I agree on disengaging for outright problematic behaviour, to the point of not turning up to a few occasions if need be. Family is important but its not unconditional as far as Im concerned. It only took one Christmas for me with the in-laws. Its a risky call and more a final option though.
Saying ‘I dont want to talk about politics’ is another option. Forget about ‘winning’ unless your object is to change his mind, in which case he gets the chance to try and change yours too.
Find something you can talk about though, less chance of someone trying to ruin things if they’re enjoying themselves.
I agree that you just shouldn’t engage. I had classmates in high school that tried to inject Christianity into every single discussion we had, and the only thing you can do is ignore them. Really, they just want a reaction, and there’s no point in starting an argument that can’t be held civilly and won’t change anyone’s mind anyway.
It can be difficult as hell (and not always easy to get them off of the subject they’re currently lecturing you on). I have a brother-in-law who is more a conspiracy theorist than a political nut (although he has his moments on that, too), and he has an underdeveloped sense of when to shut the hell up because the people he’s buttonholing are trying not to make a scene at the family dinner. Yes, they’re the rude ones when they start something at a family function, but that doesn’t give you a carte blanche to respond in kind and just make an awkward situation worse. We mostly just defend our position a little, then drop it instead of continuing to argue. It drives me crazy when he won’t shut up about something he thinks I should do, though - after I say I’m not interested two or three times, the next time I say it, I really want to say it…convincingly, but that would just make a scene.
Ignore them (refuse to respond to their insults or BS 'arguments), or I try to change the conversation to something else.
This one is fun. I act as ignorant and dogmatic as them, just in the opposite direction. It is fun. You make up facts, close your minds, make bullshit arguments, etc. Within a couple of minutes the other person is almost pulling their hair out.
“The Wall Street Journal did a report about how the stimulus created 8 million jobs and prevented a great depression. Go look it up on google”
“I can’t find it on google”
“That is because the conservative media establishment scrubbed it”
Sucks. I wish there were more republicans in my family I could have informed, rational debates with. But there is only one. The rest are dogmatic and grossly misinformed.
I deal with it by having some really ugly arguments and having no contact with them for years at a time, I see them just enough to stay in the will. I never said that I deal with it well.
Well, I dealt with another annoying brother-in-law by using a different real estate agent, so he hasn’t spoken to us in over a year. I don’t recommend that method, either.
That really doesn’t work in my experience. They just ignore your protestations and basically converse with each other about what an idiot people who think like you are while trying to goad you.
I hope other people don’t have that experience (it shows a total lack of respect for the other person), but it doesn’t always work. People just insult you to other people there rather than insult you directly.
Its not intended to work with the first try, its more a broken record technique where you bring it up every time its done, repeat it a few times, then leave if they persist.
Over time it can work, but at the time its being done some level of defiance is to be expected. The goal is to make it boring rather than enjoyable for them.
Edit: And obviously nothing will work with everyone.
My parents are both republicans who don’t understand why everyone hates Sarah Palin. They’ve lived in the Soviet Union most of their lives and came here 20 years ago. They don’t like anyone promising to change things because even under Bush this country was 100x better than the USSR. To them it doesn’t need any changing ever.
However, no one in my family holds a grudge over political views. My mom gets upset whenever people argue. So if I challenge her views she tells me she doesn’t like it when I argue with her and that ends things. My dad will argue with me forever. But no matter what I say he just assumes that I don’t know any better (because I haven’t spent enough time in a communist country like him) and that I’ll eventually figure things out when I’m older (I’m 24 now).
My parents hold borderline racists views on politics (they’re against a mosque being built in our neighborhood), but nothing they say on politics can make me hate them personally. The same things goes for me. No matter what I say they won’t hold it against me. They’ll just be slightly disappointed - about on the same level as a father who realizes his son sucks at sports.
This post is the prime example of how these things work. Rude relative brings up politics to goad the people he is fully aware don’t agree with him at Thanksgiving dinner. They react badly. Then it’s their fault for not holding their tongue out of politeness. Rude relative sits back and basks in what he has created. And another fine Thanksgiving dinner is had by all. Do all of you have a clone of my brother-in-law?
