Professors who assign group work: how would you handle this?

In My Humble Opinion
1

I’m a straight-A student in my college program. When I am assigned group work, I try pretty hard to choose group members who can hold their own. That tends to work pretty well.

But sometimes professors assign a group project on the first day of the semester, and you choose your group by topic, not by individuals. That’s what’s happened to me in one class.

I’ve got four group members (not counting myself). One will do great work, I’m sure of it. A second will do serviceable work. The third can barely write a coherent sentence and is likely to flub up her section of the presentation. And the fourth is a waste of skin: he’s just emailed us his section of our presentation, and it consists of, I’m not making this up, four webpages that he sent as attachments. Not webpages he created, just html documents from portal sites like about.com that he saved and then mailed out. No analysis, no synthesis, just pages with broken links. I’ll be surprised if it took him ten minutes to do.

I don’t know whether the professor plans on giving individual grades or giving one grade to all members of the group. If it’s the former, cool: it’ll be very clear which portions of the project we each worked on, and I’ve got no problem with it.

If the latter, not so cool: I’m overwhelmed right now with projects, but if I have to write the materials for group members 3 and 4, I’ll do that, hating the professor all the way.

My question: if you teach a class, how would you respond to a student asking a question about group work grades? Would you be grateful for the heads-up, or would you consider the student a lowlife snitch and asskisser?

Daniel

2

I occasionally asked to be able to do group projects solo in HS/College. Sometimes they let me do it, sometimes not. When they did, it was almost always easier to just do it all than to deal with a disfunctional group–but not as easy as dealing with a group that had at least two competent members.

In your case, I’d get the other “good work” member to help you cover the slack, or else get the prof to commit to individual grading.

As an instructor, I’ve never had a student ask about it, but I’ve fairly often (maybe once a class or so) had one just do the work solo.

I understand that groups can be a challenge when they’re made up of people of differing motivations (much less abilities). I’d be less sympathetic if people picked their own groups, but in a case such as you describe I certainly wouldn’t hold it against you to ask about it.

The real problem answering this is that profs themselves are individuals, and no polling of the rest of us is likely to successfully predict what YOUR prof will feel about it.

3

I think you should ask the professor, sooner rather than later, being specific about the problem and asking what s/he would like you to do.

One thing to consider is that a member who doesn’t write well or present well but is willing to work hard for the group may be able to contribute in other ways.

As for your deadbeat, a clear standard set by the whole group may be helpful.

4

I suspect if you approach the prof in a non-accusatory way, he or she will know exactly what’s going on. I wouldn’t think much of a teacher who didn’t take this into account, which is not to guarantee that they will.

5

Definitely talk to the professor about this now. Unless he or she is brand new, s/he’s run into this before and should have a way to handle it. I would definitely want to know if this were my class.

I agree with the previous suggestion of making it non-accusatory. At worst, you’ll find out how the grading is going to work and know whether you have to help take up the slack for #4.

See if #3 has any skills that she can contribute (editing/adding graphics/dunno what else). Is it possible she just needs more direction than she’s getting?

Good luck!

GT

6

As the previous posts have suggested - talk to the professor now. This is a common issue with group assignments. You may get a sympathetic hearing, or you may not. It’s worth trying.

It’s for reasons such as those you’ve outlined that I now refuse to enrol in any subject that includes group assessment. I make this very clear to the lecturers too.

7

Had you come to me with what you wrote in your OP I would have spoke to you about the group dynamic, and how when you get to the “outside” “real world” you sometimes do not get to choose who you work with on what project. And most likely, told you to work a solution through with what you have been given.

Then again, if the assignment was not group specific, I may grant that you can work on it solo… Depends what the assignment was.

Is the prof. looking for group cohesion or are they results oriented?

8

Oh my gosh, but that’s condescending! I’ve been working in the “outside” “real world” for many years. I’ve had to deal with all sorts of coworkers. On the rare occasions when I’ve had coworkers this lazy, I’ve gotten their ass fired. Please reconsider your approach to students who have such problems.

Daniel

9

I’m no longer teaching, but when I did, I NEVER made group assignments for exactly the reasons you have listed. I understand the part about teaching teamwork, blah, blah, blah, but at least one student in the group ends up “coasting” their way to a good grade and that’s unfair to the good students.

That said…

No, I would be grateful for the heads-up and would keep a closer eye on how the groups were doing.

But, that’s just me.

10

Most of the group projects I did in grad school got one grade for the entire project. However, in every one, we were asked to rate the contributions of our team members.

