I went to a tiny college in a country where intercollegiate sports are not of any interest to the general public (which I think is the norm in most countries). There were no divisions, conferences or leagues. Schools arranged their own matches against other schools, some of which were annual events, most were not.
So our Institute (undergraduate full-time enrollment 300-350) would field teams against Universities with 10k even 25k students, with professional coaches, recruitment programs for athletes and dedicated facilities for [mens] cricket, field hockey, football (soccer), tennis and basketball.
I could walk on to any team except cricket, because there were almost never enough players signed up to field a full bench of substitutes.
Needless to say we were roundly thrashed in almost every match. We never expected any quarter to be given and it never was. Maybe the opposition would rest a few top players for our game, but their substitutes were so far above our best it made almost no difference.
I think we might have scored a total of five or six goals in three seasons that I played football. Probably around 20 games. We often conceded six or seven in a game.
We’d have been mortified if anyone had obviously stopped trying to score after 4-0 in football or when they were up 24-7 in basketball at halftime. It simply wasn’t done.
I’m thinking more about football. Running up the score is more of a coaching thing than an individual player. If the team is crushing a lesser opponent and the coach is still calling pass plays and keeping in first string it’s running up the score. No one expects the third stringers to lay down and not play. They don’t always get the opportunity to play. No one expects the defense to let the other team score. The coach just doesn’t have to be a dick.
Two legendary college basketball programs. One idiot coach who refused to stop using a full court press. Sometimes, you deserve to have the score run up on you.
Speaking as a Brit, I would say it’s “doesn’t matter to anyone”. Liverpool recently beat Manchester United 7-0 in a league game, if United (or anyone) don’t want to be humiliated by such a score then they need to try harder. OK, that’s in a top professional league where goal difference (as someone has already mentioned) is explicitly incentivised, but as an amateur footballer that attitude prevails all the way to the bottom of the pyramid. If I’m in a team that’s losing 10-0, I’m going to do my utmost to stop it becoming 11-0, or better still, make it 10-1. If anything, it would be more annoying/disrespectful if the opposing team stopped trying or started playing ‘soft’, though of course this is very likely to happen to some degree.
It’s a bit different for kids - in my 9-year-old’s soccer league, they don’t officially record scores or league position (though you can be sure most if not all of the kids know exactly what the score is), and if one team is clearly superior and several goals ahead, the done thing (yup, unwritten rule) is to offer your opponents the chance to bring an extra player on to the field - this makes for a more even game and better experience for both teams. It’s also a better solution than ending the game early, both for the players’ morale and their learning.
Something I find odd is how commonly British commentators and sportswriters use words like “humiliated” when it comes to describing lopsided and/or unexpected defeats, much more so than their U.S. counterparts. It’s as if the losing team’s character and manhood have been defiled.
Anyway, 7-0 is a piffling loss, compared to the following game whose 22d anniversary is being “celebrated” today.
My thoughts are pretty much the same as you Velocity.
You just never know what can happen even if you’re up by a lot, the other team could come back. You just don’t know how many points or runs you’ll need to win the game. So to have pity on the other team and pull back, no. Also, when I’m coming up to the plate, I want to get a hit no matter what. I’m not going to put in half effort just because it’s the seventh inning and we’re up by ten runs. I’m competitive and professional players are likely even more than me and want to do the best they can in all circumstances.
This is also why you don’t put down a player for doing what he’s paid to do. For instance, tell Tatis not to try to hit a home run on a 3-0 count when were up by a lot in the late innings. What do you want him to do, strike out on purpose?
I believe it was Lou Brock who said he’ll stop stealing bases in those conditions when the other team will stop hitting homeruns.
Now, to put in bench players instead of your starters, that’s the manager’s discretion. It’s not to be prudent and avoid injury or something. It just makes sense; give the bench players some playing time, your starters a bit of a rest. The problem in baseball is that once you take them out, they can’t get back in and the 1% time the other team comes back, you may look foolish and certainly will hear it from the fans.
As for being demoralizing to youth, well that’s part of life. You can’t always win and indeed in life it seems you lose more often than you win. Note that I’m sure it’s demoralizing to lose by a lot for professionals also and it surely is for a team that doesn’t win often.
