Red Dawn & Invasion USA

I like both movies. The trailers in case you haven’t seen them.
Red Dawn
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_I4WgBfETc
Invasion USA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTHJngZweTg

:eek: :eek: That scene of the school in Red Dawn gets me every time. Your whole world shredded in minutes. Makes me wonder wtf I’d do.

Red Dawn is my favorite because of the incredible cast of stars that were beginning their careers. Patrick Swayze, Jennifer Grey, Charlie Sheen, Lea Thompson, C. Thomas Howell , and veteran actor Ben Johnson.

Invasion USA has Chuck Norris at his best.

It’s really time for a new one to be made. These movies are not that far fetched. Especially now with so much of our troops deployed in two wars. Our police wouldn’t stand a chance against small forces of highly trained foreign soldiers. Sure, eventually our Army would regain control, but a lot of people would die first.

Any other fans of these movies? Any similar that I forgot?
What do you think of a remake of Red Dawn?

Are these movies believable?

Well, heck. Turns out a new Red Dawn was just made. :wink:

I’ll be going for sure.
http://reddawn2010.com/
So, we can discuss both versions if you want.

Red Dawn is a great invasion-of-America film. I liked it when it first came out, and I liked it again when I rewatched it a year or so ago. And we might see a remake of it, only with Chinese bad guys instead of Russian. Evidently the project is suffering budget-related delays, however. :frowning:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Dawn_(upcoming_film)

I don’t know about Invasion USA. I think I saw part of it once upon a time.

My favorite invasion-war-resistance movie (or whatever) is the old V.

I’m curious as to how they can make a movie like that now without glorifying our current enemies. The Wolverines of the first Red Dawn were largely inspired by the Afghan mujahideen, weren’t they? Are people going to want to watch a movie where the heroes are planting IEDs?

I was an extra in Invasion USA–guy walking around plus Salvation Army trumpet player who ended up on the cutting room floor. From this I learned I never want to be a movie extra again.

It all depends on how the conflict is set up. With Red Dawn the initial invasion was pretty brutal. People rounded up, shot, imprisoned etc. The Wolverines were responding to that.

I agree, seeing homemade bombs used in the road needs to be avoided. That tactic is too much like real life.

To address some of the OP, while you may be able to land several thousand crack troops, once the shooting starts they are doomed.

I seem to recall that the Japanese Military in WW2 debated an invasion of the mainland of the US, and decided it wouldn’t be worth the effort. The phrase that sticks in my head was “a rifle behind ever blade of grass”.

And that is sooo true. We would make the Iraqi/Afghan insurgencies look like a trip to Sunday School. Granted, the US as it currently exists wouldn’t survive, but foreign invaders would quickly be routed.

As for the movies, I haven’t seen Invasion USA in decades, but I still like Red Dawn. Though those kids could use some logistical training. heheh

What? Verisimilitude is a powerful tool, and it just - and yes I realize I’m speaking about the Red Dawn audience - cause people to think. God forbid!

If people are interested in this scenario, there was a recent PC game called World in Conflict. It was pretty good if you like RTS.

In one word, no. The premise and invasion plan for Red Dawn is ludicrous. How can you supply several army groups through Alaska ? (The Soviets were not renowned for their logistical capabilities). The US Navy is hunted down and destroyed ? by whom ? the USSR was not a naval nation.

As an illustration of the partisan life, they do much better. From the dialog, they seemed to have take tidbits from the Nazi invasion of the USSR, with the siege of Denver as a reminder of the siege of Leningrad. A piece of trivia, the messages they listen to, addressed to the various partisan groups were lifted verbatim from those used in The Longest Day (translated in English).

As for Invasion America, it is another example of Reaganoia. It is a perfect example of the xenophobia of the American right-wing with no basis in reality. It is more akin to a terrorist campaign than a military invasion.

Lotta people liked Battlestar Galactica, and they used suicide bombers.

How convenient! Cracked.com just posted an article about Red Dawn yesterday.