I think it would be fair to ask your professor what his plans are. You should be forewarned that many professors react the way Phlosphr did. They want to see how you work to resolve group conflicts on your own.

It is a bit of an ivory tower view of how “the real world” works. Sure, I may not be able to fire someone who’s slacking off on my project, but I can sure as hell go to their supervisor or let others know that the project is running behind because they’re not carrying their weight. It’s kind of a last resort (you do want to make a good effort to fix the problem before going that far), but everyone knows it’s an option that’s out there.

If you get the “make it work” type answer, maybe you can position it as you’re asking your professor for guidance. Make him come up with suggestions on how to get work out of your weaker members. In “the real world” people go to supervisors for guidance all the time. That’s what you’re doing.

11

You did not indicate in your OP that you are someone who has been in the working world and outside of college for very long. If you feel like hating a professor for making your life more difficult due to work load and group dynamics, then that’s fine. However, it is of my opinion that making good with what you’ve got is quite simply the way life works sometimes, regardless of age and how many classes you are taking.

12

You get to choose your group members? Most of the times I’ve had to do groupwork the members are randomly placed. There is always one in every group who will not do their fair share. I have taken both routes: Talked to the prof (who didn’t do much about it, but I let him know how I felt), and have taken up the extra work myself or with another group member. Unless the majority of your grade depends on groupwork, it shouldn’t affect your final grade - it has never brought mine down. It is frustrating, and I can totally understand that.

Some profs let you ‘grade’ group members after the project is compled - that is nice, because then you can let them know who did and didn’t pull their own weight.

13

I don’t especially feel like hating a professor for making my life more difficult, but I would make the professor’s life more difficult in turn: when I write professor evaluations, I am always very specific in both praise and criticism, and I’ve talked delicately with heads of departments about professors who adopt sub-par pedagogical techniques. Grading student A for the work of student B is a sub-par pedagogical technique–and excuses about how you’re trying to teach the way the real world works really just demonstrate how long it’s been since you’ve been in the real-world, where slackers get fired.

Thanks, folks, for the advice (even yours, Philosophr, although I think I’ll find this professor more reasonable); I’ll be talking with the professor tomorrow about it.

Daniel

Daniel

14

I’ve only had one group project so far in college in which we were assigned to groups randomly. But it worked out great. It was for my Communications class. It was a fun assignment (develop a TV show premise, cast it, pitch it to the cable network you think is best and explain why using terms we learned in class). It took work, but we had the best TV premise in the class (and no I am not saying that because it was my idea, the others were just stupid or blatant ripoffs from existing shows) and we were all into it. We got the highest grade out of the whole class of 300 students. A+.

But I am aware it does not always work that way. We all received the same grade, but we got to evaluate our team members. The only blah thing that happened was one girl missed one of our group meetings but she turned in her Powerpoint stuff and essay stuff the next day, so it didn’t really matter.

I really hate group projects though. My GPA is important, and I do not appreciate having to rely on others concerning grades.

Just talk to your prof like most of the people on this thread have said. Most profs seem to be receptive to valid student concerns. And the ones that don’t are just a-holes, IMO.

15

Well, let me say first that I never assigned group work. I had to keep a 3.5 in college or I was out on my butt – and I went to a traditional school that didn’t play around with group assignments or “peer review” or other such approaches – so I have a visceral aversion to group assignments. There were no group assignments in grad school either, til I went back for a B-school degree, but everyone was super sharp and motivated in that program, so no problems.

Which is all to say, I may not be the best qualified to answer, but that said…

You’re always better off speaking up sooner rather than later.

But for God’s sake… don’t whine.

Explain your concerns very matter-of-factly. Don’t appear to be slamming the other students. Explain your concerns about your grade, and ask what the impact of other students’ performance may be on your grade.

PS: I hate hearing stories like this because it just reconfirms my hatred for this kind of teaching.

16

Yeah, but that’s closing the barn door a little too late. It may make you feel better, but it doesn’t change your grade.

And unless the department has a policy against this type of assignment, speaking with a department head is not likely to make much difference. Department heads come and go.

17

Btw, if your meeting w/ the prof doesn’t go so well, keep this strategy in mind…

If you’re stuck with this group, and you have any flexibility in organizing your paper or presentation, set it up so each person’s contribution is directly attributable.

For example, divide the paper or presentation into discreet sections, in which everyone must participate, with each one responsible for his/her own section. Certainly, the other sharpies have figured out the situation by now, too. The slackers will not be able to prevent y’all from engineering things this way if you stick together. If they suggest that, well, they’re not very good at writing or speaking, so they’ll research and y’all present or write, just overrule them.

