Fine. Dean is just biding his time, assembling like-minded individuals until the day that his political opponents in Texas will return Dean and his cadres to Vermont so he may return to power by staging a mutiny on the Fishingboat Potemkin on Lake Champlain.
As I said before, you’re completely right, and I simply don’t know how to debate you.
Yeah, sure. That is, I’ve never yet heard of Dean being caught out in a lie. Whether he’s “doing his best for his country” is something one would have to judge by one’s own political views; but most politicians are in the game for a combination of that and personal ambition, and I can see nothing that would make Dean any different in that regard. So, really, what’s so scary about him?
http://www.crooksandliars.com/2005/12/08.html#a6242
O’Reilly: Far Left Zealots are Nazis
Let the Nazi wars begin. O’Reilly is outraged that a woman like Ann Coulter, who calls Bill Clinton a rapist and a murderer, is vilified at her speaking engagements.
O’Reilly talked Ellis Henican of Newsday, and likened the left winger protesters of Coulter as:
O’Reilly: The far left in this country, the zealots, these are zealots-are Nazis…and this is exactly what the Nazis did.
Tell me again (I’m dense) why do people listen to this shit stain?
Just like the Every country with the term “Democrat” or "Democractic in their name is a demcracy, right? How about the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea? Surely they must be a democracy? It’s in the name.
And last I heard, it was the right who kept telling us we must be unified in face of terrorism/communism, which usally means “Shut up if you disagree”".
Only Right-wingers believe the “Nazis were left-wingers” BS, in my experience. They can’t bear to think that at the extremes of their side lies facism. Everything bad belongs to the left, not the right.
That’s one of his jobs - to throw mud at the opposing party. That’s a traditional function. If anything is hurting the Democrats, it’s their unwillingness to pick a fight on almost anything. http://www.dailykos.com/
Senator Jack Reed (D-RI), … asked President Bush to present a strategy for the Iraq Debacle in the Democratic Radio Address …
While it is very interesting to hear about Joe Lieberman’s plan, and Howard Dean’s plan, and John Murtha’s plan and General Wesley Clark’s plan, and Senator Joe Biden’s plan, the ONLY plan that matters NOW is President Bush’s plan.
Is it “stay the course”? More of the same? As Senator Reed says, the current Bush strategy is an abject failure. While it may be fun for us and the Media to play the political parlor game of “pin the Iraq Debacle on the donkey” - in the meantime, the critical business of the Bush failures on Iraq are ignored.
An opposition party must provide vigilant oversight to the party in power, especially now where a supine Media has abdicated its responsibilities for at least four years. Instead of playing at President, members of the Democratic Party need to do their jobs as an opposition party - until the 2006 election campaign commences, when it will be their duty to articulate an alternative to offer to the voters. http://www.woai.com/news/local/story.aspx?content_id=C36A87B9-63A0-4CDE-AA91-B41571AFD3AF
The Democrats don’t need or want someone who is no more than a Cheerleader for Bush or the Republicans. The Democrats don’t need to become the Republicans. As the opposition party, it is their rightful place to point fingers, accuse, and try to “topple” the party in power.
Not true. I want the Republicans to lose power in 2006. As long as the Democrats don’t offer a plausible alternative to the Republicans, they’re not likely to regain power.
Lord knows I don’t want them to be Republican cheerleaders. I don’t want them to become Republicans. I want them to become Democrats–strong, progressive voices for a strong, progressive agenda. At best these days they’re voices against a conservative agenda, which is all well and good, but which isn’t going to win elections.
It is exasperating to me how fervently Democrats defend their losing strategy.
North Korea in not a Democracy, it’s a Communist Dictatorship.
You are free to demonstrate Right wing pedigree of Nazi party by providing a single Right wing position of theirs, such as cuts on welfare and education, privatization of industries and so on.
I want the same thing. Here are some things I see as a gross failure by “my” Democrats.
They are too quiet on the CIA leak investigations. They can toss their own “betrayal” accusations right back at the right.
They are too quiet on the “ethics” (I mean outright corruption) charges, indictments, and admissions of guilt. This ties in with item 3.
They need to drive home the Freedom Of Speech argument, in direct opposition to the “white flag” and “undermining the war” rhetoric and vow to uphold this as a constitutional fight. They can tie a few things neatly together, via Duke Cunningham, who put his own prosperity ahead of troop safety (steering contracts to buddies and bribers), thereby undermining the war, while calling other people traitors. Toss in other scandals too, like Libby, DeLay, etc.
They need to keep saying how there is no plan in “stay the course” with, and keep updating the body count. They need to support Murtha’s call for an orderly withdrawal.
They need to resurrect the Schiavo disaster, and present themselves as the party of religious Freedom.
