Refugee Policy – A Draft Open Letter to My Governor, Andrew Cuomo

Great Debates
1

I invite comments on and improvements to this letter, which I intend to transmit shortly. Of course, any replies consistent with the TOS are welcome.

Dear Honorable Governor:

You are not like what I am going to write. I am a registered Democrat since May 1975, shortly after I turned 18. I am the grandson and great-grandson of Jewish immigrants hailing for Czarist Russia and the Hungarian part of the Austro-Hungarian empire. One of my grandparents was a deserter from the Czar’s army and came to New York by way of Montreal in the mid-1890’s. I read with disgust accounts of FDR’s exclusion of and non-action on behalf of Jewish immigrants in the 1930’s and 1940’s.

What provokes this letter is your spellbinding but ultimately false rhetoric in your November 20, 2016 speech and your statements today on immigration. On November 20 you said: “If there is a move to deport immigrants then I say start with me. I am a son of immigrants. Son of Mario Cuomo, who is the son of Andrea Cuomo, a poor, Italian immigrant who came to this country without a job, without money, or resources and he was here only for the promise of America.” I’m sorry, but there is a huge difference.

Your ancestors came without the expectation of a welfare state. Your ancestors made it by themselves, as did mine.Your ancestors did not Skype or Facebook constantly to the “old country,” making the old country’s divisions and disputes ours. Your ancestors also did not constantly shuttle back and forth to the old country.

Today you said: “We have directed the Port Authority and my counsel’s office to make sure we are protecting the legal rights of any person detained at any of our airports, period….We will serve as counsel for any detainee who needs legal assistance.”

I’m sorry, Governor. Your duties, as are the duties of Honorable Donald Trump, President are respectively to the people of the United States and New York State. While my community and an adjoining one are readying to rebuild, each, one of their schools, using proceeds of bond issues that the taxpayers cannot remotely afford, you and other officials are being bighearted by standing up for and defending, with public money, to “protect the legal rights” of migrants and “serve as counsel for any detainee who needs legal assistance.”

This kind of outright callousness to the rights of struggling taxpayers who do not have the money of others to spend on ideological causes is what got President Trump elected. I did not vote for Donald Trump. I voted the same way you did. But Governor, the Democrats need to start watching and listening, watching what is happening in the real world and listening to real people, not just elites fortunate enough to have other people’s money to use.

2

I believe the paragraph that attempts to stereotype Muslim immigrants makes yoir letter easy to ignore.

3

He lost me at the start and even more at the “Honorable Donald” part…

That does not compute.

Oh, just one more thing: green card residents do pay taxes, what an ignorant omission.

4

Which paragraph?

5

I did not vote for him. I still use correct titles even if I don’t like someone.

If they have earnings, yes. But they won’t be green carded particularly soon.

6

You should then call him President Trump. the “Honorable” is still just an hypotetical.

:rolleyes:

Ok, it really does look like you are really ignorant about who is this affecting, besides new immigrants many are indeed green card carriers, some for many years already.

Even the conservatives at National Review had to admit that detaining people that already have green cards is “madness”. You really need to change that letter.

  • A court order that told Trump that what he is doing is harmful and likely illegal. It has to be pointed out that some reports are saying that Trump or others are trying to ignore that order in some places, meaning that just like his mini-me Joe Arpaio from Arizona Trump could be found to be in contempt of court.
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JBGUSA, I want to say this without rancor: your facts are wrong.

I mean, sure, there wasn’t Facebook a century ago. But there also wasn’t Google Translate. The pattern a century ago is likely the same pattern a millennium ago. First generation immigrants maintain strong ties to their native country; second generation immigrants bridge between their parents and their new country; third generation immigrants are mostly naturalized in the new country.

Nativism and fear of immigrants, whether Irish or Mexican or Chinese or what have you, is a part of American history. And it is always shameful. Go back seventy years, and do you think your principles would have supported or opposed Japanese internment camps?

The refrain “this is why Democrats lost” is a foolish and lazy refrain, thrown about primarily to deflect attention from the shamefulness of what the speaker is proposing. I think that’s the case here.

8

I don’t think immigrants are coming here “with the expectation of a welfare state.”