18

This post has devolved into a huge hijack, but I need a little catharsis right now, so skip it if you want or don’t, but I’m going to post it for my own mental health. Thanks for understanding.

[hijack]

And how is the professor actually teaching the student to deal with that? Just telling him to suck it? Here’s a much quicker way to teach about the real world:

“Hey Left Hand of Dorkness, in the so-called real world, which by the way is actually a big myth promulgated by educators, half-wits, and coffee advertisers*, you are going to get stuck with worthless fuckers who’ll screw you over by being lazy, dishonest, stupid, or otherwise. Get it? Since you’re at least as smart as a bonobo, I’m sure the lesson is now clear.”

Ta-da! Lesson learned.

Now how about the professor get back to his job of teaching the subject and not what he thinks the so-called real world may be. Oh, wait, he’s “been in the real world”? How much of it? Let me guess, does he also think that by turning a wrench on a production line he knows how a factory works?

So let’s think about this: is the course an economics course wherein you are learning about free-riding and methods for dealing with it? Is the course social psychology wherein you are learning about the great experiments arising from the Kitty Genovese murder? Does the course explicitly teach you how to make groups effective, and this is an exercise in applying what you’ve learned? If not, then the “real world” arguments break down, and the nonsense that it is becomes obvious.

You know that even in court, if someone fucks you over on a group project, you can often get a second chance, time extension, or other consideration! This myth about the real world may be a nice fiction to scare children, but it isn’t even remotely true. So don’t let anybody railroad you on the real-world argument. If you want, I can write a discourse about how multimillion-dollar developments are often held up by the most stupid stuff, and the reality is that people have to shrug and say, “Yeah, it sucks, but it’s life.” How do I know? Because I live it.

Trust me, that Donald-Trump**, uber-business shtick is not even close to reality. He’s successful either by luck, or he changed his ways and completely forgot. If he tried to pull off a development deal in a real community with that hard-ass attitude, he’d be in litigation long after his competitor started raking in cash hand over fist. How do I know? That’s my job. And shit gets done far, far more quickly by being human than by being real-world. Trust me, I’ve come to the point where I laugh at lawsuit threats. Fuck them if they threaten me. I do what’s right, what I’m legally, ethically, and morally bound to do, and some hard-nosed fucktard is going to regret fucking with my community. Any any victory he obtains will be Pyrric; however, it doesn’t have to be that way, which some insane few seem to not understand. To put it another way, being nice, friendly, intelligent, cooperative, and giving a shit about people will obviate the real-world myth in at least 99% of the cases. That’s a lesson for the real world that you don’t have to experience to learn!

Good og, sorry for ranting, but I am so pissed off today, and it’s due in large part to the juxtaposition of the real-world myth applied in the actual real world vs. ignoring the real-world myth and just being bona fide humans. I mean, I’ve been told that there’s a legal principle that to get equity one must give equity, and it makes such a difference. Heh, in the real world a well placed “no” is sometimes the absolutely best thing a person can hear. Will your group exercise teach you that? Fuck.
*Phlosphr, I know you’re the first, so you know I’m not calling you a half-wit. The jury is still out on coffee advertiser, though. :stuck_out_tongue:

**I’m actually generalizing on what very little I know about Trump. I sincerely apologize to Mr. Trump if I am mischaraterizing his M.O. Please accept my apology for any error on my part. Indeed, didn’t he fire some slob for fucking over some other person? I can’t remember.

[/hijack]

Yeah, group projects suck. Best of luck. Thanks for letting me get all that off my chest. :slight_smile:

19

Of the two that I can remember, one group worked out OK and the other was horrible.

The first was for a Communications class. Some people in the group did more than others, but overall it was OK. A couple of us ended up doing most of the work but it worked out.

I had another group project in Calculus that was a horrible nightmare. It was a whole letter grade and it was a nightmare from beginning to end. We’d go to the math lab and people didn’t show up, half the work wasn’t getting done and one of the people in the group tried to turn some of the work in on her own to get all the credit. We spent half our time chasing her around begging her to give us the work. I felt like I was on Survivor with all the backstabbing. A few people in the group were familiar with the program, but didn’t know the math. Those of us who could do the problems, didn’t understand the program.
I needed a good grade on the project and couldn’t afford to buy the program to work on it at home myself, so I’d drive 50 miles with the hope that someone from the group would show up.

A few of the people in the group tried to talk to the professor about what was going on but he really didn’t want to hear about it. To say we whined was probably an understatement.
We got the project handed in but it was probably the worst school experience of my life.

20

I suspect that you would be quite interested in this recent Pit rant on the subject.