Pro Wrestling: Did They Ever Really Expect People to Believe It Was Real?

Cafe Society
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I remember a kerfluffle that blew up in the 80’s when an NBC reporter (John Stossell) got slapped in the face by a pro wrestler who took exception to John suggesting that pro wrestling was fake. However, for all I know the whole event could have been a publicity stunt (no publicity is bad publicity, after all).

Did the wrestling establishment try to pass off their sport as authentic competition? Did wrestling fans actually believe that what they were watching wasn’t faked?

Of course, nowadays they make no secret about the fact that it’s fake.

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Way way back when, people thought it was real.

Pro wrestling got its start in he carny days and the participants treated it as real back then. If you watch some the tapes from 20 or more years ago, a lot of the heals got legit heat from the crowds and were really hated for being the bad guys.

When wrestling hit big in the 80’s, that’s when the whole debate started, from what I understand. Eventually, Vince McMahon admitted that pro wrestling is “sports entertainment” to avoid boxing and athletic commissions in different states.

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define “fake”.

Is it such that the matches are already pre-determined? Is it that they don’t punch with full force or kick with full force?

To say it’s fake is ignorant. The wrestlers get injured, they swing punches and pull back as not to fully injure their opponents. They stomp on the mat to get a loud thump sound as they punch. But to say it’s fake is stupid. It’s pretty much stunt fighting where it’s choreographed and practiced. But it’s real, they have the risk of getting hurt, albeit they train not to destroy each other to the point they can’t get up the next day and do it again.

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(1) It used to be somewhat less theatrical/stuntman-like. The crazy aerial stuff, for instance, is a pretty recent addition I think.

(2) They market(ed) in substantial part to kids, who are sometimes credulous and might be expected to fall for simplistic good guy/bad guy storylines and cartoonish violence as “real.”

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The above post said what I wanted to. Even though it’s a movie, watch The Wrestler to get a look at how they have to get treated after matches. There’s a reason a lot of them die from drugs and abuse pain killers.

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Stossell was not in on it. He sued the WWF (now WWE) and settled for $425K.

The vast, vast, majority of fans knew the bouts were planned out at least back into the 50’s. It was a wink and a nod, but because of the boxing and wrestling commissions in the various states they had to keep the appearance. However, there have been fans of every generation (and age range) who weren’t aware that the outcomes are predetermined.

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Yes, absolutely, pro wrestling was presented as a shoot back in the day. In fact, wrestlers practiced kayfabe–a carny term, loosely translated as “stay fake” or “remain in character”–around anyone who was not wise to the ways of the business.

AWA promoter Verne Gagne was interviewed at some point in the 70s (I think), and when asked the question, emphatically stated “Pro Wrestling is on the level”.

Promoters like Bill Watts in Mid South/UWF, Eddie Graham in Florida, Fritz Von Erich in Dallas, and Jim Barnette in Atlanta presented the matches as athletic competition, and many of the fans bought it.

Heel (bad guy) wrestlers were attacked by irate fans in various places after particularly heinous acts. During a Superdome show, manager Skandar Akbar had to wear a bullet proof vest under his sheik gimmick because he received multiple death threats prior to the event. Freebird Michael Hayes also received death threats after an angle where he “blinded” the Junkyard Dog. Rowdy Roddy Piper and Ole Anderson were both stabbed by fans. There are numerous incidents of fans charging the ring to prevent “attacks” on their favorites.

Frankly, pro wrestling was a lot more entertaining when it was presented that way. Even as a “smart mark”–ie, a fan that knows the matches are worked, and the guys are not shooting, the suspension of disbelief is still possible during the show, as long as the promotion doesn’t break kayfabe.

Vince McMahon drove the final nail in the coffin of kayfabe when he admitted the matches were worked in sworn testimony. The upside for him was doing so got him out from under the regulation of the various state athletic commissions. McMahon also killed the wrestling business I loved for years, and replaced it with “Sports Entertainment”, which is the style you see in WWE and TNA today.

Finally, it was “Dr. D” David Shultz that slapped Stossel. That was a shoot, Stossel did not know it was coming, but Shultz may have been put up to it by the promoter.

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Professional wrestling was an authentic competition through the 1920s and possibly beyond. By the time TV came along, though, it had turned into what is is today – a show.

