I suspect that this is a thing about which people “know with their head” that it’s just a variant pronunciation; but they “feel with their gut” – the part of them tending toward intolerance and bigotry – that the other-than-theirs pronunciation sounds pretentious and otherwise generally prattish. I’d question whether wolfpup would actually say in real life re the “pecan” thing, what he thinks of saying – he’d just like to do so?
Right on both counts (thank you!) That bit of the movie was certainly about people trying to sort other people into ‘upper or lower’ class categories by a pronunciation, so …kinda on-topic.
Though I can’t remember which pronunciation (“Stahd” versus “G-stahd”) was considered U and which non-U.
“U” and “non-U” of course refer to British English:
U and Non-U, 60 years on: Is the English language still full of pitfalls?
The concept of people trying to sound U and thereby engendering annoyance in their listeners does seem relevant, here.
That’s standard Arkie - as in “bedroom suit.” Made me crazy when I moved here.
A bit off-topic, but this reminds me of something I heard used to be a “thing” (and perhaps isn’t, anymore): the term properly used to refer to the color of coats worn to hunt foxes. Supposedly it was “pink” until the plebes started to say “pink,” whereupon it became “red.” Then there was some switching back and forth, over a period of years, in an attempt to leave the plebes in the dust.
Funny thing, hierarchy.
The same aunt/aunt question arises in Canada as well, and the Canadian contingent of the “aunt and ant don’t rhyme” group says [ɔnt], at least as far as I can discern. Maybe I just don’t discern real good. 
I did a quick search and no one seems to have said this one yet:
“Croissant”
I once tried to order one in a bakery by asking for it with the French pronunciation. He clarified “you mean a [english speaking pronunciation of] croissant?”
I just said yes and left immediately after I got it.
Kroyssent, maybe? What even IS an English pronunciation of croissant? All I’ve heard here is kreSONT, which I guess is trying to avoid the tricky bit of the French pronunciation.
First syllable rhyming with “ham”? Yes. Older generations 100%, youngest generation might not all agree.
Also the same effect on pasta, Mazda (they can’t use the Mawzda commercials from the US, have to make new ones), and - with the generation before mine - Mexican food includes tackos.
I grew up in the UK, knowing it with a French(ish) sort of pronunciation. KWASSong, kind of thing. French with an English accent, I guess you could say. I had no idea anyone said it any different, till it turned up on American food shows.
But then I encountered a conversation on social media (between Brits) where someone was deriding that pronunciation as really pretentious. Admittedly, others were incredulous and wondered how else it was possible to say it - I never found out - but still, it means there must be some sort of alternative in British English!
:smack:
You’re right, of course. Thanks.
I don’t think “an hotel” is widespread in UK English. I don’t use it and my wife doesn’t (we’re both from the north-east) I did a quick show of hands of the people around me at work, (six people all south-eastern) and all of them use “a hotel”.
If you are from Yorkshire then I can hear that initial “h” getting dropped and “an” getting used instead but that works for pretty much any word beginning with “h”, nothing special about “hotel” in that regard.
“aye, Vitnery. young blossom’s in an 'orrible way, she’s nobbut middlin!”
I have heard people use that construction in a Basil/Sybil faux-posh way but only for comic effect.
Hotel was just an example; could have been an hospital or an horrible happenstance. It’s certainly not widespread (and I doubt it ever was), but it’s certainly been a thing. The BBC are no strangers to “an historic occasion”.
I’ve just remembered a Russell Kane routine where he says
“HallaPENNyoes? HallaPENNyoes?! Say jallapeenoes, you dick.”
Can’t say I’m remotely close to agreeing with him, but it does suggest there’s a contingent who think a Spanish-based pronunciation is needless pretention.
It is something way down on my “give a fuck about” list but getting needlessly arsey about pronunciation of foreign words is a fool’s errand.
We should anglicise what ever the hell we like in whatever way we like, just as other languages should do the same to English words. It’s all fine and adds to the gaiety of the nation.
Imagine the French being told how to pronounce “London”
Of course, we should anglicise to our hearts’ content; I was surprised is all. An anglicising I didn’t really know about had gained SO much ground that what I thought was normal was enough to get somebody that worked up.
Just to clarify, I don’t think we disagree at all (I certainly didn’t intend for it to come across like that) I think we are both rolling our eyes just a little at the preciousness of others.
Got you! Yes, that’s my thoughts on the matter too. I was raised in the church of pedantry so I have an instinctive feel for what’s “wrong”, but don’t construe it as such.
You know, you don’t have to take everything that everyone says absolutely literally, especially when it’s followed by a smilie and is quite obviously just a joke. IRL, pronunciations that are non-standard to me would probably pique my curiosity to see if I could detect a regional influence and guess where the speaker might be from.
I always pronounce the “p” in rasp-berry. I don’t know why, I just do.
I’m with you on that, accuracy in the spoken or written word is a nice thing to have but as a great woman once said, we don’t need to put it on a pedal-stool.
