So, my father posted thison his Facebook today. For those who don’t want to click, it’s about how unfair it is that other races (mostly blacks and hispanics) are able to exhibit racial pride and racial exclusion but if whites try to, it’s considered racist. One example in the post is how all black colleges are ok, but all white are not. Now, I know that this way of thinking isn’t right and that things are a bit more complicated than that. But I don’t know how. Does that make sense? In that, I know this argument has its fallacies but I can’t explain what they are. My dad and I have argued about this in the past and he states things similar to that post and I’ll try to argue against it but the most I can come up with is ‘that’s just not how it works’. :rolleyes: As you can guess, that stands up real well.
So guys. What’s your view on this? How do you respond to things like this if you disagree?
I don’t know if any explanation would get through to most people who try these arguments. But I would try to point out the historical context. Also for things like Black History Month, point out there’s no need for White History Month, because every month is White History Month. The vast majority of history that most Americans learn is what white men did in the past.
White students are perfectly welcome at historically Black universities. Your father’s premise is incorrect, and I’m immediately suspicious of the motives of anyone who posts (or reposts) such ignorant tripe.
White men, probably not your dad or you, are largely blamed for the mistreatment of blacks in American history. To be proud of being white can be perceived as being proud of all the awful things the white race did to the black race. It’s much more PC to be proud of being Irish or Dutch or Scottish or even English than to be proud of being generically white.
Black pride/Hispanic pride aren’t necessarily race-based…they’re culturally based, and the people that happen to share that culture also happen to share a race.
There are plenty of ‘white pride’ events and celebrations…they’re culturally based as well. Examples: Irish Fests, Scottish Fest, German Fest…etc. etc.
My understanding is that all black colleges nowadays are that way because for one reason or another they appeal to black students much more than to white students, either through location or academic focus.
Racism is like caste system in India. the supposed ‘lower’ castes have been historically exploited in India for generations. Likewise non-whites in the US too have been historically exploited.
Indian constitution till date gives reservations to supposed ‘lower caste’ people in all government jobs n colleges regardless of their financial status…so they may be richer than ‘higher caste’ person, yet they get the reservation which is wrong imo but still it happens and will happen till overall standard(social, financial etc) of most ‘lower caste’ people becomes more or less equal to the rest and at which time, the constitution will be amended and reservations would be stopped.
ofcourse most people in India arent caste-ists (hopefully) , like most in the US arent racists.
Well originally black students could not attend white colleges and HBUs were all they had. Later, college educated parents encouraged their children to attend the same school they did (as often happens across all races). As was portrayed in “The Cosby Show” where Cliff encouraged Denise to attend his alma mater, which was a HBU.
Why do black students choose HBUs? Asude from parental influence, It’s like asking why there’s a special college for the Deaf. It’s not to exclude the hearing, but sometimes when you are in a cultural minority, being in the majority for a change is quite freeing.
HBUs do not exclude white people or people of any race.
The race you were born into is an accident of birth. So does it make any more sense to be proud of being Dutch/black/Scots/whatever, than being proud of being born in North Dakota, or being proud of being born into a rich family? I tell my kids to base their self esteem on who you are and what you do, and how you live your life, your internal characteristics, not on external accidents.
When you are a member of a stigmatized minority, there is probably a good reason for “pride” to counteract the stigma, but I would see it as a developmental stage that I’d hope we would be transcending as a society.
If you have always been in the majority - white, male, heterosexual, employed and healthy - you pretty much had the golden ticket.
But if you didn’t fit into that group, things have not been all that swell.
As a young Gay boy, seeing those first Gay Pride Festivals made me realize not only was I not alone, but damn - there were lots of people like me and I should be out there being proud of the fact and not forced into feeling ashamed about it! It does make a difference.
And would your father be equally pissed off about a camp for people with cancer…are they too trying to milk some sympathy? Is he pissed off about military veteran’s groups who are proud of serving in the military or working to better rehab facilities? And is he equally furious at redneck neo-Nazi groups wrapped in Confederate flags?
There are good reasons and bad reasons to flock together…but sitting in the majority group, it is easy to say, “just be quiet and leave things as they are!”
BTW, let dad know that it is only a few minutes until white males are no longer the majority in the USA…he might not live to see it, but the writing is on the census walls.
There seems to be this bizarre thinking among many conservative whites that anything that doesn’t recognize the uncontested dominance of White Male Hetero Christian cultural hegemony is “racist persecution of white people”.
Dave Mathews Band concerts. Notre Dame football games. The entire city of Boston.
Morally, I think all exclusions based on race are equally bad, but practically minority exclusions are worse. Say there are 10 universities and eight are white only and two are black only. Further say that all university preferences are random. If you are white you are excluded from only two universities and odds are 80% you will go to the one you like. If you are black you are excluded from eight universities and the odds are 20% you will go to one you like. This is how race based exclusions constrain minorities in a way they don’t racial majorities.
I honestly don’t think he knows or would even care that HBUs accept all races. He just seems dead set on all the wrongs that whites have to endure now in the name of PCness. I do remember now, that I mentioned to him once about things like Irish pride and Scottish festivals. According to him, that’s not the same. Because blacks don’t have ‘Nigerian festivals’ and ‘Zimbabwe pride’. Honestly, I’m the black sheep of the family in that I’m left wing and thus anything I say is just ‘liberal crap’ that holds no water. So I don’t even know why I bother.
Yes. Because celebrating being English is or has been a bit like celebrating being white. A hangover from the British Empire (from which Scots get a pass, for some reason)
In the U.S., whites (as a whole) have exhibited racial pride and racial exclusion for centuries, often to the significant detriment of non-whites. It’s not always attention-getting or specifically planned like a pride parade, but it’s been there in the jillions of ways that whites enjoy “white privilege.” Many, perhaps most, whites don’t think about and don’t recognize it, but they do benefit from it.
Carping about less privileged groups trying to say “hey, we’re here too and we matter” comes across like kicking a dog.
The problem with the OP’s dad isn’t reverse racism, it’s being a crybaby.
He (the dad) is perfectly welcome to glory in his whiteness. I’m white, I like it and I don’t mind others knowing I’m white. Good for us. Where the OP’s dad goes wrong is when he expects all the other people in the world to glory in his whiteness for him. He is clearly not happy with the way minorities display their pride, that is his right, so why does he expect all those other races to be happy with the way he wants to display his pride?
Garrison Keillor has made a very lucrative career out of exploring and celebrating the distinct culture of the ethnically northern European, small town upper Midwest. Not only does nobody object, Keillor’s work is celebrated worldwide, and is found entertaining and fascinating by non-Norskies like myself.
Your dad is entirely free to do the same, and if his work is any good, he could become wealthy and famous.
But that’s probably not what your dad is after. He’s probably looking for an easy way to boost his self-esteem by declaring himself better than someone else. It’s easy enough to call this out as bigotry, but the bigger problem is that it’s boring.
If your dad wants to learn and celebrate aspects of his specific heritage, by say, studying German history, or Irish music, or Greek cooking, that could be worthwhile, and interesting to a lot of people. If he comes from a particular part of the US, with distinct cultural traditions that he wants to learn more about, or share with others, that could be fun and enlightening for everyone.
