The local progressive radio station seems to be making a huge deal out of the return of the deposed president of Honduras, Manuel Zelaya, to the capital city of Tegucigalpa. And, as is typical with such news coverage, the American correspondents, all with Anglo names, are pronouncing all the Spanish-based names and places in a very Spanish manner. I was reminded of similar news coverage of the Sahn-dah-NEE-stahs and DAHN-yell Ohrrrr-ah-they-GAH in Nee-CAHRRRRR-laaah-goo-WAH back in the day, and the growing treend over the past two decades of attempting to pronounce foreign words as the natives would pronounce them.
I wonder if the phenomenon exists in countries outside of the Anglosphere. Do newscasters in Germany, France, Spain, China, or wherever try to pronounce American personal and place names as native Americans do? Do they pick out any particular languages for special hypercorrection treatment, as do a growing number of Americans with Spanish and Arabic?
There was a straight dope article I can’t find now about the American phenomenon of over-exoticizing foreign words, for example “Beijing” is pronounced with a hard J instead of the “hzhing” sound like in “dijon” I learned growing up.
In the Philippines most American names and places are pronounced more or less correctly, but english is a second language there for many so I’m not sure it’s a good example for what you’re asking. Japanese newscasters try to pronounce American places and names but it’s still pretty funny, it’s not like they break accent like American newscasters do.
I honestly like the trend, I would like to learn the correct way to pronounce things.
KInd of a funny, really. Did you ever know people who would say SAN-dah-niss-tahs? Like my dad says “NISS-un” when he talks about my car?
I guess we all said “CAHN-tras”. I was there - we did.
It’s a painful place, suburban America.
So, putting aside the fact that Sahn-day-NEE-stah is neither “politically correct” nor is it a “foreign pronunciation”, I would often prefer an American pronunciation because it makes words easier for us to spell (and God knows we can use all the help we can get) and the fact is that different languages say words from other languages differently. That’s always been the case. Accent-shifting only distracts from the thing you’re trying to say.
In Spanish on American TV, they do the opposite of what we typically see: perfect Spanish, then a jarring English word or name in perfect English.
Spanish also tends to translate names into Spanish. Except sometimes. The wedding of Guillermo and Kate was a strange mix of the two, especially given that Spanish-speakers generally translate to “Caterina” or “Catalina.”
They are not trying to pronounce names with the native accent, they are fitting foreign names into the syllables allowed in Japanese. There is a form of writing called katakana which is used for foreign words.
For example, California, is written, カリフォルニア, and pronounced kariforunia.
Every time this crops up I always think of the sketch SNL did like 20 years ago with Jimmy Smits hosting. It was about then that the more pretentious news reporters started doing the pronunciation thing. Iran-Contra was all over the news so Jan Hooks and Dana Carvey were enunciating the hell out of “de CONtres” and “de SaandoNEEStaz!”
Now they say them this way with a strait face and expect us to! Like Obama with his ‘Oh mister Tally-ban (Taliban) tally me banana…’
I wonder if places other than Berlin, New Hampshire will never be pronounced the way the natives would. (the pronunciation changed during WWII and has never been pronounced like Berlin, Germany ever again) According to wiki other Berlins in the US are also intentionally “mispronounced” too.
Why ever would they not? Some places and other things have standardised translations and/or pronunciations of their names. If not, use the native pronunciation. It’s standard procedure.
Hebrew names tend to be closer to the original pronounciation to begin with (for instance, we call the capital of Russia “Moskva”), but other than that, newspeople never try to adopt a foreign accent when pronouncing foreign names - even newscasters who speak the language in question fluently. All names are pronounced as they are written in Hebrew; “breaking accent” is considered gauche.
Of course, one advantage of Hebrew is that there’s really only one way to speak a specific word - Hebrew writing is very clear and unequivocal, with no slient letters and only one way to pronounce each vowel or consonent.
I was much more bothered by the media calling them “Marxists.”
This topic reminds me of a native English-speaking friend of mine, who knows some Spanish. He mocks Latino news people for pronouncing their personal names in correct Spanish on English language media, but criticizes English speakers when they make errors with Spanish. There’s no pleasing him.
Not when you affect an accent to do it. Standard pronunciation is to stick close to your own native phonemes. Unless you are a native speaker or extremely fluent, attempting to copy the native accent will most likely make you sound sound like, say, Speedy Gonzales.
It is not generally correct to take someone else’s accent, as you will almost always butcher it. Though the British practice of just saying the word as if the spelling were English is, in my mind, a bit overkill.
Even if you don’t butcher it, changing accents mid-sentence sounds stupid. I personally speak both languages without an accent, but when I’m speaking in Hebrew I say English names with an Hebrew accent, and vice versa.
I’m very curious to know how the capital of Russia - Москва - ended up being spelled in Latin letters as “Moscow”, instead of “Moskva” or “Moskwa” or something like that. Some sounds are difficult to transcribe in a foreign alphabet (see “Peking/Beijing” for example), but in this case it seems like someone messed up real bad.
Here is an audio file of what Wikipedia thinks is the proper native pronunciation.
(By the way, for the above post, my example was originally going to be Paris, which we all know is properly pronounced “Pah-ree”. But then I did my due diligence research on Wikipedia and found that “Pah-ree” is wrong!)
To be fair, the ‘x’ in “Don Quixote”, while generally pronounced in Spanish today, was I believe in the past sometimes pronounced [ʃ]. That’s where the French pronunciation comes from. (Plus, of course, the “Don” that’s pronounced the French way and the lack of [e] at the end of the second word, as if it were a French word as well.)
To be honest that isn’t exactly how it happens. French words, for example, tend to get at least an effort to sound vaguely French, mainly because most of us learnt French to some degree at school. And that is why British pronunciation of Spanish words jars so much with Americans, they’ve got more experience of hearing Spanish words than us so are more likely to have an idea how it “should” sound.
For lesser known languages everyone tends to speak it as if it part of their own language. As a Swedish speaker, for example, I can guarantee that just about all the Brits, Americans, Aussies and whatnot on here pronounce Smorgasbord “incorrectly”. But the likelihood of you having actually heard the “correct” pronunciation is quite small, so it is perfectly understandable.
British practice?
Certainly, historically this was the case, if that’s what you mean?
But nowadays, if you compare say a british news report on the Libyan uprising versus an american one, I think it is the former that will make more of a stab at the local/arabic pronunciations.