Back then, the fiction was that it was a real athletic event. Lots of people knew otherwise, but there were plenty of fans who watched Gorgeous George and thought the matches were the real thing. Wrestling avoided the question. I remember Dan Gable going pro after winning an Olympic gold medal and being very evasive (“Well, we do want to give everyone go good show”).

In the 80s, everyone dropped the pretense and admitted it was all a show.

As an athletic competition, it is fake. There is no competition, just a script. But it does take skill to perform as a wrestler, just as it takes skill to perform in a circus.

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I don’t think the vast majority of fans knew the matches were worked. Some did, but there were plenty of “True Believers” as well, even up through the early 80s.

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Not really. There were worked matches around the turn of the century. There have been instances were matches turned into shoots or semi-shoots for various reasons, but pro wrestling as we know it has pretty much always been worked.

This is not to suggest that many of the performers were not really skilled amateur wrestlers. They were. Gotch, Hackensmith (probably spelled that wrong), Thesz, Gagne, Brisco, Hodge–guys like that were elite wrestlers that could tie most guys in knots regardless of whether the opponent was cooperating or not. Other guys, like Bill Watts, had college wrestling experience, and could go for real if need be.

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so we’re using fake to describe the athletic competition of it all? Such that we can’t compare it to boxing, MMA and other athletic endeavours that are believed to be on the up and up.

Or are we using fake to explain the lack of severe injury to the wrestlers themselves.

I used to be a fan of wrestling with Hogan up until the end of the Stone Cold era. I knew wrestling wasn’t similar to athletic competition like all the other sports but seeing the athleticism of the wrestlers made it real. I never said it was fake, I hated when people said it was fake because they couldn’t explain the word fake enough to make any real sense. People not fans of pro wrestling just use the word fake and not really explain the fakeness of it all.

Seriously is it fake when Mankind fell off the top of the Steel Cage versus the Undertaker? No, it was real, he fell onto the table then onto the ground. He got hurt, he knew he was gonna take that hit. To say it was fake is so ignorant. He actually got hurt, tell Mick Foley that it was fake and see what he would say.

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Not everyone knows it is staged performing. I will not speak to their IQ level but I know a lot of people that to this day believe it is all very real. They have either suspended their dis-belief permanently or it would cease to entertain if they admit the truth to themselves. Coincidentally or not all these fans (that I know) live in East Tennessee.

I have watched for years and find it very entertaining, every now and then my wife will peek in and remind me it is fake, my answer will always be (just for her) It is Not!

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Fake is not a good word to describe wrestling. For those that speak carny, “worked” is the preferred term, but “pre-determined” is also accurate. The thing is, a lot of what you see is real. Getting hit with a chair hurts. Taking bumps hurts. Getting punched hurts. The “fake” part is that the wrestlers are not competing, they are cooperating to put on a show.

And, before anybody mentions it, the blood is real. In some cases, wrestlers cut themselves with razor blades to “get color”, ie bleed to add drama/excitement to the matches. In other cases, the blood is drawn “hardway”, meaning that a blow actually drew blood. This is sometimes done by punching the guy that’s supposed to bleed right over the eyebrow where the skin is relative thin.

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I remember a story from Mick Foleys book about staying in character in the territories. He was dating a girl who really thought he was a crazed maniac named Cactus Jack. He stayed in character for the length of the relationship.

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I agree with the word fake not being a good word to describe wrestling. You need to find another word because it ain’t fake. Use words like pre-planned, staged, choreographed. I find it absurd when people use the word fake and can’t come up with synonyms to take the place of fake. Watch the pay-per-views, see the huge stunts they pull there, like the Mankind v. Undertaker Steel Cage match i referred to earlier. That shit wasn’t fake by far. Those were real tacks that Mankind fell on.

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I think it’s pretty clear that when people say it’s “fake” they mean it is not actually an on-the-level athletic contest. Nobody has suggested the wrestlers are androids or can’t be injured while doing their jobs. You’re the only one here struggling with what “fake” means in this context.

The comparison to circus performers is quite apt.

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I just find the word “fake” even in context to the whole show of wrestling is a poor usage of the English language. There are other words that can better describe what people feel and believe and the word fake demeans the actual real stuff that happens.

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Your not talking about our own “warm and prickley” are you? :slight_smile:

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I thought it was funny how Ted Dibiase was always booked to stay in the nicest suites and given first class plane tickets to maintain his “Million Dollar Man” persona in public.

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but he is a millionaire!! don’t be telling me Virgil wasn’t his real-life bodyguard!!! I can’t hear of it…