These movies are entertaining in a purely visceral sense, but they aren’t remotely plausible. It would be possible for “small forces of highly trained soldiers” to destroy infrastructure, attack public monuments and buildings, and otherwise significantly disrupt civil life for a short period, but the extreme difficulty in logistical support just makes it infeasible for any European or Asian power to conduct a large-scale invasion of the United States without either first invading and pacifying Canada or Mexico. No wide scale attempt at invasion of the United States has even been attempted after the War of 1812, in part because of the logistical difficulty of delivering troops and supplies to North American from Europe or Asia, but also because the effort would bankrupt the offending nation without the ability to recover their losses.

Red Dawn was really an early 'Fifties era fantasy dressed up in the clothing of Reaganism; the need to be ever vigilant in case the Reds get too uppity and threaten Truth, Justice, and the American Way Of Life. Sure, there would be armed resistance by segments of the American population, but even absent of that it just wasn’t a practical plan. Even assuming that an invader could isolate military bases on US soil and disregarding a nuclear response, the American military presence abroad would be sufficient to disrupt any attempt at maintaing supply lines. The Napoeonic-era dicta that “an army marches on its stomach” is still true today. And the reality is that Soviets were struggling to keep their population fed and clothed due to poor production planning and couldn’t even maintain control over a small, impoverished central Asian nation that sat on their borders, and were frankly more concerned about the opposite, Soviet expansionism in Eastern Europe being driving by a desire not to export the collective ideology of Marx (which had been politically bankrupt since the mid-'Twenties) but to provide a buffer zone against the cycle of invasion and domination that had threatened Mother Russia since the Rurik Dynasty. It was never a genuine threat to the United States or even her Western European allies. The Soviets barely had the wherewithal to keep Hungary and Czechoslovakia under control, and completely lost it when coordinated political opposition rose in Poland and the DDR.

China as the enemy in an updated Red Dawn makes even less sense. Why would you invade and destroy the consumer economy of your largest customer? The Peoples Republic of China is a Communist nation in name only; in practice, they are an oligarchy whose ideology is no deeper than worship of the all-mighty dollar more vigorously than an agglomeration of Donald Trump, Gordon Gecko, and Scrooge McDuck. Their largest ideological hiccup is the desire to repatriate Taiwan; other than that, their actions are almost exclusively based upon building and exploiting a consumer base.

Invasion U.S.A. is a cartoon; it made no attempt at plausibility. It’s actually a tenuous remake of a 1952 film.

I’d rather rewatch John Frankenheimer’s chilling The Manchurian Candidate than a remake of either of these films.

Stranger

Yeah, the War of 1812 sure proves your point.

Seriously? War of 1812…

1812 US does not even remotely equal 2010 US. For about a billion different reasons.

The only way that could possibly work is if it’s based on the premise that the US is so far in debt to China that the Chinese see that the only way to get back their money is to come in and seize certain parts of the country.

If you liked Red Dawn you have to watch this version with the "special" subtitles for the Russians and Cubans.

The Coen Brothers based the character of Walter Sobchak in The Big Lebowski on the director and co-writer of Red Dawn, John Milius, who was a friend of theirs.

“I myself dabbled in pacifism once, not in 'Nam of course.”

Considering the poster was talking about WW2, I dont see why 2010 suddenly comes barging in, except to say hello on its way to another thread.
“A rifle behind every blade of grass” is just a parody of American wankery. It was a statement that could have been made in 1812. Just minutes before the White House went in flames…

Nobody’s gonna invade the US mainly (as been said here) because of the amount of land it covers and the fact that 2 out of its 4 borders are oceans, not because it is filled with Western Civilization’s Ubermenschen.

I would love to see a Red Dawn movie remake. But the original was so stupid (man, the paratroopers scene at the beginnig…) that it looked like a parody. Verhoeven or Carpenter directing the remake would be a good idea, cuz the concept needs some self-irony. I doubt there will be any of that in the planned remake. Too bad.

If you really think that warfare in 1812 has much bearing on how an invasion of the US would be done today, or how the civilian population of then compares to the civilian population of now, you are… well lets just say you really should do some reading.

At no point was I engaging in wankery. The quote that I stated is often attributed to Yamamoto, but it appears to be apocryphal.

Regardless, with 200 million firearms in civilian hands in the US today, I guarantee you that there would be a sizeable and brutal insurgency. To think otherwise is stupid beyond measure.

And I’m not attributing this to any sort of “American Exceptionalism”.