I cannot take your word that similar levels of violence from student protesters in S Korea matched the level of violence by protesters in Kiev. The protesters initiated and escalated the bloodbath that began on February. Police in Kiev were using three truck mounted water cannons on February 18. I’ve seen reports that two of their three units were overwhelmed by rioters and burned.
Read this report in full and focus on the report that six police died after being “shot” on February 18:
http://www.timesofisrael.com/nine-killed-in-ukraine-riots/
Who do you think shot the Police?
Did any South Korean Student protesters shoot to kill
Police.
Do you think the Kiev government should excercize restraint and seek a negotiated settlement with the anti-Maidan separatists in the east to avoid causing injury and death and destruction of property among the civilians that do not favor separtion from Ukraine?
They are the government of Ukraine, not just Kiev. I know you want to make it seem like they’re not, but they are.
I think neither you nor I have enough information to tell the government in Kiev what they should or shouldn’t do. But I’m not seeing anything particularly sympathetic about the separatists, and I’m not seeing much in the way of them wanting to resolve things peacefully.
There is no comparison between the Ukrainian Government and Assad, who just masterfully got himself re-elected with 97% of the vote. Remarkably similar to the vote in Crimea. What an amazing coincidence!
Was it a deliberate act by the Maidan group? A lone act by a couple of people on the fringe? An accident responding to police violence?
I can certainly find reasons for the protesters to come to the police expecing violence since the police had already begun killing them.
The Berkut were killing people as early as January 22, urged on by the Russians. Prior to February 18, they had already killed at least five people in attacks on protesters, typically using snipers.
List of people killed during Euromaidan
Your claims that the protesters initiated the lethal violence are nonsense.
“… not just Kiev” is your erroneous phrase not mine. You know nothing about what I want.
How many Maidan protesters were on the square in January?
How many protesters were killed by Snipers from January to the morning of February 18?
Russians is quite a broad charge. Who specifically urged the Berkut to kill people in January?
Why the parsing distinction? What difference does it make how many were ‘on the square in January’?
Looks to me to be 1 directly and several more indirectly. Again, why is it important how many were killed by sniper and how many were killed by torture or some other method? Simply to make some sort of pedantic point concerning Tom’s ‘typically using snipers’ comment? :rolleyes:
Interesting that after it was disbanded (due to, you know, killing all those protesters, as well as other harsh draconian shit), the Crimean branch was folded neatly into the ‘Russian Ministry of Internal Affairs preserving its old name’ (from the Wiki on this group).
Of course, the PROTESTERS didn’t know or care who had ordered it done, just that the crack down had happened and many of them were killed, imprisoned, tortured and otherwise not being able to protest the 180 degree shift their elected government. But, I suppose, in your mind they should have been pondering this before they decided to get all violent and stuff, and maybe made some pedantically precise persnickety pusillanimous parsing points prior to ponderously piling on, precisely??? 
That is not a reply to what I asked. Here it is again: “Can you find a way to blame police for causing them to do it?”
The ‘it’ is what you wish me to speculate could have been an accident. You know, how fire bombs are accidentally thrown into what just ‘happened’ to be the HQ of the Party of Regions (Yanukovich’s Party) on the morning of February 18. You know, as 20,000 protesters marched with bricks in hand, Moletov’s ready to be lit, to be thrown at the police blocking their way to the Parliament.
And the reason the February 18 Maidan attacks on the police who were guarding the Parliament, it is being argued, is because you are convinced that these three people were killed by police snipers three weeks prior at the urging of the Russians.
See post 3550:
Do you dispute that they are the government of Ukraine?
Is Obama wrong?
.
Tens of thousands perhaps hundreds of thousands of protesters were on the square and you claim/admit that only one protester was shot and killed directly by a police sniper. i asked how many protesters were there, in order to bring context to TomnDebb’s inaccurate statement. This one;
“Prior to February 18, they had already killed at least five people in attacks on protesters, typically using snipers.”
Why must I accept an erroneous statement about ‘typical sniper killings’ in January from TomnDebb when there is no documented evidence that no more than two protesters actually died from bullet wounds prior to February 18.
These two:
No one called it typical sniper shootings. TomnDebb was wrong to do so.
TomnDebb perhaps could accept that these two were shot while part of a protesting anti-government crowd of tens of thousands, but by rogue police or not even government police at all. Perhaps anti-Maidan street thugs. Could it have been an ‘accident’, as T&D questioned me, whether the political party HQ could have ‘accidently’’ been set on fire where one staffer was killed on February 18.
Why must the entire police force be blamed for the actions of a few if it could be proven that it was police that shot two activists on 29 January on Hrushevskoho Street out of a protest crowd in the tens of thousands?
No. And I didnt say they were not. You embellished my statement. You made another error. They add up you know.
But you admit protesters were killed first - before police dying?
I must not ‘admit’ anything of the sort. I have posted that fact from the very start. What is your attempt at making a point supposed to mean?
It was you that linked to a report that states that the protesters advanced on the Parliament and that was what started the violence in the morning of February 18.
Is your source nonsense?
Read the post you’re quoting.
You’re conveniently ignoring a tiny little word before “violence”.
Hint: starts with the letter ‘l’.
The point is quite obvious. The government started the deadly violence and focusing on who you think started it on February 18 is less important in assigning blame.
No Error and no embellishment. And you ignored the question again.
Why in the world would I think Obama is wrong:
I think authorities in Kiev must act with military restraint against the rebellion in the east. So unless Porishenko decieved Obama and the rest of us regarding his plan to peacefully resolve the matter in the east as Putin has been calling for, I have to say that Obama is not wrong:
Apparently you believe an elected government has no legitimate means to repel mob and thug rule from taking over government property and obstructing government business.
Arguing that the government started the massive levels of violence is absolute and utter nonsense:
The two day bloodbath was clearly started by radical extremist armed and deadly anti-government radicals on February 18.
But those radicals did not show up for the first time on Feb 18.
Ukraine unrest: Protesters blockade government sites
2 December 2013 Last updated at 13:01
http://m.bbc.com/news/world-europe-25180502
That is December and it is not all of the illegal activities that so called peaceful protesters were committing,