It sounds to me like politics is the least of the OP’s family problems.
Like dangermom, I think that the language used to express himself would have been the first thing that I protested, especially if there were kids around. When I’ve been around people like that, I’ve told them that I wouldn’t mind having an informed discussion with them, but it must remain polite and civil.
I guess that I’m fortunate; most of my immediate family’s politics aren’t that far apart from mine. The only one that even gets riled up among the family can’t vote (yet) in this country* and when he steps out of bounds, I just remind him of that.
Yes, he’s had time. He’s been in the US for almost 40 years.
God, I feel sorry for all of the other family members who have to listen to your fighting and shouting instead of trying to enjoy. And I am definitely not just blaming you, OP, but it takes two to make an argument.
How do I deal with it? I never, never discuss politics with my family, who are incredibly ignorant and don’t even hate blacks, just consider them sub-human. Yeah - that conversation is going to go well, right? And if they bring it up I just smile and ignore until they wind down on their own, and if they don’t, then I try to change the topic or engage someone else in conversation. They probably think they won. I don’t care. I don’t care to discuss it.
And if it goes past a certain point, you have to say something, and you have to leave. This isn’t as easy as it looks - I haven’t quite told my family yet, I just don’t go there as often.
My family is … interesting … when it comes to politics. My brother has a degree in Political Science and is going to law school, my sister is currently getting her degree in Social Sciences with an emphasis on Political Sciences. Oh, my sister’s a democrat and my brother’s a republican. The rest of us fall somewhere in between. But, at least they keep it civil.
My father-in-law is a bit biased, with similar opinions to the OP’s dad, but nearly as persistent in them. (As in, he doesn’t walk around spouting it unprovoked and isn’t quite as harsh… he’d never use the “n” word, but he does think Obama’s a Muslim and dislikes all those damn liberals, etc.), so when he starts going off like that, my husband and I (moderate democrats) usually find something else to do… like play with the dog or chat with my MIL. We just leave.
This is it exactly. He turns to my oldest brother and says see, this is exactly what I mean. Oh yeah, and the whole, “you’ve drunk the koolaid” nonsense, where if your thoughts aren’t exactly in line with his you’re a brainwashed moron.
Its gotten a little uglier with this being an election year (and Obama as President) than it used to be, and they are trying to get everyone together for Labor day. I think at this point, I’m just not going to go. I’ve been really agonizing over it for a few days, cause I don’t want to go at all, but I feel guilty for “abandoning” my mom to this garbage.
So, screw it - time for distance. Thanks for the input Dopers - I had hoped for something to do about it, but if distance and absence are it, then that’s the answer.
Sounds fine to me. I think you might want to tell your mom that you really want to see her and maybe you two could go out for lunch or something? Or she could come out to you for a visit? I don’t know how far away it is.
I know, have your mom over for Labor Day weekend and let everyone else have their party somewhere else.
It’s a banned word in the sense that it may not be directed against other SDMB posters, even in the Pit. It is not a banned word in the sense that it may be directed against people who do not post here, used in a quote, etc. Really, the only thing you can’t do with it is call someone here a c[redacted 'cause you hate it], directly or indirectly.
That’s it - no one wins an argument at a family dinner. When a family member says something I know damned well is completely wrong, I will probably say something like, “No, actually, I don’t think President Obama is creating mass concentration camps in Montana,” then when they push it, I’ll just drop it. What possible benefit could there be to arguing someone like this to a standstill while the turkey gets cold? I know what I know, he knows what he knows, and that’s that.
I’ve finally realized I don’t have to be Meathead to my brother in law’s Archie Bunker. Makes holidays alot more fun & relaxing. We just talk about innocuous things now. He’s a nice guy otherwise, & we aren’t gonna change each other minds.
I have a friend who would often drop Rush’s name, or Hannity’s, then get upset when I told him to stuff it. He’s the one I’ve talked about before who mutated from a very reasonable liberal into a roaring Rush-head. In any event we’ve drifted apart since we stopped being roommates a year ago (plus he may have mugged my mom, but that’s neither here nor there).
