Also I doubt that the small warhead of a Stinger would be able to down a commercial jetliner before it impacted the building. If they did exist pre-9/11 (I think they did) the Stinger-equiped Secret Service agents were for protection against a small, Cessna type suicide plane maybe packed with explosives.
How I long for those days…
Hail Ants, I was thinking of posting the same type of entry, but then I did the math. At the outer range of the Stinger the inbound plane (at 400 mph) is still over 45 seconds away (if I did the math right), so the detonation at one engine may indeed alter the flight path, or seeing the missile screaming toward them (it leaves quite the smoke trail) may cause a pilot to flinch and divert, etc… etc… since I assume the altitude would be quite low, the chances of a “miss” may be worth taking the shot.
“Miss”, of course, means missing the intended target and splattering a few blocks of downtown DC or Alexandria, VA in the process.
So there were missiles on top of WH. right?
During Clinton administration some guy crashed small plane into WH, and from that time on they have missiles on top of WH.
Yes, one missile might not shot big jet, but few missiles launched at once can.
I think they’ve been around since before even that.
So why weren’t they used then? you might ask. For one thing, I don’t think the President was actually in the WH when that happened. Also I don’t think that guy was really doing a suicide run to kill Clinton. I think he may have been trying to land on the WH lawn to make some kind of political statement. There were bleachers setup (which aren’t normally there) which he impacted and then cartwheeled into the building itself.
Also, the Secret Service are not (or were not at least) over anxious to use them. Obviously it would be a huge scandal if an innocent, off-course plane were shot down. Even if it were a terrorist its still not gonna be great PR when it crashes and explodes in some downtown DC neighborhood.
IMO if the fourth plane had made it to the WH I don’t doubt that the agents would have fired upon it. A widebody jet flying low towards the WH like that? Pretty much a 100% chance its a terrorist attack.
No, but I’ve seen aerial photos of the top of the Whitehouse, and if they were there they were pretty darn well hidden.
Everyone is so sure there have been missles/guns up there for years, but there was no word from official sources. Sure, I could see putting sharpshooters up there, but can you prove there were missles there?
NOW the administration makes no bones about it - there are missiles up there. Now I believe it.
Or maybe not.
A couple of airplanes have been hit by those shoulder-launched SAM’s going in and out of the Bagdad airport, including at least one direct hit on an engine. Every single one of them made a controlled landing with no one aboard hurt. Granted, those were fully trained pilots, not some Bad Guys with just enough training to keep the nose pointed toward the target, but it’s clear that you can’t assume a single SAM is going to bring down something like an airliner.
What would’ve been the on the ground casualty rate associated with blowing up a fully fueled passenger jet over a major metropolitan area?
Broomstick, you’ll note I couched everything I said that I did not have firm knowledge about with “maybe”, “assume”, “I don’t know for a fact” and other such text. This is because I do not know these things for a fact, so I do not present them as facts, unlike statements such as
Please note this is GQ, and factual statements such as your can be easily confused as factual statement in this factual forum, when they are merely based on looking at a photo and NOT seeing missiles. Do you know what the missile case looks like? Do you know how big a box needs to be to put the missile case inside it? Are there any rooms or structures on top of the White House that could house a missile case?
I am not at all sure how you got the impression that
Are you are aware that security measures at the White House are NEVER discussed by the White House? And it would be SERIOUSLY tipping their hat if Stingers were laying out in the open when the photo was taken? Of COURSE they are well hidden!
Please bone up on reading comprehension and writing clarity.
During the time I was in the Marine Corps (G.H.W. Bush Administration), there was one full-sized Stinger Moving Target Simulator on the East Coast, and it was at my battalion at MCAS Cherry Point, NC. I do know for a fact we have people come through that MTS who were not Marines, Army, or Navy, so I do know that SOME non-military government folks were well trained in the use of this missile, but it was not my position to know who they were. Could have been CIA, could have been Secret Service, could have been National Park Rangers for all I know, but the indications were very strong they were Secret Service. BUT I DO NOT KNOW THIS AS A FACT, SO I DO PRESENT IT AS SUCH.
So effective in fact that it will more often then not shoot non-threatening friendlies!
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/02/19/60minutes/main601241.shtml
http://www.globalsecurity.org/org/news/2004/040205-patriot-shootdown.htm
Hope you’ve got some dollars. 
I’ll take your doughnuts. I said MILITARY SAM units. The Secret Service is not military.
But thank you for the link, it supports my opinion that the Secret Service was trained and equiped with Stingers, and if they used them on a visit to Sarasota before the attacks, it follows logically that they would be pre-positioned in a good firing position at the White House, which would ideally be the roof.
Although upon review I see is left the word “military” out later in that post when I said
I was still THINKING military, but that what I wrote can certainly be taken as ALL United States folks, which I suspect, and now believe more strongly, since it seems the Secret Sevice does have them. We can split the doughnuts, how’s that?
No problemo.
I’m not quite sure whether you picked up on the date or not. It wasn’t just any old visit to Sarasota, it was the day before the attacks.
Oh, I saw the date, and I had a tinfoil hat collection, I’d be screaming that they had advanced warning of the attacks, and all that foaming at the mouth stuff. But I’ll take it as an indication of the defenses used in the pre-attack period, not just the day before.
And I retract my request of Broomstick to work on writing clarity. My record of typos and leaving out words that can change the meaning of a sentence leaves me in no position to say this.
Misilles on top of WH ,that is nothing!
I heard from a friend who knows guy, and that guy heard that there is force field around WH!Just like force field on Star Trek Enterprize! Incredible what our scientists can do.
Judging from past accidents where airliners have crashed into urban areas - in fact, just that happened in NYC in November of 2001, flight 587, the Airbus where the vertical stabilizer snapped off after flying through the wake of a 757 - the damage would probably be less than what occurs from hitting something like the WTC or Pentagon directly.
In the past, when a jet has broken up above a city and the pieces fall down the typical result is few people on the ground are killed and several buildings burn down. Usually there are several other smaller fires from flamming debris that do less damage and are quickly controlled. But then, random chance means it’s more likely a crashing plane will hit something smaller than the WTC.
It would certainly be conceivable that a city block or three could be utterly devastated. If it crashed into, say, an oil refinery or petroleum storage depot/tank farm, though, the results could be devastating.
I other words, a lot depnds on what it lands on.
Not to mention our chemists.
UncleBill, I don’t think there’s a civilian out here that could prove, one way or another, that there either were or were not missles on the White House roof prior to 9/11. Sure, it’s logical to have some sort of defense up there, but that doesn’t prove it exists.
I mean, sure, they could have disguised something as air conditioning units or something… or maybe those ARE air conditioning units. NOW it’s clear there’s something up there, before it wasn’t. Either way, the Secret Service isn’t talking - uncertainty works in their favor in this case, with people inventing far more elaborate defenses than might actually be present. Or never guessing correctly what’s there.
Not worth arguing about more than that.
Misilles don’t have to be right on top of WH ,they might be concealled in some other place for example in some statue or underwater in that pond in front of WH.