Tails, definitely. I hope it’s a joke.
It’s almost as if many of the stories and characters in the Hebrew and Christian bibles, including Jesus, are in the Koran, or that Jesus is revered as a prophet in Islam!
Wrong. That premise has already been established as false right here in this thread. Go back and read the whole thread.
You got that completely backwards. The exact contrary of what you said is the truth.
Wrong as can be. Have you ever listened to Muslims at all? I don’t think you have. Muslims are more than happy to volunteer that information to anyone who’ll listen. They own it gladly.
The ignorance displayed in the above quotes is part of the problem. Much worse than simple ignorance is this blatant copropoesis. Expect to get called on it by people who actually know about the subject.
My point was that one can worship the same God but not agree with everything some other religion or sect thinks about that God. Apparently the Koran says the Jews WERE chosen but aren’t any more. Whatever, I won’t quibble. I stand corrected, thanks.
A Jew looks at the history of the Jewish people, centuries of persecution, wandering in exile, and says, “G-d, choose someone else!”
The Christians and Muslims say, "Oh, he did!"
Then the Christians and Muslims look at each other and start fighting over who is the actual Chosen People of the new dispensation.
That’s not a true statement.
The Baltimore Cathechism, question 27:
Is the Son God?
Answer:
The Son is God and the second Person of the Blessed Trinity.
Aside from the fact that Roman Catholicism doesn’t represent all of Christianity, this Cathetchism doesn’t quite say “Jesus is God.”
I’m sure you know that the above doesn’t mean that Jesus an God are exactly the same thing.
Right, they’re talking about God’s other son, Marvin.
ETA: also see John 1:1.
The Baltimore Cathechism, question 27:
Is the Son God?
Answer:
The Son is God and the second Person of the Blessed Trinity.
Which Son do you imagine that line is referring to, lance?
And while it’s true that Roman Catholicism does not represent all of Christianity, you said:
So did you mean, “There are some Christian faiths that do not consider Jesus to be God, while others do?”
This is totally incorrect.
I would not be surprised if 90% of all Christians belong to denominations which believe that Christ is God.
Denominations believing that Christ is God include:
Roman Catholic
Lutheran
Baptist
Methodist
Eastern Orthodox
Presbyterian
Anglican
Evangelical
See cites:
Christian Denominations: Beliefs and Theology: Comparison Chart
I’m curious to learn which flavor of Christians lance was picturing.
We’re off track here though. I said “Jesus,” not Christ. The historical Jesus wasn’t God, he was the “song of God” until he went off and got himself killed and ascended to heaven or whatever. Then the Christians had to figure out what he was so they came up with this Trinity thing and all that.
I’m talking about Jesus, the living guy, who is a prophet according to Muslims. That doesn’t conflict (much).
In any event, it still doesn’t matter - two (or three) religions can worship the same God but not have the same beliefs about that God.
The only thing that you are missing is that Islamophobia taints interpretation, and what we are dealing with here is an interpretation, a choice, made by the specific individuals at Wheaton College.
So, for example, the USA TODAY notes:
Also of value is the Christianity Today opinion piece found here in which Miroslav Volf, professor of theology at Yale Divinity School, argues …
The current leadership of Wheaton College disagrees, dismissing the Pope, the Rev. Billy Graham, Professor Schmalzbauer and Professor Volf, and choosing instead the most sectarian alternative.
One wonders whether those who support the suspension would speak with such self-righteous certitude were the situation a bit different, e.g., were we talking of a young professor suspended in the early 30’s for wearing the Star of David and asserting solidarity with European Jewry because ‘we all worship the same God.’
Kol HaKavod for your thread.
L’Shalom
JS
There is no distinction between “Jesus” and “Christ”. “Jesus Christ” is the traditional full name.
According to the majority and mainstream Christian doctrine cited in my previous post the historical Jesus Christ was both God and man.
What Nelson Pike (and others) said.
If you need a cite:
[QUOTE=Wikipedia]
The Incarnation in traditional Christianity is the belief that the second person of the Trinity, also known as God the Son or the Logos (Word), “became flesh” by being conceived in the womb of Mary, also known as the Theotokos (Birth-giver to God) or “Mater Dei” (mother of God). The Incarnation, then, is the belief that Jesus Christ is fully God and fully human.
The Incarnation is a fundamental theological teaching of orthodox (Nicene) Christianity, based on its understanding of the New Testament. The Incarnation represents the belief that the Son of God, who is the non-created second hypostasis of the triune God, took on a human body and nature and became both man and God.
[/QUOTE]
The Gospels (John in particular) are quite clear that that same entity is God, always has been God, and always will be God, both while He was incarnate, and before and after. Now, I’m sure there are some small, obscure sects somewhere which call themselves Christian but reject the Gospel of John, but for the vast majority of Christians, the distinction you’re claiming does not exist.
Preaching aside, how is this relevant?
This is getting off topic but it relates the same issue Chief Pedant talks about above (in support of Wheaton’s actions).
No mainstream Christian considers God, Yaweh and Allah to be LITERALLY DIFFERENT entities, anymore than they consider the Jesus that was born to Mary to be a different entity to the Jesus who is the son of God and part of the trinity (though thelatter distinctionhas been a cause for some dispute in the church).
An analogy would saying “Everyone thought Joe Bloggs was a kind family man and pillar of the community, but when police searched his basement a very different Joe Bloggs was revealed”. We don’t literally mean there are LITERALLY two different Joe Bloggs, just that his neighbours and family associate very different characteristics with Joe Bloggs than the police searching his basement.
Not for Muslims.
Okay, I guess my bias against actually believing this stuff is showing. My overall point was that Muslims can worship God, and revere Jesus, just fine without having to be Christians.
Unitarians come to mind. Small, but not obscure. In any event, I’ve already explained.