Good. I hope he’s okay.
But you’re still a douchebag.
The OP made no attempt to find out if he was unresponsive.
He observed him lying in a spray of “freezing” water without reacting to it. That’s unresponsive.
Right, because the guy was a bum, lying in the yard. Who gives a flying fuck if a bum is responsive or not?
I did.
If someone had said, “Say I fell asleep in 67 degree weather under a sprinkler. Would I die?” I would say, “I don’t have any idea.”
Which is what I said in the other thread. “I checked weather.com and it’s 67 degrees and sunny in Los Angeles. I know nothing about hypothermia. Is it likely under those circumstances?”
And no attempt to find out if he was responsive, either. He just walked by.
How many of those times were you unconscious for two hours being showered with freezing water?
Considering that your interaction with him was on a less personal level than that created by poking him with a stick, and that you believed he might be dead, on what basis do you pretend knowledge of what he might or might not want?
How the fuck do you know this? How do you know that he was not carried away? Dead?
Damn, I hate to be trite, but that blew the irony meter all the way to hell and back. More concerned than you needed to be? Unfuckingbelievable.
Does it occur to you that someone might need help and be unable to ask for it? If I were to see you being assaulted by three thugs, should I pass by because your teeth have been knocked out and you cannot speak? If you are unconscious in a car wreck, is it your desire that passersby wait until you wake up so as to be able to consult with you on the level of assistance required?
Well, no. Because you can consciously decide, for whatever fucked up reason, to do that. Not responding to attempts to rouse him is unresponsive. Simply doing something that looks uncomfortable or weird isn’t proof. It’s definitely evidence that something is off, and it’s definitely reason to try to rouse him.
He should have gone to the dude, spoken, prodded him, and tried to get a response.
Right. The OP made no effort in any way.
jsgoddess, I have to ask, why have you appointed yourself Rigamarole’s apologist in chief in this matter? If you didn’t know before that he fucked up by leaving a man lying in a freezing spray of water for hours, then after reading the information in the MPSIMS thread about hypothermia you know it now. His behaviour was reprehensible and everyone except him seems to know that. So why are you making post after post after post defending the indefensible?
I get your point, jsgoddess, about sometimes trying to help people ends up causing more problems, but here’s where I disagree with you on this situation.
He was unwilling to make a personal effort to determine if this guy was even *dead *or not. The likelihood of him going to check his vital signs, or ask him if he needed help was nonexistent. Seeing that Rigamarole has lost his capacity for very basic human moral obligations, we counseled for at least calling the authorities. Which may not have been ideal in this situation for the bum, but was the best option at the time.
You’re right that I don’t know for sure, but based on seeing him move positions well after the sprinklers had shut off, I’m making a reasonable guess.
To what point? What do the specifics of hypothermia have to do with anything?
Agan with the dissembling. That is not the question I asked. How about you answer my question?
Is hypothermia the only danger? I asked about danger, not hypothermia.
And your child? Is she still marinating in sprinkler du jour, or have you dried her off and warmed her?
Did you really have no opinion before today as to whether lying motionless in freezing water for two hours was dangerous? It’s a yes/no question.
BINGO!
Next time use the stick and make sure.
I wonder why he changed positions. Maybe someone else yelled at him until he rolled over? Who knows what did it. The fact that he moved -or was moved- sometime after you first saw him is still not a validation for inaction.
Maybe he moved because someone who doesn’t have a used disposable anal douche where his soul ought to be poked him with a stick.
Which is why I have said that he behaved really badly, and I think he will continue to try to justify his actions. To me, they have no justification.
Yes, I can see that calling the cops is easier, and therefore maybe there was some hope of getting him off his ass to do that. But in a more general sense, since this isn’t exactly a rare occurrence in the world, I think people should be expected to do more than just call a cop.
If the guy is not responding at all to cold water hitting him, you can err on the side of caution.
Plus, if you suspect someone is not responding when they should be, all you have to do is yell out “Hey buddy, you’re getting wet! You okay?” If you don’t get an answer, it’s better to have someone go up and check on the guy, whether it’s you or a cop.
As I said, you should never do anything that frightens you or that you’re not comfortable doing. That same running partner and I came across a passed out junkie on one of the trails we run. Neither one of us felt it was safe to approach him. There was just no way we were going to walk up to someone who might been on drugs or mentally ill, or possibly armed. We did get close enough to see if he was breathing and we called out to him. We called emergency services when there was no response.
A patrol car came by to check it out. The cop said the guy was a wreck but didn’t appear to be in distress or need medical attention, but he’d come by to check on him again later. The cop didn’t berate us or anything. He said that was his job, to check out suspicious things, and it was the right thing for us to call it.
You grow up being told “911 is not a toy! Do not misuse 911. 911 is for emergencies ONLY!” so a lot of people are more hesitant to use it than they ought to be. If they don’t see blood or witness violence, most people don’t think “emergency”, but a lot of emergencies look pretty damn peaceful. (I’m thinking of a high school buddy who just slumped over when his diabetes cuaght him by surprise.)
Lord have mercy! You need to stop digging. The hole is plenty deep. Are you actually advancing the hypothesis that this could have been an execise in self-control? Holy shit! I suppose I could choose not to respond to being kicked in the head. It could happen, right?
Lying in motionless in freezing water is not a conscious decision. Shivering is an involuntary reflex.
I have absolutely no reason to believe that you are capable of being reasonable. And guessing is not knowing, so guesses really should not be offered as statements of fact.