I think the prof was sending a message to the other students, who must have been witness to the little door locking scene. Don’t even think about strolling in late and disrupting my class. I bet it worked too.
Have you ever actually been to college?
My current university, and the place where i went as an undergrad, had class schedules that involved 50-minute classes, and were set up to start on the hour, and finish ten minutes before the hour.
That ten minute period was designed to allow students to move between classes. Unfortunately, it took no account of professors who can’t time their lectures prooperly and insist on continuing past their allotted time. Nor did it take into consideration that students, due to circumstances entirely beyond their control, sometimes had to walk the entire length of the campus to get from one class to another.
And when you go to a university affectionately called “The 40 Acres” you have to haul some serious ASS in those ten minutes.
(But I still think it’s the students responsibility to get there on time. I personally liked strict professors. Perhaps I have a secret masochistic wish I am unaware of… I hated stragglers. Who doesn’t know the schedule when they register for classes???)
That’s cool, but our dear professor doesn’t seem to be offering even 10 seconds worth of slack on a (presumed) first offence. This lack of slack (heh) is being directed not to an employee who is being paid to show on time, but to a student who has himself paid a big stack of money for the priviledge of sitting in that room for an hour and a half.
There is a point where reasonable rules to prevent class disruption turn into draconian rules implemented by a power hungry prof. I think this guy went way over that line.
If it’s anything like the college where I work, doors lock in only one direction. It’s possible to lock people out of a room, but not into it.
When the door is locked from the outside, nobody in the hall can open it and enter the room unless they have a key. However, anyone on the inside can just turn the handle and open the door. There’s not even a keyhole on the inside of the door. They always open from the inside, specifically because of fire regulatons.
Our front doors are also locked from the outside and require usage of a key card (which every staff person, faculty member, and student has) in order to get into the building, but anyone can open the door to exit the building by just pushing on it.
Tyrannical, authoritarian loving college admin checking in.
I’ll preface everything I say with the understanding that this particular professor may just be a prick. The OP doesn’t state whether his in-class behavior rises to the apparent assholishness of this incident. And frankly, if we take the OP at face value, then that’s what it is.
However, I am constantly frustrated by this attitude of ‘I’m paying your salary’ that students enter into college with these days. The student as consumer is an incredibly poor model of education, if only because the vast majority of undergrads are not qualified to evaluate the service.
Stupid example: a child of 10, when asked what makes for a good parent, will have wildly different answers than and 18 year old, who would have different answers than a 30 year old. Perspective makes a big difference.
Professors should do everything to make class stimulating and enjoyable for students. However, structure is necessary, and at the end of the day, it’s up to the prof to provide that. Can some go overboard? Most definitely. But to deny the basic authority of a teacher to manage their classroom as they see fit, so long as they abide by school regs, is silly.
You’re a teacher, non? What happens if you show up “just a few minutes late” for class? If the teacher has to show up for class on time, and have notes, syllabus, and assignments prepared, is it asking too much for the students to show up and be ready to sit and listen to lecture/take notes/give the vaguest impression of attentiveness?
In grad school (well, one of them) I had a teacher that was never less than fifteen minutes late for class. Every single session. And he was the director of the graduate program in engineering so there was no one to complain to. Needless to say, this, along with his other deficiencies in running the program, was incredibly irritating…so much so that I dropped out of that graduate program.
There’s a story–probably apocryphal–about David Mamet when he was teaching writing at Goddard College; a student showed up five minutes into the lecture. Mamet demended five dollars from the student and upon receiving it, took out a lighter and burned the bill, stating that this is what the student was doing, metaphorically, every time he was tardy to a lecture. I’d love to do this to every asshole that shows up “a few minutes late” (read: 15, 20, 30 mintues late) to meetings.
