Rechargeable batteries / inequal quantity or starting charges

I no longer have the book that came with my battery charging kit to quote it, but I recall that it stated to charge batteries in quantities of 2 (2 or 4).

What do I do when I have 3 batteries to charge? My keyboard takes 3 AA batteries, but the charger wants 2 at a time. How do I go about doing that?

What if I take 1 battery from something else and combine it with one of the 3 batteries from the keyboard? They are likely to have a totally different charge to start with, so what happens when charging two inequally charged batteries at the same time? Does one reach capacity first, and the other keep charging? Does the full battery keep heating up/taking power while the other one charges?

What is the best practice here?

Sanyo Eneloop charging system

It will probably over-charge (and damage) one and under-charge the other. Also, if you put 1 under-charged battery and 2 fully charged batteries in your keyboard, you end up over-discharging (and damaging) one battery.

I suggest you buy a different charger that charges each battery separately. I use the La Crosse BC-700. Or just use alkaline batteries in your keyboard. I don’t know about yours, but the batteries in my keyboard last long enough (over a year) that it makes no sense to use rechargeables.

The keyboard was just an example. I have tried to switch everything to rechargeable, which includes many TV, Blu Ray, and gaming system remotes. The Wii board alone is 4 batteries, and maybe 12 or 14 more in other remotes. Musical keyboards, multiple computer controls, camera devices, microphones, etc. - I probably have 30 rechargeables in use.

I’m just talking, in general, about the best practice for recharging batteries when I have an unequal amount or unequal load.

I thought I answered that question, but to reiterate: Don’t mix and match. For devices that use 2 or 4 batteries, keep those 2 or 4 together, charge them at the same time and use them together. For devices that use odd number of batteries, don’t use rechargeable batteries, or use a charger that can charge each battery separately.

you can find smart chargers for $30 to $90 (USA) that charge single batteries, discharge or exercise the battery if needed, do soft/slow and trickle charges as needed for that battery. the charger runs some diagnostics on the battery before charging and you can also do functions manually.

Brands are La Crosse, Tenergy, Maha, Accupower

Thanks for the advice.

Do the different brands charge batteries differently? Or is it safe to charge Eneloop with Maha, etc.?

I don’t know if it’s just a quirk of my battery charger, but if I leave batteries in it after they’re finished charging, then they start discharging. It also requires me to put in either 2 or 4 batteries. So, for the OP’s case, I’d start with four empty batteries and charge them fully. I’d remove the three I needed and leave the fourth on the charger for two or three days. At that point, it will have drained itself and I can keep it around to match to the others when they need recharging.

And, yes, this is a pain in the rear and is possibly not maximizing the life of my batteries. I really need a better charger where I don’t have go grab the batteries as soon as the charging light goes off.

Any charger designed for Ni-Mh batteries should be safe to use on any Ni-Mh battery. Eneloop batteries are Ni-Mh.

the smart chargers i mentioned will do any NiMH battery. as i recall when i was shopping for a charger they all seemed to be similar in the basic modes of use. you want a smart charger that will do a slow charge to be the best for your batteries, not a rapid done in a few minutes charger.

there is i recall a difference between brands or models in a brand in some functions. a channel is a battery analysis and charge circuit. the charger would have 4 battery holders and have 2 or 4 channels. in a 2 channel charger two battery positions would get analyzed and charged together, you could have 1 or 2 batteries in that channel. so a 4 channel charger always treats each battery individually, a 2 channel charger only does so with 1 battery in each channel.

the 4 channel chargers are higher in cost. the 2 channel can do just as well for your batteries though it might take longer to charge your batteries if you want to do all singly.

It’s not a quirk of your charger. Batteries will go down in voltage after charged too long. Some smart chargers use this peak as a signal and allow the charge to back up only a little. Obviously, you are checking so that’s great. Take them out when you see that decline. Last time I checked, WalMart had chargers that took single cells. That’s the way to go instead of matching odd batteries. I don’t like to keep checking the charge as it charges. One time I exploded a lithium cell pack on my workbench. Now I use timer or a smart charger or continuous monitoring.

Is this one going to take care of all my needs?

