From later this year, all non-citizens traveling to the US will have to give an address for their first night’s stay before embarking on the aircraft.
WTF is this for?
On board it has always been necessary to fill in the card with this information, but even this seemed redundant- I’ve changed plans several times and gone elsewhere.
But why collect this information anyway.
It is not as if it is difficult to make an internet booking at a random motel in your destination town for $40 and then just not show.
What added security does this give? Is it just post 9/11 paranoia?
If it’s such a non-issue, why are you making a big deal about it? Quit whining or stay home. If the United States is so onerous with its rules, if those rules are so absurd and oppressive, I’m sure you’ll have no problem staying put right there in Scotland where they aren’t.
And for your second trick, you could offer a *constructive * answer to the OP’s question.
Anyway, PJen, it sounds like someone’s trying to address an issue - real or not - with a solution that looks effective but probably wouldn’t deter someone bent on real trouble.
Don’t know if it’s just the US that demands this kind of information. I recall that when I travelled to Canada a few years ago, I had to explain where I was going and where I expected to be staying. That was for an extended visit, though - I anticipated being in the country about three weeks, which was pushing the time limit for the equivalent of a tourist visa. I took a shorter vacation in Canada this summer, and I don’t recall having to go into a lot of detail beyond, “What’s the purpose of your visit?”
If only all people would quit whining and stay home the world would be a better place and there’d be a lot less yanks annoying service people and people on the streets
Anyway I don’t see pjen saying it’s a major hassle for him just that’s it seems like a stupid thing to insist on as it’s the easiest thing in the world to get around if in fact up to no good.
The real question is this info 100% necessary. I filled in these types of forms a lot traveling around the world and a lot of times I don’t know where I’m staying the first night as I decide when I arrive over a beer and the Lonely Planet(LP). I either leave this line blank or just fill in any old place from the LP. Either way isn’t going to help your security.
Will I now be stopped going to the US if I don’t know where I’m staying the first night or will I be forced to lie to them so I can get on the plane?
It does seem like another one of these things that don’t actually add anything to security but just make it possible for the airlines/government to say that they are adding to everyone’s security with new measures.
And with representatives of our fair nation of your calibre, no doubt staying away gets easier and easier all the time.
Are you suggesting that Pitting a rule that will do nothing but place a burden (admittedly a small one) on people is somehow out of bounds? Or is your objection to the Pitting based solely on knee-jerk my-country-right-or-wrong “patriotism”?
Before you get on the plane? I traveled around most of SE Asia and always had to fill it in on the plane not before boarding.
Also doesn’t it make a mockery of the whole thing when a generic “Downtown Holiday Inn” works.
I’m very aware that US immigration people are very serious and inflexible when it comes to their jobs. What happens if you don’t know where you are staying on your first night or they query a made up one? I don’t really want to be put in the position of lying to a US official as that can lead to a lot of shit from what I’ve seen.
Yes, my whole rant was about the uselessness of it.
Say I book a Travelodge in downtown Pigstrotterville.
I can either check in an hour after I leave the airport (I could have been detained at immigration so this gains little.)
Or I can check in later that night- which gives the FBI a few more hours to arrest me. But would I be stupid enough not to check in.
Or I can not check in. What does the FBI do then. I could have met an old friend and been invited over; Decide to eat drink and be merry until 3am in the morning; lose my way and check into the nearby Pigstrotterville Holiday Inn; etc. etc…
And anyway, it is only for the first night.
This rule is causing the airlines flying into the US extra admin.
My question is- what does this rule really do to help anyone.
What happens if I don’t check into that hotel- do I go on an FBI watch list and the next time I use my credit card I find that I am arrested? What are the likely consequences?
If I am a terrorist, I am hardly likely to give the residence of anyone else involved in a plot, am I, when I can just specify a motel which I don’t even need to check into.
Normally when I visit the US I check into a good hotel close to the airport because I know that I need a really good sleep in a hotel with a 24 hour service- jet lag you know.
When I was poor and a student/wage slave I just filled in a hotel that I pulled out of a Travel Guide, and then headed for wherever I wanted to.
And, yes the reply from Airman Doors USAF is one reason why so many furriners see Americans as buffoons.
Silly question - if I were a terrorist, what would prevent me from lying on the form? I could say I will be at the Hilton at xxxxx street, when I’m really going to Bob the Bomb Guy’s house.
If you’re a U.S. citizen renting a car you will be asked for an address (i.e. hotel or motel) where you are staying. This probably satisfies the rental company’s urge to get a contact point should a problem crop up with your rental, but won’t stop people intent on stealing the car. A similar motivation is likely involved in the request of foreign travelers.
So your big beef is that you have to provide the info before you get on the plane instead of on the plane? Wow, Big Brother is really making life tough for you. :rolleyes:
The address request isn’t strictly a security issue. They want to know where to reach you without waiting for you to return home. If someone on the plane comes down with SARS, just for one example, they can notify you. Many, many, countries ask for this information, and they aren’t real sticklers for how much detail you give. Get over it.
Now, if they were asking for a contact address in the US for the duration of the stay (friend, post restante etc.) then I could see some use. Or your home address, or employer or relative’s contact details. Or a cellphone number or even your credit card numbers, then I can see how it would be useful.
But the address of a hotel that you might not stay at. :rolleyes:
If I don’t know where I’m staying, I usually fill these stupid things in with stuff like “Grand Hotel, Main Street, Bangkok” or “Your mother’s house, Kuala Lumpur”. I also once told the Chinese authorities my name was Bill Clinton and that I had AIDS.
These forms are utterly stupid, not just confined to the US, and are merely paying lip service to actual security. They may, of course, have other purposes applicable to people who do know where they’re going, as Waverley says.
That said, this ruling is indicative of current US immigration paranoia. When travelling around the world last year, I got a four-page document from the travel agent on US regulations, and nothing for any other country.
But there is a sneaking feeling as a non-US citizen, maybe of color, maybe a follower of Islam, that if you didn’t arrive at the specified motel, but stayed at a friend’s house, then your friendly FBI agent might be heading you for administrative detention or even Guantanamo!
Who wants to trust the dept of Homeland Security and an intelligence community acting as the American one has done for the past five years.
I must say that before when I have filled in the card on the plane that the though has crossed my mind- supposing that they wanted to find this card in the next 18 hours before I check out of the hotel, how good would their retrieval system be (answer- crap). The fact that they want this information in computer form before the aircraft takes off makes me think that they may be thinking of actually using it.
The radio has pointed out another loophole- through travelers to third countries do not need to provide an address- obviously- but the US system insists that you fully pass immigration- no transit lounges.
So a terrorist could also book athrough ticket and then just leave the airport- no addrss, no contact! What a system. :rolleyes:
Maybe you have some examples where this has happened?
No country, much less the US, is able to follow up on the whereabouts of every passenger unless something makes it necessary. Hell, the US looses track of people all the time.
Then why ask for this useless piece of information?
I think that the general round up of middle eastern and islamic over stayers after 9/11 is a good example of sudden administrative detention over minor visa matters. IIRC something over 5000 people were detained on minor infractions- largely people with suspicious profiles- middle-eastern, islamic etc…
