I am applying to a position in an engineering firm located in Irvine California.
The job requires an engineering degree and two years experience.
Now here is the problem, the are asking for my salary requirements. I have never lived in California, but from what I can tell, the cost of living is quite high. Some adds I saw for one bedroom apartments cost over $1000/month.
Does anyone work in this area? If so what do you think I should ask for? I was thinking around $40,000.
I used to face the same dilemma, whenever I apply for a job. So I started filling the form as follows:
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Salary Expected: Yes
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Sure fire interview ice-breaker … leading to significantly the better offers I’ve ever had. Its hard for them to shake you off their ‘active consideration’ mental list.
There are far too many Baldwins. The only Baldwin I care for is a piano …
I take it your experience is about 2 years as per the ad.
$40,000 seems a little low. If you don’t have any other major debt (credit cards, loans, etc.), you should just be able to live OK on that. Remember that about 40% of your income is gonna be socked with taxes, insurance, 401(k), etc. So basically half of your net income would go to rent.
I’d say ask for $46K and negotiate down to $42K. You might be pleasantly surprised that they take your first number.
I mistakenly asked for $20K as a just-out-of-college computer programmer (in 1986). They gave me $20,800, or $10/hr. I lived with my parents at the time; only after I got the job did I start looking around for my own place in the DC area. I had sticker shock! $475 for an efficiency; not even 1 BR! Where I’d attended college, you could rent a whole house for $150-$400.
Wrong thinking is punished, right thinking is just as swiftly rewarded. You’ll find it an effective combination.
I’d suggest it’s the other way around. They have the job, they have some sort of salary structure and expectation. Ask them to name the figure.
If you’re the first one to name a figure, and it’s lower than they expect, they’ll take it, and you’ve screwed yourself. If it’s higher than what they expect, they view you as greedy and you put the hiring at risk.
Let them go first, and then consider whether you can live with what they name.
One exceptions: if you are coming from a current job, it is reasonable for you to tell them what your current salary is. But I wouldn’t tell them expectations.
Actually, you can be helped by asking for a higher salary than they were planning to pay. It’ll look like you feel you’re valuable, and that will make them think you might be valuable.
Your salary requirement is negotiable. The best answer is to give a figure, but say you’re more interested in doing a good job than the actual amount of money.
Obviously, don’t be unreasonable. Get a rough idea of the cost of living and what you’ll need to live on. If you can get information on salaries paid in that sort of job, use that as a guide.
But don’t be afraid to go high. Quite a few years ago, I was applying for a job that was probably planning to go to $20K max. I said $25K was my requirement. They paid me $23.5K. If I had lowballed it at $20K (a salary I would have been happy to have at that point), I’d have been out $3,500 a year – every year I worked for them.
“What we have here is failure to communicate.” – Strother Martin, anticipating the Internet.
Compare what you are making now where you live to what it is worth moving to California. Make sure you compare with possible suburban locations where you might live. The cost of living in L.A. is quite a bit different from a suburb.
I always expect at least a 10 - 15% raise to switch jobs in a technical field. Don’t lowball yourself but don’t be too unreasonable either. I would shoot for 15-20% and negotiate from there.
Good Luck!
“It’s like banging your head against a wall because it feels so good when you stop.”
Well, I’m currently posting this from my cubicle on the campus of University of California, Irvine.
I don’t know enough about your position to give you a recommendation on salary, but I can tell you that apartment rents are in the range you specify. For a nice one or two bedroom apartment in Irvine, CA, expect to pay near $1,000 a month.
What type of engineering degree? If it is electrical or chemical you are seriously lowballing yourself.
I have found that it is much easier to negotiate for a higher salary before you have taken a job than to negotiate a raise after you are already in the position. That often seems backwards to me, but I have found it to be true. The most leverage you have is when you have 0 invested in their company and they have a need for your services. Of course, I have also had my best luck in this area whe I knew I had another offer to fall back on. I highly recommend this, if you can swing it.
The best lack all conviction
The worst are full of passionate intensity.
*
This sounds incredibly low. A friend of mine just got a job as an Electrical Engineer in Palo Alto. He graduated last year, although he had worked as a computer programmer for a few years before that.
He started at $85K, plus stock options and lots of other benefits (full medical, etc).
Here in Edmonton, where Engineering salaries are as low as you’re going to find, new grads out of school are getting $45-$50,000, after a couple of years experience you can expect more like $55-$65K. Even 2-year tech school grads in engineering technology are making $40,000, and our cost of living is WAY lower than it would be in Irvine.
Does your alma mater have an placement assistance program? That would be an excellent resource to ask about reasonable expectations (If your university is far from CA, you might have to take the local rate & adjust for cost-of-living differences)
Other resources would be professional organizations for your branch of engineering.
Good Luck!
I hate those questions!!! But sometimes, I’m wondering if they’re designed to see if you’ve done your homework.
Sue from El Paso
Experience is what you get when you didn’t get what you wanted.
If they ask you should always say you are open and you will accept the going industry standard for that position, BUT you are far more interested in benefits. Unfortunately in the hotel business where I am it is basically a take it or leave it deal but you often can get one or two weeks additional PAID vacation. And that is akin to making that much more. It seems to be easier to negotiate vaction as benefits and wage scales are pretty much decided.
The first rule of salary negotiations is, “The person to name a price first loses”.
If you name a price and it’s too low, they’ll accept it and get a bargain. If you name a price and it’s too high, they can simply reject it, and it gives them information that they can use to negotiate from a position of strength.
You might try looking at some of the national job posting boards like monster.com, to see if you can get an idea of what salaries are available.
Another thing to try would be to find out which headhunting firms are operating in Irvine and call them, or simply go to their web sites where they post local jobs for professionals. This can give you a pretty good idea of what the local market is like.
‘Web Designer’ jobs around here go for $35-$50K, roughly. A ‘Web Designer’ being someone who writes browser code in HTML, javascript, etc.
A ‘Web Application Programmer’ (which is what I’m doing now) will make more like $55,000 - $90,000. These guys write backend server code, SQL database connections, N-tier business logic, COM/ActiveX objects, etc.
You don’t want to give them ANY clue as to where you want to be salary wise. If you’re market savy (check out the job salary links in the previous postings above, or try the Romac website - they’re an international recruiting firm), you always want to say,
“I’m currently making XXX$$$ but I’m open to your best offer”.
you NEVER want to give them a number other that what you’re making. They know that you’re probably making a fair salary (the market is really candidate driven), but you don’t want to ask for something too high - what if the job is down to you and another person, but the other person is asking for 5K less than you? They’re going to go with the least ammount of $ possible for the most qualified candidate. Make it sound like you’re looking for a good, fair offer (like you know you’re not going to let them screw you), but you’re flexible enough to negotiate. That way if it’s down to you and another person you’re more likely to be considered because you haven’t out-priced yourself.