As others have pointed out, the dynamics are very similar to what we had 100 years ago. Opposition to immigrants who wouldn’t assimilate was very widespread. Now people like the OP and me, grandchildren of those immigrants, consider ourselves completely American. So, I disagree, respectfully, with the OP when he states:

I’m with the Governor with this one. I pay a lot of taxes. I’d rather our taxes go towards helping America remain a beacon of hope to those who need it than dozens of other things the money is spent on.

9

So it was great when your ancestors were allowed in but now we should shut the door to people who are just like your ancestors?

And you’re wrong when you say things are different. There were people then who wanted to keep the Jews and Italians out just like there are people now who want to keep Muslims and Mexicans out. And they were using the same arguments.

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The third. In the context of your letter, it can readily be interpreted as an attempt to stereotype the motivations and behavior of Muslim immigrants.

May I ask, how are high schools and elementary schools normally funded in NY state? Which schools do you refer to in your letter?

You should change “migrants” to “immigrants”.

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…especially the ones who have the means to “constantly shuttle back and forth to the home country.”

12

nm, see next post

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BTW, JBGUSA, while it is admittedly unlikely that Gov. Cuomo (or his staff) will have read your post in the “Why lawyers matter” thread (see above) in which you make apparent your support for the detentions, it is far more likely that the Dopers from whom you are requesting assistance HAVE read it.

When you frame your letter to the governor in terms that suggest your primary motivation is to support the wise and responsible use of the state’s taxpayer-funded resources, and totally omit any reference to your apparent support of the EO and its effects on the travelers who have been impacted by it, it looks kinda disingenuous. If it’s your intention to let that disconnect between what you are willing to share with the governor and what you are not willing to share with him slide through, I don’t feel especially inclined to assist your efforts.

Perhaps you could change my mind on this matter by clarifying your meaning in that post.

Perhaps.

14

You’ve mixed up the duties of the respective parties–you refer to Governor Cuomo first, and then to the Honorable [sic] Donald Trump, so your references to their duties should follow the same sequence, i.e., the duties of Cuomo should precede the duties of Trump.

The order in which you’ve phrased it–“respectively to the people of the United States and New York State”–makes Cuomo responsible for the people of the United States, and Trump for the people of New York State. I wish this were truly the case, but–for some reason I haven’t yet fully comprehended–the American people (or their electors, rather) have indeed elected Trump to be president of the nation, not only the governor of a state.

15

Good catch. I fixed that in the draft.

16

State aid is given to districts according to some formula I barely understand. Much of the large expense of the construction, about $45,000,000 for a 250 person school, is to comply with mandates such as bathrooms in each kindergarten and first grade classroom. The funding is not generous and one of the problems I see is the Governor’s focus on social issues. He may well be right on the merits though I personally disagree. But if he wants to be generous let him do it with his money.

Why?

I am referring to the Pakistani drifter who apparently had no means, but was back and forth just before trying to blow up Times Square.

Why is everyone so sympathetic to a culture that would probably scorn each of you?

17

Hold up–the way you phrase that it’s like maybe you think this is a bad idea, that one bathroom per 25 or so kids is silly, and that having bathrooms very near to tiny people with limited bladder control is unnecessary. Is that how you’re thinking about these mandates?

18

Im just sympathetic to people.

19

It’s getting like the old days:

The U.S. Government Turned Away Thousands of Jewish Refugees, Fearing That They Were Nazi Spies

20

This is why I believe your letter has potential but is probably something safely ignored. You should make sure you understand how the funding works, how the 45 million is affecting your taxes, and what the state has done versus your local government (or perhaps the Federal government also has programs that helped with the cost). Make the case this is an unfair burden against the benefits of the new construction. Where are these schools being built again? I haven’t found anything that fits your description.

I read some articles this morning about New York State funding of public schools that actually did make me sympathetic with the burden your community faces relative to state support, but tying the poor structure of state funding of schools to Cuomo’s desire to protect immigrants from a malevolent Federal government turns me off. I live in the Bronx and so it might be a good idea to persuade me that the state is ignoring this important problem and avoid taking the rhetorical dump on immigrants.

As of now, I believe you only mention the taxes to free yourself up to say negative things about immigrants. Is that what you want me to think?

You look it up. I am not impressed with your desire to do the work to influence others’ opinions.

Why am I sympathetic to the American cultural norm of recognizing ourselves as a melting pot and being willing to welcome immigrants and refugees?