There’s exceptions of course such as the mercy rule in the WBC. But that’s not really to save players from embarrassment, merely because these are not your players, they belong to other organizations who have invested in them. You don’t want to put in a few pitchers to finish up a blowout game and risk injury, although I think the risk is very small.
Yes, you should respect your opponent, no matter who it is and what the score is. You just may have a different opinion of the definition of respect. There also circumstances. For example, I think it was in the 2007 WBC that Canada was ahead in the late innings (I think the score was 10-2) against Mexico. The rule at the time was, if teams had the same record, that you advanced to the next round if you scored more runs. A Canadian hitter bunted to get on, in the hopes of eventually scoring of course, to give the team a better chance to advance. The Mexican third baseman wasn’t too happy and told his pitcher to hit the next batter on purpose and it started a brawl. That’s just not understanding what Canada was trying to do, it wasn’t a sign of disrespect although the Mexicans thought it was but this wasn’t MLB. Even in MLB, so he bunted with his team ahead, let’s get the next guy out, you don’t hit him which itself is a sign of disrespect.
I was a student at the University of Florida when Steve Spurrier was the Gators’ football coach. He took a lot of crap for running up the score on overmatched opponents. In my opinion, it wasn’t his damn job to stop his team from scoring; it was the other team’s job!
Back when Jim Tressel was coaching O.S.U. football, they were up by 35 points or so late in a game against an overmatched Big Ten team. A freshman substitute running back scored a late TD for O.S.U. and Tressel was upset, apparently figuring the player should’ve knelt down short of the goal line.
Never mind that the kid might never have gotten another chance at a touchdown; Tressel was concerned with showing up the other coach (and probably worried about it being done to him in the future).
I went to a small college that competes at the Division III level. One of the schools decided they wanted to become a football power, so they left and now compete in Division II. A different school then spent quite a bit of time and money to become a football powerhouse, and culminated their MIAC season in 2017 by winning 97-0.
This included playing their starters deep into the game, going for it on 4th down throughout the game, converting 2-point conversions, and throwing the ball. The reason given was they were trying to improve their position for the Division III playoffs.
This did not sit well with the other schools, and St. Thomas was removed from the MIAC. I believe they are moving to Division I.
College football has often pitted top quality teams against considerably lesser opponents. When I used to bet on college football it wasn’t unusual to find some midwest powerhouse team given 42 points on the line, and they’d still come out ahead. But I don’t think there’s anything wrong with running up the score in those circumstances. It’s college ball, for some of those players those games are the only chance they have to develop their skills and gain the statistics that will help them to be drafted into the NFL. When a team is playing an inferior team they have to produce more offense to give their players the work they need. Against a team with a worthless run defense they shouldn’t be sending runners against them just to score more points, but they could allow runner to rack up more yardage to improve their stats. Better if they would work on their passing game if the opponents have a better defense against that. But I don’t see anything wrong with coaches using the situation to train their players against whatever opposition is available even if it results in lopsided scores.
As for the pros, they shouldn’t be babies about getting their hat handed to them. For some of them it means money in their pockets if they can improve their stats.
The first rule of sportsmanship is to follow the rules. Bunting is another word for hitting, it’s in the rules, and getting hits is the job of every player that gets up to the plate. Should you bunt just to break up a no hitter when your team is way behind? I wouldn’t, it looks bad, but then again how much is way behind? Should that apply in the top of the 8th? Just with 2 outs? Scoring 10 runs in an inning is not unheard of.
Correct. It takes 4 years to transition from Division II or III to Division I, so it won’t be eligible for any Division I championships (unless it can get an NCAA waiver) before 2024-25, if not 2025-26. It will be a member of the Summit League in most sports (Pioneer in FCS football, CCHA in men’s ice hockey, and WCHA in women’s ice hockey).
Well, mostly outside the US the main sport is soccer, which severely limits substitutions, so pulling your whole team off and putting the scrubs in isn’t an option.
There comes a point where you are just risking the health of your players in an already won game. Derick Rose tore his ACL in the last two minutes of a game in which they were winning by double digits. It’s not morally wrong to run up the score, but it is bad coaching.