When it comes to wasting other peoples’ time, be it in a class or a meeting, late is late. Sometimes circumstances make it unavoidable, but there is a certain class of people who are just chronically (and needlessly) tardy, to the annoyance, disruption, and wasted time of everybody else who has to interact with them. And there’s just no reason for it. Ravenman’s maxim is correct; barring occasional unforeseen complications, it’s just as easy to be a few minutes early (and prepared when the class starts) as it is to show up a few minutes late. If your schedule doesn’t permit that then there’s something badly broken with the schedule. (As for professors who continue to lecture after the end of class, that’s just as rude–if not moreso–than students showing up late.)
The OP’s prof, if the anecdote is accurately reported, was a royal pinhead (many academics are), but the justification–that he should be able to show up just on time or a few minutes late without any contrition–is as oblivious and obnoxious as the instructor’s behavior.
Stranger
I agree, for the most part.
However, at the point where I can make a 100 in your class without trying very hard; at the point where I can hear other students asking you questions and hear you not answer the questions and watch the other students fall into frustrated and uncomprehending silence; at the point where I’m spending class time making lists of your factual errors (and still acing your tests)–at that point, I feel pretty qualified to evaluate the service.
Even if I weren’t doing that, I think that it’s important for undergrads to learn to evaluate the service effectively, because they are consumers. The problem is that a lot of undergraduates go to college to buy good grades, not realizing that they’ve entered an institution where it’s knowledge, not good grades, for sale.
When criticism of professors centers around the bad grades they hand out, then I agree that it’s dumb criticsm–I might equally criticize a flower shop for not selling me a cake. But when criticism of professors centers around the poor opportunity for learning that they provide, then it’s spot-on.
And professors should listen.
The way I see it, if someone goes overboard, then their authority needs to be reined in. The school should start off by trusting a teacher’s authority in this respect, but it’s up to the teacher to justify that trust by not misusing that authority in a way that impairs learning.
The example in the OP shows a professor who’s misused that authority, and deserves to be reined in.
Daniel
Your strawman is a little one, well camouflaged: “always.” The OP’s issue has nothing to do with students always coming in late. The issue is with one student coming in late once. And just barely. And getting hammered for it.
My boss and I both wish that our conference room doors had locks. Being late for meetings is so common here that it’s unofficially become part of our corporate culture (which frustrates the hell out of me). I would love to have lockable doors, and a policy to go along with them.
T’is a problem when the person who called the meeting shows up 30 minutes late, though.
It looks bad when I bring a book to meetings, but sometimes I can’t help myself. Catch-22 is kind of obvious, so right now I’m re-reading Kafka’s Der Process, and I’ll probably pick up Pynchon’s Gravity’s Rainbow next.
Stranger
cricetus, believe it or not jackass, the clock on the classroom wall I could see from the door read 4:00. Maybe 3:59 and a half.
Left Hand of Dorkness, you’re making all the points I wanted to far better than I could have, thank you. Especially this:
My problem is both that physically locking students out of the room is completely cutting off the ability for them to get any benefit out of a class they were late for, but maybe more importantly it damages the relationship between the students and instructor even when they do make it into class. Like I said earlier, I think policies like this create an adversarial environment that aren’t conducive to education and communication.
Simply put, as a result of the militant policy, I think the guy is a fuckhead. And it’s a lot harder to want to do well, to be actively involved in the class, and to show up on time OR AT ALL if you think the professor is a fuckhead who doesn’t give half a shit and will close the door in your face without hesitation.
I understand that starting class right on time is important to some professors, and constant latecomers can be a distraction, but putting these things as priorities above common decency or understanding is doing a disservice to all the students, on time or not.
Oh, that happens here, too. One corollary to my “lock the door” daydream is that if the person who called the meeting isn’t there within 5 minutes (and hasn’t notified anyone of the delay), the meeting is cancelled.
Man, if I could run this company for a week… 
Like most of the reponses, I think there really needs to be a middle ground here. I hate it when people constantly show up late. Part of life is getting used to real time, not “artist” time. If you’re always 10 minutes late because of traffic, you need to leave earlier and quit hitting that snooze button.