They need to be just as willing as the “other side” to use personal attacks. Counter every “traitor coward” charge with a “chickenhawk charge”. Counter every “righteous christian” claim with an equally strong “hypocrite” claim. Instead of defending against Swiftboat screeds, attack right back and question their war records and patriotism.
They need to keep dredging up the “trust me” attitude, and bounce that up against the recent reports that the Republicans secretly paid for pro-U.S. stories in Iraqi newspapers and got caught secretly paying a number of U.S. journalists to write pro-Administration articles and plant them in various media outlets.
They need to play up the “war on Christmas” and portray themselves as the champions of religious freedom again and again and again.
They should STOP defending. In the words of General Patton, "Nobody ever defended anything successfully, there is only attack and attack and attack some more. "
Your suggestions are, I’m sorry to say, pure defensiveness. Patton’s point is that you only win a war by taking new ground. If you’re acting only in response to your enemy, then you’re responding defensively. Even if you’re attacking them, you’re attacking them on the battleground that they’ve chosen.
You win a war by taking ground from your enemy, and by using that ground productively. All the Democrats are doing is fighting on the Republican turf. They’re not holding any ground themselves. And that’s foolishness.
Yes, I agree that they need to attack on a lot of those issues (although dredging up Schiavo is an awful idea: the Republicans got in trouble for politicizing the case, and if Democrats keep harping on it, they’ll catch a dose of the same medicine). However, as long as they don’t do something to hold the ground–that is, as long as they don’t offer their own plans–they’re not going to win anything.
The strategy of tearing down the Republicans hasn’t worked for over a decade. It’s time to try something else.
And so it is. The North Koreans are not democrats despite having “democratic” in their name, Just like the Nazis weren’t leftists despite having “Socalist” in their name.
-Nazis weren’t big on muti-culturism, neither is the right wing(I rather hear leftists talking about diversity and snearing).
-Niether are big on homosexuals. Both seem to believe in Social Darwinism.
-Both love to appeal to nationalism and imply, if not outright state, that those who argue that war isn’t the answer or is being handled badly are “defeatists” and “traitors”.
-Both fervenlty hate communism or anything they perceive to be communist, which seems to be anything remotely leftist.
-Among the christian right there are attempts to control science eduction, most particulary in biology class though also in health class. Compare this to “German science”, Science dictated by ideology.
-The Right wing seems convinced we were betrayed by the media and that’s why we lost Vietnam. They’re already trying to spin that if we lose in Iraq, it’ll be for the same reason. The Nazis believed they lost WW1 because they were “stabbed in the back” at home.
-And of course, the fact that the right wing has become less concerned with the Rule of law then if something benefits the republican party and Bush.
Now, I’ve done my part. Explain why the Nazis were leftists. And no, having socalist in their name doesn’t count. I’ve already shown why with my korea example.
Hmmmm. It’s worked quite well for the other side, but there actually is a “plan” if the party chooses to pick up on it. This is the sort of thing they need - but they do need to get on the attack too. Nobody can toss slurs very well, if they are too busy denying and trying to cover up, or dithering in front of a grand jury. Nobody can toss the traitor word, if they just got caught misappropriating or diverting or pocketing defense money.
I would change some of the wording and tone down some sections, but the general meaning overall would be the same.
Note: Item 4 is now being taken care of (I hope), thanks to a Republican, Sen. John McCain. His stubborn refusal to back down, and his insistence to do the right thing despite White House wishes, is a credit to him, and to the true moderates of both parties.
No, not at all, and looking over my posts, I realize I’ve not made that as clear as I thought I had. Criticizing the Republicans for their corruption, shortsightedness, greed, and failure is absolutely appropriate and necessary. My problem is that nobody in the Democratic party is doing anything else. They need to be offering both a devastating critique of the Republicans, and a positive alternative. At best these days they’re only doing the former, and that’s not going to be enough to win them back control of Congress or the White House.
Absolutely! While I’m not 100% behind all these items, this is far, far better than what’s currently out there.
My objections: first, all of these items ought to be formalized into proposed bills, as the Republicans did with their Contract. When they say “no cronies,” I want to be able to see what they mean by this, how they will prevent crony culture from taking over.
Great rhetoric, but astonishingly vague. How are they going to reverse this trend?
Okay, actually, reading over it more closely, this is my only real objection to it. I want to have Reich’s babies.
Like **HPL ** is showing, there are plenty of examples that show that Nazis were not Left Wing; far from it, many European dopers in other threads thought Americans were silly by having this argument, they pointed out that Nazis were indeed the hard right of the day.
So I have to say that your statement that “It was established once and for all on this board that Nazis were Left wing Socialists.” is a LIE. Point out where in the SBMB this was demonstrated or shut up.
