I am just saying that in Spanish, the O sounds not like in “toe” but more like in “awe” (or “eau” in french)
Same for the E that sounds as in “bet” and not as in “may”
“toe” and “may” are the dead giveaways of american speaking spanish.
If someone wants to say Rodeo sounding spanish (i.e. with the stress of the DE), it would make more sense if they went all the way and made the vowels sounds spanish too.
So it is not roe-DAY-o but raw-DEH-awe
(From “You’re not in Kansas anymore”)
English “awe” is very different from French “-eau.”
I think both of the pronunciations the OP asks about are essentially American pronunciations. One is just slightly Spanishized.
English “raw” does not have the Spanish “o” sound you’re talking about.
yes to all. They are all still closer to TOE.
If is perfection you seek, this may not be the mean to communicate it, given its limitations.
So I think what Sapo is saying, is that pronouncing the Spanish vowels “o” and “e” as diphthongs are markers for an American (or English) accent. In English, the long-o sound is a diphthong, pronounced like “o-oo,” the plain long-o sound with an “oo” at the end. Also in English, the vowel sound in a word like “laid” is pronounced with an “ee” sound at the end.
I don’t understand. “Yes” as in “I agree with what you say” or “yes” as in "Where you say ‘does not,’ I would say ‘does’ "?
What do you mean? And how does this reflect upon your point?
Yes, impromptu pronunciation guides are not as well suited for text communication as something like ASCII IPA . However, I’m not trying to seek “perfection,” just a basic understanding, and so far I’m failing to understand what you’re saying. Maybe the English language is the problem.
“yes to all” as in I agree with all your points. My first response to the OP’s question of why two different pronounciation to Rodeo was: one is english, one is more like spanish (which I presumed people preferred to look “multicultural” which is a chic thing to be). After that, it all went potaytoes and potahtoes.
But if we’re going to deconstruct the English “long A” sound, we might as well do the same for the English “long O” sound, which is a dipthong in its own right-- ou. I don’t know the phonetic symbols, but that “u” is pronouced as in Yule. The Spanish sound would be clipped, without the “u” part of the English dipthong (as it would be, again, in most Continetal languages).
Row**’-dee-oh versus row-Day’**-oh?
My desk dictionary (Random House College Dictionary) says both are acceptable.
Got somebody you want to pick on?
As far as I know the cowboy event is always “roh-dee-oh” in English, unless the speaker is intentionally affecting the Spanish word. The street in Beverly Hills is always “roh-day-oh”.
There’s also another Rodeo Street in South Central, that runs east and west near USC and Exposition Park. I think that one’s pronounced like the cowboy event. Obviously it’s nowhere near Rodeo Drive in BH.
Yep, and it will tell you that “read” has acceptable pronunciations homophonous with “reed” and “red” too.
The question is, which is appropriate where?
My answer is: Depends on the natives.
If a cowboy went to Beverly Hills, and pronounced the street (Rodeo Drive) Row-dee-oh, he would draw snickers. If he is sensitive to that, he will call the street the same way the locals do.
Officially, he can use either, or. Hehe. Clear as mud, eh?
Either way, I don’t see the need to get into fisticuffs about it… Live and let live.
So are there other Spanish words with two pronunciations in American English? Is the influx of Spanish speakers influencing the way non-Spanish speakers are now pronouncing Spanish words?
“Now”, as in “within the last 15 years”? Nope.
The Row-dee-oh/row-Day-oh “controversy” has been around for quite a while. (My dictionary was printed in 1982…)
My dictionary, printed for American consumption, even has a diagram of the USA, with regional dialects highlighted on it. (Northern, Midland, Highland Southern, Coastal Southern, New York. Hehe.)
There are differences between American and British English, too. All part of the same (regional dialect) “issue”.
Well, there are fewer folks saying things like “I’ll have a tayco” these days. But we’re somewhat conflicted, especially in CA, as to whether we Angilcize or not. It’s Cabrillo College in Aptos, (pronounced Cabriyo) but Cabrillo Beach (pronounced like the cleaning bad) down near LA. The city of San Jose now writes its name as San José, but most people still say something like “san-uh-zay” (not a noticible accent on any of the syllables). Oftentimes you’ll hear newscasters with Spanish last names pronounce their own names as it would be in Spanish (“This is Mah-REE-ah Ee-no-HO-sah, reporting from Valley Fair Shopping Center”).
Yes, all true. But I was wondering WHY it’s pronounced differently depending on where you are geographically… I guess you all missed the Entourage episode where it was said.
Johnny Drama: Ma’am I think you mispronounced it. It’s “Row-DAY-oh”.
Woman: Oh no, when your south of XX-street it’s pronounced “Row-de-oh”.
I’m aware that it can be pronounced two different ways depending on your mother language. But why would geography determine how you would pronounce it? From what I understand, south of the nicer part of beverly hills isn’t a predominantly hispanic, but rather, a black neighborhood (like it was in entourage).
I assume that ro-DAY-oh sounds more upscale and ROW-de-oh sounds more downmarket.
More on the Anglicization issue… In the city of San Pedro (near LA), all the locals pronounce it San PEE-dro (or just PEE-dro, as in PEE-dro High). But almost anyone else in the state, having not heard that local pronunciation, will call it San PAY-dro.
Is “Contra Costa County” pronounced CAHN-tra CAH-stah county or CONE-tra COE-stah county?
My favorite, though, is how people like to say “no problemo”, not realizing that the word is actually “problema”.
I think this was a joke to the effect of “You fancy-shmancy Hollywood metrosexuals might affect a Spanishized pronunciation, but the the good old working-class folks around here are going to pronounce it the good old American way.”
In California we pronounce the “o” sound in toe and rolling the same.
I’ve never heard it pronounced San Peedro, but I don’t know anyone who actually lives in San Pedro. The radio traffic reporters use the Spanish pronounciation.
The first one. Like in bon-bon, Tom, Mom, or gone. That’s how caucasians say it, anyway. But I’ve heard the “a” in El Sobrante (a town in Contra Costa County) both as the vowel sound in “Mom” and the sound in “Dad”.