However, shit happens. I understand this. I’m fine with a 3 tardies and you drop a letter grade. I’m fine with defining tardy as one second late. However, that one day you go out to your car and some asshole has double parked you “just for a minute…” or you really really need to hit the bathroom or whatever makes you late shouldn’t mean you miss the whole class period. I had two semesters that I had to haul major ass across the entire campus in ten minutes. I had to have the classes and of course they were taught back to back on opposite sides of the campus. I was almost never late, never caused a disrpution.
I must say, I hate professors who have a strict tardy policy and then the first five minutes of their lecture is their daily political rant.
First, let me say that I teach only small classes, generally with 10-15 students in a class (occasionally a few more). This means that I can expect students to participate in class, and that I do not expect them to simply sit and let me read the book to them.
I take attendance in all of my university classes, and part of the course grade is based on attendance and participation. If a student comes in late, it affects their grade. Once or twice a term, there isn’t a significant effect. Every day (and our day classes meet four days a week) causes problems not only for the student’s grade, but also for the rest of the class. As I point out on the first day of class (for the handful of students who bother to attend), they are paying Big Bucks to be in the class, and if they choose to waste their own money by showing up late, it’s their wallet, not mine. I take attendance because when they grow up and get a job, they will have to get used to being docked pay if they decide to show up late for work.
I close the door when I begin class, which is at five minutes after the official start time of the class. I use the first five minutes to hand back homework, answer general questions, and take attendance. If I give a quiz, it starts at the five-minute mark. I close the door so that I am certain to notice students who come in late. I don’t lock the door, though, unless I have a swell of students who are not enrolled in my class wandering in during a lecture to use the computers in the classroom. (This does happen on occasion, and I fail to see why any student would feel that it is acceptable to wander into an ongoing class just to print out a research paper.) On the few occasions when I have locked the door, I am more that willing to let enrolled students in, regardless of how late they are. Since my classes are small, the students know each other pretty well, and I figure that if Student A is bothered by the fact that Student B is late every day, they will talk about it themselves.
I have asked students to leave class for specific reasons:
If I catch them surfing porn sites during class, or if a student tells on another student for doing so, I ask them to leave and goof off on a computer that isn’t in my classroom. (School policy states that a student can be dismissed, but my experience is that the dean just gives them a verbal wrist slap, and sends them on their way.)
If they insist on answering their cell phone, I ask them to leave to carry on their conversation, if only so that my class doesn’t interfere with their ability to talk on the phone.
If they are snoring loudly enough to bother their classmates, I ask them to wake up and to leave if they can’t stay awake. (I’m a classroom dozer myself, when I have to take classes, so I generally let them sleep as long as it isn’t disturbing anyone.) (One FUNNY story–I was teaching an evening class a couple of years ago, and one of the students in the front row fell soundly asleep during class. He wasn’t snoring or falling over, so I just ignored him, and concentrated on the students who were actually paying attention. In the middle of a discussion, the sleeping student suddenly snorted very loudly, jerked violently backward in his chair, and his eyes flew open as if he was in great pain. He JUMPED out of the chair, and just stared at me. I asked if he was all right, and should I do anything to help, and he just rubbed his neck, then said he thought he ought to leave. He packed up his things and left, but was back the next week.)
If I catch them with food or any drink other than water, I ask them to either throw it away, or go to the cafeteria to consume it. I teach in computer labs, and greasy fingers and sticky drinks don’t go well with the equipment that has been provided to ALL students. If they decide they would rather waste their tuition by leaving class, that’s their loss, not mine.
Hear, hear!
