howls with laughter at the above sentence
Technically, would not most “needless” shootings be of people that are already dead?
Seems like a fringe problem at best.
A: “You shot him needlessly!”
B: “He needed killin’.”
A: “He was already dead!”
B: “He needed more killin’.”
What if they’re undead? Zombies need shootin’!
You haven’t thought this through. There are hundreds if not thousands of nuclear reactors worldwide. If everyone shot each other, these now-unattended reactors would all melt down, causing an environmental disaster.
But seriously, I hoped maybe someone would have a better solution to gun violence. I can’t think of anything (practical) at all…
“Needless” may be the debatable part of this entire thread.
Whew. I was starting to feel that my repeated human sacrifices to Lucifer the Light-Bringer made me a bad person. Now I know that as long as I continue to use a ceremonial dagger to slowly flay my victims instead just shooting them, I can continue to score moral points and feel better about myself.
Thanks!
Is there a catalog or something where I can trade my moral points in? I need bigger splash guards on my pick-up truck.
I promise you, I won’t shoot anyone unless it’s absolutely necessary. Long ago, the draft board said I was unqualified to be a soldier (4f), so that option was out. As a civilian citizen, I have a small number of guns, which I have used only for target practice.
I’ve never seen any sense to suicide, so that’s out. It’s the worst possible option.
Great! I wonder if there are any downsides.
Damn, now I have to rearrange my whole schedule.
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Don’t worry about suicide, except to ensure that mental health resources are available for all who need them. That takes care of about 50-60% of the gun death toll. Many (most?) of the suicidal are going to kill themselves whether a firearm is available or not. This is a utilitarian value judgment, but the hypothetical decrease in suicides caused by making firearms less available to everyone, is outweighed by the utility of adults being able to purchase and own firearms.
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Stop the War on Some Drugs. What percentage of gun deaths arise out of organized crime, mainly surrounding dispute resolution in black markets such as narcotics? I’ve read about 2/3, but I’m open to new data. When Coors and their distributors have a dispute, they use lawyers, not guns. Pot, crack, meth markets don’t have that option. Not that gangs won’t find some other black market to kill themselves over, but let’s see what decriminalization does to gun violence. At the least, it might free up prison space for…
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When you identify a violent felon, keep their ass locked up. Here’s some Bureau of Justice Statistics data from 2006 on state courts and median/average sentences for criminals. The results might surprise you. Page 6 of the .pdf has a handy chart. From it, we see that the median maximum sentence for Robbery, or theft through the use of violence, was 60 months. 24 months for Aggravated Assault. When they’re released after their sentence, to go on parole, they often re-offend.
Instead of only locking them up for 2-5 years, keep them locked up until they’re too old to misbehave, and I’ll wager violent crime rates will go down. Not that they aren’t already at near-historic lows.
- When you find an armed felon, or other prohibited person, throw them back into jail. When you find people who knowingly sell firearms to prohibited people, knowing at the time that the buyer was unable to lawfully own a firearm, send them to jail too.
The previously law-abiding do commit violent crimes. It’s really rare though, especially compared to gun violence committed by the previously violent. Let’s address the low-hanging fruit first. Do those three things, and I think you’ll be amazed at the drop in gun violence in this country. Again, not that it isn’t already really low in the U.S, historically.
I’m going to go out on a limb and say that I believe that murder is wrong.
I avoided shooting someone today, and two yesterday!
Besides, those bullets need a reason for existing. They can’t just sit around wondering what it’s all been for. Killing a human is right up there on seriousness of bullet-life purpose.
Yeah, but if they needed shootin’ you done a bad thing.
Violence happens because some people don’t think violence is out of bounds. The OP is evidently not one of those folks. As long as we have violent people we will have violent behavior.
There are some practical things we can do to reduce the incidence of lethal violence. Asking nicely isn’t one of them.
God damn it. Now I have to go out and buy some guns so I can avoid pointing them at and/or shooting people.
Would it be okay if I just avoided pointing my kitchen knives at and/or stabbing people?
Adopt the .500 Nitro Express for use by the police.
Yes. This country’s mental health services seem inadequate. Care can seem distant, and I think too often prescribed drugs don’t help but rather make things worse. I’m not an expert, it isn’t clear if mental illness can generally be cured. ex: Humpty Dumpty could not be healed. But it can be managed. Don’t give guns to certain mentally ill types, for starters.
But- are we going to increase mental health screenings then? Maybe make it a big part of public schooling, even a part of one’s grade, having “good mental health”? Let’s assume for a second that this last idea is brilliant, all the pundits of every stripe laud it, talking heads and politicians demand it be enacted.
Still, there are going to be some people who view the move as tyrannical, “over-reach”, “mind control”. Even if you don’t accept the premise of my supposition, pretty much any proposal of this kind the government makes is going to be met with vociferous opposition. So, maybe make the high-school mental health program opt-in? If you opt out and your kid grows up to be a crazy mofo, don’t blame the government for once, mmmkay?
I brought up suicides because they make up such a large proportion of gun deaths. A lot of people throw around the number “30,000 gun deaths a year”, but it seems dishonest to omit that about 2/3 are suicides.
I don’t know about heavy-handed limitation of access to firearms. SCOTUS ruled recently on the 2nd Amendment, no? Upholding a reading such that there is an individual right to bear arms? Like it or not, that’s our law, so we can’t seriously propose very wide-ranging restrictions on gun ownership- hardly at all is closer to the truth IMHO.
That’s the gist! I support legalizing pot already, this amounts to just one more reason. Crack? Meth? I don’t know, we could end up with more suicides and violence if we make those things legal. Sentence drug criminals to rehab instead of jail, no rap sheet? Have a school with a mandatory-for-criminals mental health program in the rehab center? Maybe legalize MDMA, from what I’ve read it is supposed to be relatively safe, but I don’t know, the negative case is that it can cause permanent depression, in which case, if true, its proponents are far underestimating the danger.
Get tough on violent crime, not ‘victimless’ crimes. I can dig it. I’d add, “get tough on white-collar crime.” I think it is possible that more people have a grievance against the world in general than otherwise would because certain kinds of financial crimes seem to be rewarded rather than punished. That, and these crimes often impoverish lots of people, who then get labeled losers and takers and so on by prominent figures in the media. If America didn’t piss so many people off in these ways, there might be less shootings.
Sounds logical.
How low? It seems too high, regardless. Recent advances in communications technology have heightened the issue in the public’s awareness.
Well, wasn’t it Aristotle that said, “the unexamined life is not worth living”?
From an ethical (let alone legal) standpoint, people’s “wish to destroy” is frequently misguided and wrong. If people had a clearer sense of practical ethics, the number of targets to destroy in the world would shrink dramatically.
If you don’t like it, you will have to lump it.
I’m only suggesting getting a second opinion before shooting yourself! I am not putting myself in anyone’s cockpit and helping myself to their controls.
Really? If I say, “don’t shoot people”, I am implicitly supporting murder by other methods?
If you are a crazy person reading the 'dope, who will you listen to: a guy who acts like you’re nuts for thinking you are the reincarnated Hitler, or someone who believes you?
Yah, but what do you propose we do about it?
This is why tomndeb missed the gist of my debate style- get them to agree with you before it even starts!