Actually what pro-choicers object to is making doctors show ultrasound pictures of the fetus to pregnant women seeking an abortion. Any pregnant woman who wants to see the ultrasound already can, assuming she has health insurance.
I could also come up with something similar, and change it just enough to fit my position. After all I can’t prove or disprove a negative - especially an anecdotal one - can I?
“The vast majority of “anti-lifers” I know enjoy eating a plate of live kittens.” So what. Try to disprove it.
These are just a few examples. Given the sheer number of people who pay attention to these various leaders, I’d say it must make for a huge number.
I have a novel idea. Let’s enforce the tax laws (already on the books). Any church or religious organization that wants to campaign, lobby, influence votes etc. is absolutely free to do so on one condition - they surrender their tax free standings. After all, these are some pretty serious (tax free) deep pockets organizations and people - except I think for Falwell. I think, if memory serves, he finally went too far and was going to be subject to taxes for his lobbying and interference.
Wow. Genocide. That makes it even MORE serious. We need an international tribunal in order to hold Crimes Against Humanity trials then. The hangings will follow immediately afterwards. :rolleyes:
So am I safe in assuming that there could possibly be no exceptions whatsoever? Not even medically valid exceptions as to ummm maybe safe the mother’s life? Thanks, that makes it a little more clear :rolleyes:
Wrong–abortion providers do an ultrasound prior to the proceedure, and I would find it very, very difficult to believe that any provider would not “let” a pregnant woman see the ultrasound. Hell, some women ask to see the tissue, and the providers I know personally have no problem with this. The disagreement comes in when people start attempting to force an ultrasound viewing prior to the proceedure. Although, upon preview, I see that saoirse has already pointed this out.
Of course it doesn’t, and I did not claim that it does. I was merely responding to stratocaster’s comment regarding pro-lifers who have abortions, which sounded as though he or she believed such creatures do not exist. All I’m saying is that they do, and I see them all the time, and do my best to help them reach whatever end they are seeking, be it prenatal care, adoption, or abortion.
Not to be an insensitive bastard (well OK I am), is this not the height of hypocrisy? A pro-lifer who uses whatever help you give her, but then wants to deny that very same choice for someone else? Am I the only one who has a problem with this?
Well, sure, but when you get right down to it few of these people actually care about “the unborn”; it’s all about malice towards women and children. After all, why else would the same people who oppose abortion also oppose birth control, women’s rights, child care funding and so on ?
I haven’t found a percentage I’m willing to quote yet ( Google comes up with sites that refer to “Christo-fascists” and “Abortion destroyers”; not the most objective of sources ); someone better at googling might be able to. That being said, I’ll point out that it’s both well known and rather obvious; you’re trying to argue that the sky is plaid instead of blue. The Catholic Church and the Republicans both come to mind.
Why should I care about the archaic opinions of people who died before I was born ? Lincoln was a socialist by modern standards; that doesn’t mean modern Republicans are socialists.
BTW, both of those are the same link. Also, I find a group that calls itself “Feminists for Life” about as oxymoronic and fraudulent as Jews for Jesus. They are either shills for the right or simply self destructive fools.
Good quote, but they made the same mistake we are making - we are polarizing and ignoring any middle ground (yeah, I know, the myth of the excluded middle or something). Maybe I better clarify my personal position better. I see abortion as something that should be allowed - I also see it as something extreme, which should be only done for extreme reasons (desparate measures and all). I recognize that a lot of ithis is due to my upbringing. However, I don’t feel I have the right to impose my own “code” on other people in this case. If I did, any woman in the world could tell me I have no idea what it’s like and they’d be right. They could tell me it’s their business and I should butt out, and they’d be right. So, the only ethical choice is to let them make their own decisions.
Side note to Der Trihs - I am well aware of the various other things going on - abstinence only sex education (which fosters ignorance), denial of birth control and morning after pills, denial of health insurance or medicaire for family planning tools, curtailment of aid money/programs/welfare for single mothers etc. “They” are creating roadblocks every step of the way. By “they” I mean the politicians and their small but noisy “base”. But, who elects these guys? If they keep getting elected, “the people have spoken” and are enabling this whole mess. It’s easy to judge until it affects you personally I guess.
There’s a website for that. The title of it is The Only Moral Abortion Is My Abortion.
I ask again, if I am willing to risk my life rather than be pregnant, what potential punishment is going to deter me from obtaining some black market mifepristone or having an illegal surgical abortion?
So if I get caught, I go to prison. There’ll still never be a baby.
No, sir, you are not. I have, however, long ago used up my extensive internal supply of wry irony for the subject, and serve them with as much care, compassion, and non-judgemental support as I do all my patients. Deep inside there is a spark of cold fury, but mostly I keep that tamped down by remembering that we do what we do so that those women are free to make that choice.
And before anybody misinterprets what I said… what I feel for these women is much closer to resigned sadness… because if they truly believe that abortion is murder, then they must feel that they themselves are murderers. And I can’t even begin to imagine what it must feel like to be in that position.
