=anomalous1;20190635Also, I have a PVC waste pipe that is horizontal, mounting to a vertical drain stack … [/QUOTE]
This is not good, if it really is horizontal (no slope at all). It should have at least some slope toward the drain stack – normally about 2% (1/4 inch per foot) is the minimum (for any pipe less than 3"). Otherwise water can just sit in the pipe rather than draining, and that will eventually damage the pipe. [Not as fast as in cast iron drain pipe, but still eventually damaging.]
I should have clarified. Yeah it’s sloped, i meant just where it joins the cast iron pipe is flat for about 4 inches, so its good. Sorry I forgot to put that nugget of info in there.
On a recent episode of This Old House they discussed two different types of PEX, one type that had ‘memory’, where you could fold, bend, stretch (around a fitting) etc and it would return to how it was originally made. This is what they recommend. They other kind, if bent or kinked would retain that new shape with a big white crease in it, much like you’d expect any other pipe to look if you bent it.
As for some of the other things mentioned. I’m not sure why heat is an issue. The only person, to any great extent, using heat is the plumber and if the plumber is installing (mostly) pex, it’s sorta moot. As far as manifolds, I’m not following why you can’t use pex for manifolds. In fact, it seems like it’s easier to do this with pex than copper. This makes for a lot less measuring, cutting and soldering. So does trying to run a new riser from a basement to a second floor. Seems like it’s a lot easier to pull it like a wire than tear open walls and try not to set anything on fire.
I remember a few years ago I was replacing a short chunk of copper. The ‘lineset’ type that goes to an icemaker and I was having a hell of a time getting it unrolled without kinking and eventually just gave up and went with poly tubing. True or not, I don’t know, but someone made the comment to me that that the part of the reason it’s a pain in the ass is so that you call a plumber.
Also, to be fair, I was talking to my local inspector the other day and he said he’s seen lots of pex lines bursting. I don’t know, however, what type it was.
Having said all that, as ‘joe homeowner’ that likes to be on the cutting edge, all else being equal, I don’t think I’d care what a plumber used in my house
Type A vs Type B. Type A uses expansion method where you stretch the pipe and it’ll reform to it’s Original size over the fitting. Type B uses crimp method. Type A(Wirsbo/Uponor) is better but the tool/tools to work with it are more expensive so most DIY end up using Type B because crimping is cheap and easy.
It generally isn’t as PEX can be used for heating runs. Caution needs to be used to keep it away from hot spots. It can’t go near a furnace duct or on gas water heaters you need to some off 8-12 inches before transitioning the PEX.
Specifically control manifolds. For a pump system you need to be able to screw in replaceable parts. Pressure gauge, pressure switch, boiler drain relief valve, and support a ball valve. A brass tank tee is the simplest method. With larger systems they get fabricated with copper, I’ll have multiple control components. It’s simply not practical to use PEX for the job
I was referring to a riser in an open space. The tank tee comes out the front of a pressure tank so you’ll often need to go from the floor to ceiling a couple feet from a wall. Since PEX isn’t rigid it needs to be secured. With a copper pipe it can stick up unsupported. To do the same thing with PEX, you’d need to put a 2x4 in to give yourself something to secure it to.