I can be a pain in the butt customer. When I’m paying someone to suck up, I expect sucking. (Actually, I’m not really a pain in the butt, its just you don’t see me again). This is true in nice restaurants, expensive salons, and fancy hotels. I’m also a college student. I’m not paying my tuition so the prof or the administration can suck up to me. I’m paying so I can get an education. That includes the expectation that the professors will be competant, but it also includes the expectation that the other students won’t be disruptive.
(The prof in this case, probably a little bit of a jerk. But in general the “I paid for it, suck up to me” attitude of some of my fellow students - really bad.
This actually makes me feel a little better about my behavior in a class. It was a Physics lab class, and very few students - maybe 15, tops, and probably more like 10-12. In lecture periods, I typically sat near the front row, not that it would have mattered anyway with so few students. At the time I was very much a night owl, and even though the lecture took place about 10 am, I was simply not awake. Also I had a bad tendency to let the lecture lull me to sleep. Plus I’m positive the fluorescent lighting had something to do with it.
…Anyway. No matter how hard I tried, I dozed off in his class something fierce. I know the other students made mention of it (they could all see me), but I don’t remember if I was disruptive. The professor, whom I did really quite like, never raised the issue to me. Even so, I felt horrible about disrespecting him like that, but maybe his attitude was similar to yours and it didn’t bother him all that much. I pulled off a 3.0 in the class in the end, so thankfully it wasn’t too bad.
Personally I don’t have any problem with the policy of the lecturer here, apart from the fire safety issue, but if the door can be opened from the inside then it’s all well and good.
Although I realise your case is a little extreme, talking about a matter of seconds, don’t you think being late to class also creates an adversarial environment? In my mind, by not being there a few minutes early, you are showing that you do not respect the lecturer or the class enough to be there and ready for his class when it starts.
I’m sure it wasn’t nice to be locked out of the class but I’m sure you will be a few minutes early for the next class as well. Alright, he could have handled this better, perhaps by reopening the door and making sure to point out to you that you should have been there a few minutes before class started, but then again, he’s made a point to you and the rest of the class as well. I don’t want to be nasty to you but I think it shows an immature attitude on your part as well to take the attitude you stated above. So you messed up by not being a few minutes early to class and ready to start on time and he messed up by being too harsh in enforcing his policy. Can’t you just accept that you both made a mistake and move on? Harbouring resentment is silly at best and more so when the blame is not entirely one sided.
As I said above, I think that by being late to a class that you are showing that you don’t respect the lecturer or the class enough to be there a few minutes early so that the class can start on schedule. So are you not showing ‘common decency or understanding’ to the lecturer or class as well?
Alright, I realise that there are times you are going to be late. Traffic problems, personal problems, etc, etc. But if this was the very first class I would have hoped that you would be motivated enough to be there a little early to make sure that the class can start on time.
I’d personally say, accept that neither of you were fully in the right nor in the wrong and both share some blame for this situation, think of it this way and wipe the slate clean for the next class. Make sure you are a few minutes early for the next class and just see how it goes with the lecturer. Maybe he really is a pain but sitting there and festering in your perceived righteous wrath is not going to help you either.
I know that higher education in the US is different due to the costs involved to the student but I don’t understand the sense of entitlement that goes along with that. I have paid to take extra language lessons over here (I’m not at the moment though, too much work) and I would make sure I was there ten or fifteen minutes early for each class. If I am paying for something I want to get the absolute best out of it, I want to be there early so that the class can begin exactly on time and not ten or fifteen minutes late because I was late. If I’m paying for it I’m even more inclined to want to be early to get the best out of it. If I’m on time for the first class then perhaps the lecturer will be more inclined to show leniency should there be any issues with me being late due to, for example, a bad traffic day in the future.
grey_ideas
I got shitcanned for exactly that once. They pulled out my time records, pointed out all the 9:01, 9:02, 9:05s and warned me. I did it again, and I was history.
This is the same as something I alluded to earlier. If you BEGIN work at 9:00, you don’t “show up” at 9:00, you START work at 9:00. You show up in time to be ready to start.