I don’t want to make a bad purchasing decision here - I’m trying to save the planet one battery at a time and all … :slight_smile:

http://www.amazon.com/Maha-Powerex-MH-C9000-WizardOne-Charger-Analyzer/dp/B000NLUSLM/ref=sr_1_1?s=gateway&ie=UTF8&qid=1285872287&sr=8-1

After reading the first couple of reviews for that charger, I bought the LaCrosse 9009 package instead. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00077AA5Q/ref=cm_cr_asin_lnk

I am a huge fan of Maha / Powerex and have lusted over the MH-C9000 for a couple of years. However, when it finally came down to buying one, the reviews on Amazon indicated that the Maha MC-C9000 took much more user intervention than the slightly cheaper LaCrosse 900. I have only had the LaCrosse for a couple of weeks, but so far I am very impressed. It will recharge / discharge / test / refresh 1, 2, 3, or 4 cells simultaneously, and each cell can be controlled independently. Thus, you could be charging one or two cells, and discharging or refreshing one or two others. Any combination your heart desires. All of these features are also available on the Maha/Powerex, but it only takes a couple of keystrokes to accomplish that on the LaCrosse, whereas the same results could take up to 48 keystrokes with the Maha. The final push for me was that the default charging current for the Maha is 1000 mA, and the default charging current on the LaCrosse is 200 mA. As someone mentioned above, slower is better for the health of your cells.

Plus if you spring for the 9009 package that I linked, it includes 4 AA and 4 AAA plus “C” shells and “D” shells. I haven’t tried the adapter shells yet.

p.s. Now it’s time for the perfectionist in me to come out. A battery is multiple cells in one housing. It is literally a battery of cells. Thus it’s a 9v battery, a 12v battery, etc. However, a 1.x volt device in the form of AA, AAA, C, D, etc., is simply a cell, not a battery.

What scr4 said. Having an appliance with an odd number of cells is a pain, as most standard chargers only charge in pairs. A company I’ve consulted for had a widget that took 5 AA cells, and customers were constantly complaining about the awkward arrangement.

If a number of cells are being discharged in series, then the weakest cell will be flattened first, and if over-discharged it will have its polarity reversed by the remaining partly charged cells. This will ruin an NiMH cell, but if the cells are well matched (i.e. out of the same packet and with the same charge/discharge history) then discharging down to 1 volt per cell is perfectly safe. At 1 V an NiMH cell is nearly fully flat anyway.
Likewise, charging unequal cells in series will mean that one will reach a full charge before the others, and any further charging could cause this to damaged through overheating.

I’ve designed NiMH chargers, and I can report that they’re not all created equal. NiCds were easier to charge as they had a detectable voltage hump as they approached a full charge, and though this hump is sometimes present in NiMH cells it is quite small and difficult to detect, and in some types absent altogether. The best way to charge an NiMH cell is to monitor the temperature, and use this to drive a bunch of algorithms that initiate various charging sequences. Crucially, the temperature monitoring is used to terminate a fast charge current, which will normally cease when the cell temperature reaches about 50 deg. C, or shows a rate of rise of about 1 deg. C per minute. Sadly temperature monitoring is expensive (and inaccurate if done badly, which it normally is), so cheap NiMH chargers will often have no thermal feedback at all and often just rely on timers to set the charge duration. The compromises inherent in these cheap chargers mean that they will reduce the lifetime of the cells.

SeanArenas - I’m not familiar with that charger model, but I can tell you what to look for in a charger. The cell manufacturers recommend a 3 or 4 stage charge. If the cell is very flat, an initial small recuperative charge is applied until the cell voltage reaches about 1 V. Then a fast charge is applied (a current of about 0.5 C works well here I find, where C is the cells rated capacity, e.g. an 1800 mAh cell would get 900 mA) until the temperature rise criteria is met, and then the charging current is dropped to a top-up charge (about 0.2 C, say) for a predetermined period (couple of hours maybe), and after that the cell is subjected to an indefinite small maintenance charge (maybe 0.05 C). This is often in the form of a trickle charge, and though the charger may apply this indefinitely it is recommended that this is terminated after a day or two. A better maintenance charge regime is to apply brief bursts of a higher current periodically - this will keep an NiMH cell happily topped up until ready to use.
This is a bit of a simplification (it gets as complicated as you like), but under normal conditions that’s the essence of it.

As NiMH cells are so particular in their charging requirements, to obtain best results each cell should be charged independently. This would mean independent thermal monitoring circuits and current sources for each cell, which makes decent chargers quite expensive.

Classic NiMH cells have an unfortunate self-discharge characteristic, and the final low current charging step is mainly to counter this effect. However, a new breed of NiMH cells has been around for a couple of years now that have very low self-discharge rates, to the extent that they can now be used in previously verboten items like remote controls, doorbells and smoke alarms. GP ReCykos are good, but the best of the bunch by far are Sanyo eneloops. Get some of these and a decent charger and they’ll last a very long time.